Forum Post: Will this post stand?
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 9, 2011, 11:36 p.m. EST by FUOWS
(4)
from New York, NY
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
I have been reading all of these posts, watching all sorts of coverage and I wonder - is this site, this protest, this group for real? I mean, it sounds like a bunch of whiny girls who want everything but don't want to pay for it. I read the 'Thirteen Demands' and could barely finish without laughing out loud. Forgive debt? Outlaw rating agencies? Open our borders without restrictions?
I am one of those who actually pay taxes, and not one who receives any government welfare or assistance. I just want to ask a couple of questions:
Who is supposed to pay for all of this, of the crap you want for free?
Isn;t it ironic that the tools that you are using to deliver and spread your message, that they were invented by people and run by people who work for the 'evil corporations'?
Do you not understand that 'evil corporations' were created so that higher risk-taking, collective ownership, and stable employment could be possible?
What is greed? Milton Friedman summed it up in two minutes http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWsx1X8PV_A
I think that everyone involved needs to take a stop back and re-examine this stuff.
“Who is supposed to pay for all of this, of the crap you want for free?”
Well, in a real social democracy the treasury department. That money belongs to the people and it should be reinvested in social programs, infrastructure; roads and transportation. We create a government to serve our needs otherwise who needs it?
Certainly not when you do evoke Milton Friedman? The same Wall Street popped who develop the voucher system to deviate money from the public schools to benefit the private schools? If his theories where in fact viable why the government did not adopt them in our schools. Because I think the guy was a fraud.
Wow. That Milton Friedman guy sounds like a nut on that video. And he won a Nobel Prize? I'm not surprised.
He's another person that measures goodness in money and technology only.
See, the difference in approaches is this:
People like me - law-abiding, tax-paying, contributors to society - we present facts, sound arguments.
You assholes attack people.
Big difference.
Good luck
I worked on wall street creating mortgage-backed securities. almost all of the time they worked, creating cheap liquidity for society. Only when a whole host of factors come together did people start bitching..... same with student loans.
don;t blame one party,
http://factcheck.org/2008/10/who-caused-the-economic-crisis/
If you actually want to learn about the history of corporations, see Corporations and the Public Purpose: Restoring the Balance, available at: http://www.corporatepolicy.org/issues/corppurpose.pdf
But given your link to Friedman, my guess is that you're not interested in the real world.
live in the real world, paid shitload of taxes in the process.
get a life
Get an education.
I'll take a shot at one of the demands-outlaw rating agencies.
Big banks(goldman...) divide mortgages into little chunks. They pay the ratings agencies to give crappy mortgage packages AAA ratings. Big investors buy these thinking they have a 1 in a million chance of failing. Then goldman(knowing the mortgages are junk) buy insurance from AIG on the mortgages they sold. The mortgage package fails, making goldman rich and taking the entire world economy with it. The ratings agencies are the enablers of the big bank shenanigans.
Rolling Stone has some good matt tiabbi articles in it as well as his book Griftopia. He is the best reference for this.
I hope someone else helps with the other parts as the movement needs supporters of all political backgrounds.
"Isn;t it ironic that the tools that you are using to deliver and spread your message, that they were invented by people and run by people who work for the 'evil corporations'?"
Straw argument and therefore, utterly baseless. If not the Internet, television, radio, newspaper, iPod's, cell phone or whatever, they would be shouting this from the rooftops.
Those evil corporations that you support are no longer the protective enterprises you allege. They are predatory (slave wages, overseas sweat shops), exploitative of natural resources and scofflaws as taxes, pensions, and so forth. You call that stable employment -- but this is really indendured servitude.
Nothing wrong with exercising Second Amendment rights......
Remember that an armed society is a POLITE society.....
It isn't the tools but the people who matter.
I still don't understand what this group is trying to accomplish.
FUOWS, fair enough observation... everything under the sun is being voiced. nonetheless, I find the process promising.
I think most Americans would have the same answer to this question:
Do you like your government with or without corporate lobbyists?
Some folks on here should not be asking for hand outs -they make the rest of the movement look bad like the ASSHOLES from the tea party who carried guns to town hall meetings.
Please keep in mind that the so-called 'Thirteen Demands' were just another forum post and in no way represent the consensus of the movement. I'm an enthusiastic OWS supporter, and my reaction to those "demands" was also to laugh out loud.
With any movement, there's always a risk that the loudest voices will be the most extreme, the most incoherent, and the least realistic. I'm really hoping that as OWS grows, it will avoid that fate. There's a lot of good that can be accomplished from the progressive end, but some legitimate policy goals must be articulated first.
Seriously, if these 1%ers are really that evil, we should have the moral justification to get pitch forks and torchers, burn their mansions to the ground and loot their corpses.
Good point, my friend.