Forum Post: Will OWS end with a mass suicide Jim Jones kool-aid style
Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 6, 2011, 11:31 a.m. EST by thomasmiller
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This does seem more cultish then anything else.
Continued from Sunshower's first response to thomasmiller (see below)
Why Iceland Should Be in the News, But Is Not An Italian radio program's story about Iceland’s on-going revolution is a stunning example of how little our media tells us about the rest of the world. Americans may remember that at the start of the 2008 financial crisis, Iceland literally went bankrupt. The reasons were mentioned only in passing, and since then, this little-known member of the European Union fell back into oblivion.
As one European country after another fails or risks failing, imperiling the Euro, with repercussions for the entire world, the last thing the powers that be want is for Iceland to become an example. Here's why: http://www.politicaljack.com/forums/showthread.php?5609-Why-Iceland-Should-Be-in-the-News-But-Is-Not
HERE’S A COPY OF ICELAND’S NEW CONSTITUTION http://stjornlagarad.is/english/
FACT IS THAT Iceland Used Social Media to Write New Constitution http://www.disinfo.com/2011/08/iceland-uses-social-media-to-write-new-constitution/
More OWS News and information http://www.reddit.com/r/occupywallstreet/
AND LASTLY – THAT IS, FOR NOW - a current article in the well-respected magazine, The New Republic Magazine, entitled How Occupy Wall Street Is a Rational Response to a System That’s Failed, states – “it’s clear that for the 20 years between 1980 and 2000 what was possible in theory wasn’t necessarily happening in practice, and for the past decade it hasn’t been working at all. The story is familiar, but worth repeating. We’re seeing not just growing inequality, but actually falling wages and incomes at the median. People are outraged—and rightly so—that the economy and economic policymakers are failing them.
Faced with these realities, the TNR staff editorial on the subject feels distinctly like an op-ed penned eleven years ago about anti-globalization protestors, put on ice, and then re-animated with a hasty rewrite that fails to consider the actual political and economic circumstances.
The notion that Occupy Wall Street is a fundamentally radical anti-capitalist movement is completely without foundation. Not only is it odd for TNR to take a harder anti-communist line than, say, Lech Walesa, but this view misunderstands the basic nature of a fluid and rapidly growing movement. The participation of some radicals in the initial organization of the Zuccotti Park protest shouldn’t distract from the fact that the movement has grown by attracting a diverse set of adherents united primarily by an appropriate sense of grievance. And judging from the We Are The 99 Percent Tumblr, these people aren’t a conspiracy to overthrow capitalism, they’re ordinary people struggling with hard times and looking for answers. The labor unions who’ve hopped on the 99 Percent bandwagon aren’t waging a battle to abolish private enterprise, they’re participating in a movement to say that what’s happening right now in the United States is unacceptable.
Beyond a critique, any movement for social and political change ultimately needs solutions and it is true that some of the solutions offered by some protestors are unsound. This is all the more reason that liberals with confidence in liberal solutions should show up and try to persuade people to champion a more sustainable set of economic policies.
But the alternative of staying aloof out of some kind of fussy disdain for drum circles helps nobody. On the contrary, it’s worth reflecting on the idea that the instinct toward ideological police actions represented by TNR’s editorial has had a malign influence on American politics for years. Liberalism, in its triumphant years, represented the “vital center” of American politics. The silence of further-left voices over the past decade has merely served to marginalize liberalism, creating an atmosphere in which center-left technocrat Barack Obama can be tarred as a radical socialist. The fact of the matter is that the American economy isn’t working for average Americans, and hasn’t been for some time. Meanwhile, the corporate executive class has gotten quite adept at standing in solidarity against effective regulation of the financial system, against solutions to our environmental problems, and against progressive taxes. The time is right for people who aren’t happy about that to stand up and be heard. http://www.tnr.com/article/politics/96499/occupy-wall-street-liberalism-moderates-financial-reform
And another article in TNR on WHY A MAJORITY OF AMERICANS ARE GETTING BEHIND OCCUPY WALL STREET is also well worth reading.
We can only hope so.
Hahahaha.......post of the year
Silly thought, this talk of kool-aid. Just personal opinion, but I think the movement will miss it's chance to have a real impact by letting it's moment pass without developing any real political organization. They could develop a platform of concrete ideas and get viable candidates to run for office. Instead different politicians already in office will give some verbal support but only to keep themselves in power and the moment will pass.
I don't believe the movement should develop a political organization, however, I do see the possibilities of one or more political organizations arising from the awareness the movement is creating.
In my estimation this is as it should be, the voice of people giving rise to future representation of the people, while the movement itself remains unconnected providing a working model of how people can and do affect politics and policy, which is as it should be.
Forum Post: Will OWS end with a mass repression by the one percent
Why OWS will fail
http://occupywallst.org/forum/forum-topics/#comment-172684
SILLY troll, how does a movement so leaderless that it doesn't have a single official list of demands end up having a mass suicide like cults of people who all believe one man is God? See how absurd that is?
MikeyD - If you're going to set fires, why don't you burn down something iconic, like the Brooklyn Bridge or the Statue of Liberty? You obviously hate America anyway...
He should start with his underwear.
No, we just hate what these people have done to it.
So why burn anything, why not simply shoot those you hate?
I don't hate anyone, and we aren't burning anything.
According to MikeyD, he plans on "burning some shit" when he doesn't get his way. Like a petulant little schoolboy...
MikeyD is not an OWS supporter, he's trolling.
I've seen him in other threads bashing OWS.
Thanks, didn't know...
I just want to know what happens when OWS finally figures out they will not get "their way"
If you think that the American People, represented by OWS, will not get "their way" you’re terribly mistaken. Educate yourself thomasmiller; the OWS movement spreading globally, and continues to gain momentum. .
Consider what Marco Rabinowitz, a Benzinga Staff Writer wrote on October 17, 2011 Why Occupy Wall Street Will (Not) Fail
“with the Occupy Wall Street movement, the cat is out of the bag. Were the protesters to suddenly disappear, the operative question would not be, "Why did the Occupy Wall Street movement dissipate", but rather, "What exactly is the Occupy Wall Street movement planning next?" Even if the protesters disbanded and returned to their homes and hamlets tomorrow, the show of force demonstrated by Occupy Wall Street to the establishment would remain evident. Even if the protests ended abruptly tomorrow, Occupy Wall Street will have accomplished what it set out to do: to make a stand against the establishment to show that many young Americans are fed up with the hopeless status quo and exploitation in today's economy.
Furthermore, the problems and issues that gave rise to Occupy Wall Street will not go away with colder weather. Though the coming of winter could signal a temporary calm for the protests, the changing of seasons will not signal the end of the problems and issues. And even then, seasons change; dark and dreary winters turn into hope-filled springs giving way to periods of new growth -- Occupy Wall Street protesters are already planning for further efforts next year with a "National General Assembly" to be held in Philadelphia in July 2012. Any way you cut it, the movement does not appear to be going away.
The fact of the matter is that Occupy Wall Street is here, the movement appears to remain strong & viable going forward, and the movement does not appear to be going anywhere. Where the movement has not articulated any specific demands or policy recommendations, the overt strength of the movement rests in its continued youth and vitality.
While problems arising from issues like unemployment, higher education costs, student loans, and economic disparity do not appear to be on their way out, it is reasonably foreseeable that voices of dissent will persist. Where those voices of dissent now take the form of Occupy Wall Street, perhaps in the future those same voices of dissent will evolve into other forms.
As Arends argues, while segments of American society may be watching "till something interesting happens on the Kardashians", the serious socio-economic problems facing society remain and require resolution. Where the energy behind Occupy Wall Street appears to be generated by issues like unemployment, excessive student loans, and economic disparity, that energy in American society must go somewhere; even if the Occupy Wall Street protests fail, that energy must be expended somehow.
As such, in light of continued youth unemployment, hunger can be a powerful motivator. Even worse, non-productivity can lead to counterproductivity. If our contemporary socio-problems including but not limited to unemployment, a declining standard of living, rising food prices, and exorbitant higher education costs fester, protests in one form or another will probably continue -- perhaps to the point of evolving into riots and mass societal unrest.
If the Woodstock Festival was a mere weekend and we remember it even today, then I think the Occupy Wall Street protests will most definitely be remembered years from now. I think it is a wild stretch to suggest that "[i]n six months' time, or maybe just six weeks, everyone will have forgotten about [Occupy Wall Street]". Occupy Wall Street does not appear to be the entire span of the game, but rather merely the kickoff.
Where the Occupy Wall Street movement may be susceptible to being hijacked by various political factions, the underlying energy of the movement reflects a clear, solid spirit of discontent that will remain in American society as long as the severity of the problems remains. Yes, the Occupy Wall Street movement may have some issues, and yes, the winter may not be the best time of year to camp out and protest in the streets, but there is reason to believe that the spirit of Occupy Wall Street goes beyond the streets of Manhattan. In terms of an agenda, it is not as much about what Occupy Wall Street is saying as it is about what Occupy Wall Street portends for the future. In short, Occupy Wall Street portends that the winds of American society are changing.
If only in an analogous way, Arends is correct in writing that the weather is changing. Indeed, and as the weather is changing one cannot help but feel that we are about to enter a new season in America's history. http://www.benzinga.com/general/politics/11/10/2005093/why-occupy-wall-street-will-not-fail
MOREOVER, there are current and recent examples in the world where people in such movements have gotten “their way”. One such country is Iceland. Educate yourself Thomas
Why the banks actually do fear OWS: They witnessed Iceland (see next page)
It is a valid question. Im not trolling, but being honest. How will all this end when OWS finally figures out they will not get "their way"? OWS seems more like some strange cult masquerading as protesters. Mods, please dont delete this post as this is a valid concern.
it's not the problem of it being a cult. it's more of a problem of other whackjob interests are already hijacking it for their own little agendas,trying to tell the world "they" are the leading voice, and making the legitimate ones look bad. I want to end corporate greed and welfare as much as the next person here, but not under the banner of these crazy anarchists, or socialist communists, or corporation-backed "green" groups.
It's gone from a few hundred in Zuccotti to a global movement in less than two months, this isn't ending anytime soon.
OWS doesn't have a "way" that they want to get, this is about raising awareness. And it's working.
Haha! Curing greed is like getting everyone to be honest. Zucotti Park has proven that you cant keep everyone honest. How many laptops and stuff has been stolen?
I didn't say anything about greed. I don't know if anything has been stolen, how about you tell me?
I doubt it but people can do crazy things when the wake up and realize that they went all in on a fairy tale.
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MikeyD is a troll, not an OWS supporter.
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You are a troll and you called me a troll. So that means....
I'm on here to have productive discussions about OWS. You are on here to make it seem like we don't support the Constitution and are violent.
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Our conversations were about you wanting to trash freedom of speech.
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No, I was standing up for freedom of speech, something that I feel is important.
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I am against Citizens United. No one should be able to buy their way into a politician's heart or use the power of money to influence elections.
You want to ban people from putting up homemade yard signs or posting videos on Youtube, which is not only unenforceable but a full on afront to freedom of speech.
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As long as their families pay for the cleanup, I am good with that.
You know OWS doesnt pay for that.