Forum Post: whirlpool laid off 1200 workers after getting 19 million from the government
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 28, 2011, 8:11 p.m. EST by Teamster
(102)
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Whirlpool laid off 1200 workers cause they only made like 4.6 billion instead of 4.7 billion. While the CEO makes 14 million a year.
Talk about getting flushed.
I don't know the full breakdown, but isn't Ark. marginally a Red state? Where are the job creators to save the EXISTING jobs already here?!?!?
(sarcasm)
Just as nuts after Indianapolis hands over millions of dollars a businessman says he is going to hire 1,200 workers. I wonder what would happen if all of those millions were given to the workers?
Hi Teamster, Good post. Best Regards, Nevada
To get this county going strong again we need to cerate jobs. I have a plan if you would hear me out. Like the tariffs we could use the IRS to charge more taxes to companies that are American companies but build over seas. Example Company A does everything here they pay 15% (let use fake number for easy of explain) Company B has it factory over seas and it customer service there as well let charged them 45% and, Company C just has it factory over seas lets charge them 30%. this way we encourage company to stay here and even bring back there factories , but most important new companies to form here. Think of it this way, wash machine company make a good wash machine for $700 here and another company make a let quality machine in China for $450. but the one in Chine now cost $650. I would buy the better one make here because it is a better deal. This encourages customer to buy American and not just shop by price. Plus this the Government get to taxes from all the worker in the American factories and the Factories overseas no taxes from workers the Government can make up the taxes from the companies. I would like someone to get back with me and let me know if interested in hear more details. This could help make America strong for years to come
To get this county going strong again we need to cerate jobs. I have a plan if you would hear me out. Like the tariffs we could use the IRS to charge more taxes to companies that are American companies but build over seas. Example Company A does everything here they pay 15% (let use fake number for easy of explain) Company B has it factory over seas and it customer service there as well let charged them 45% and, Company C just has it factory over seas lets charge them 30%. this way we encourage company to stay here and even bring back there factories , but most important new companies to form here. Think of it this way, wash machine company make a good wash machine for $700 here and another company make a let quality machine in China for $450. but the one in Chine now cost $650. I would buy the better one make here because it is a better deal. This encourages customer to buy American and not just shop by price. Plus this the Government get to taxes from all the worker in the American factories and the Factories overseas no taxes from workers the Government can make up the taxes from the companies. I would like someone to get back with me and let me know if interested in hear more details. This could help make America strong for years to come
Technological Unemployment
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joWD5vQvkfk
Maybe the government should stop taking money from taxpayers and handing it out to corporations?
Actually.. they are laying off 5,000 workers, or 10% of their workforce. That's not only lost American wages, as well as state and local taxes, but it also affects all the businesses that act as suppliers to Whirlpools' business needs. Like a spreading ripple, it will suck the life out of the communities that lose the jobs and factories. That's when other businesses begin to lay off workers and cut benefits because of the loss of Whirlpools business. I believe it's the "Spider Web" affect... cut a couple threads and the whole thing starts to weaken and unravel.
If we had economic growth, no Corporate taxes, better-trained workers, improving infrastructure, and a more-business-friendly climate, Whirlpool would be ADDING 1200 workers instead of laying them off.
No corporate taxes. Well precisely who is going to pay for the better training for the worker and improving the infrastructure? The 99%, I suppose? If you people have your way, there are two alternatives for America's future: 1) Return to slavery. After all, none of you want to pay taxes, but you still want the potholes filled. I believe that work without wage is still called slavery? 2) Americans work for Chinese-level salaries. And then Vietnamese level salaries. And then Zimbabwe salaries. Oh sorry - only 99% of Americans. I'm sure the rest of you will find some way to justify your already over-inflated income.
@Krankie: 1st I'm not the 1%.
But I'll tell you a secret: CORPORATIONS DO NOT PAY TAXES.
Assume a competitive marketplace for goods & services. In order for a company to employ capital and risk they may lose that capital, they must believe there's a good chance they'll achieve a fair return on that capital (a profit).
Currently, if we assume corporations pay the 35% tax rate, then, in order to put capital at risk (to build a plant, to hire a worker, etc.) then need more than 1/2 additional profit expectations to account for taxes.
So, eliminating corporate taxes lowers the "hurdle rate" for invested capital at companies, which means they build more plants & hire more people.
Now...let's look at how this impacts a $1000 refrigerator.
Manufacturing companies typically make a 10% Net profit (after taxes & all other expenses). They need to make a Net profit of $100 on each fridge. In order to pay taxes, then need a profit-before-tax of $150 so they can pay $50 of tax and keep $100 on profit ($50 / $150 is the 33% tax rate).
So...the corporate tax puts American-made refrigerators at a $50 disadvantage versus imported refrigerators made in countries with no (or much lower) corporate taxes.
In a competitive market, if a company tries to pocket the extra $50 they no longer pay in taxes, a competitor will undercut them to the extent they're getting more than a reasonable return on invested capital.
So the result is a $50 REDUCTION in selling prices of refrigerators.
Who will pay taxes? Under the Fair Tax, there's a 23% National Sales Tax on spending in excess of poverty-level spending (but no other Federal taxes - so no income or payroll taxes). Consumers will pay the tax when they buy goods (including Chinese goods). Under the Fair Tax, we TAX Chinese goods!
But if corporations pay less to no taxes in order to reduce the price of a refrigerator, then that means less revenues to Federal, State, and Local taxes to pay for basic services and infrastructure, etc. Then to make up for the newly created loss in tax revenues working people either have to pay more Federal, State and Local taxes, and/or pay for for-profit services that their communities used to provide. Higher sales taxes will result in people paying much more than what they perceive as saving.
@Keeku:
A 23% Federal Sales Tax (the Fair Tax) is revenue neutral - the Federal Gov't will get the same tax receipts it does now.
But that tax will be applied equally to goods made in the US or imported.
Since the poverty level of spending is exempt (everybody receives a prebate at the beginning of each month for the 23% tax on the poverty level of spending), low-and-middle-income people would pay no more tax than they do now.
And the rich? They've already paid taxes on their wealth. Now they'll pay ANOTHER 23% when they spend it. It's actually a very progressive tax. And makes US-made goods much more competitive versus imported goods.
The rich people who have Government in their pockets don't want the Fair Tax because it does away with ALL the loopholes and tax shelters.
Another thing...only US Citizens get the "prebate"...so illegals will pay the 23% tax - a big change from the free ride they get now.
I can't believe everyone here is not in favor of the Fair Tax.
At this point, I don't support nor dislike the idea of a Fair Tax. I just can't help but feel that whatever they do, the 99% will get screwed.
Chrisp is using the super-double-secret-corporate lingo spoken among the members of the GOP, Wall St, Bankers, and the Corporate world. "Economic Growth" means more "Free Trade" agreements that enable corps to offshore and outsource more jobs, thereby increasing profitability and stock value. "No Corporate Taxes".. means "Everything For Free". "Better Trained" workers means cheap in-sourced foreign work-visa laborers (who are also eligible to receive Social Security benefits when they return to their home countries.) The United States already has the most "Productive" workers in the world. Productive meaning that the amount of Profit derived from the amount of Labor Cost (pay) is the highest.. they get the most bang for their buck! We work some of the longest work weeks in the developed world. "Improving Infrastructure" means handing over of all public services (the Commons) to privatized, for-profit corporations who will charge the communities and individuals for the very same services they used to get from their tax dollar, but at a much higher price. .."Business Friendly Climate" is for "No Rules!" Yee-Haaa!!
@Keeku: I want change as much as you do.
But it makes no sense (and in the long-run achieves NO good) for Gov't to force companies to do economically-stupid things.
Yes, Free Trade is good. It lowers cost of things we all enjoy. We should make the things which make economic sense to make here. With no corporate taxes, more-productive workers, better infrastructure, and rational regulations, it'll make more sense to make more stuff here.
Businesses don't make these decisions without careful consideration. And, as cost advantages and logistical challenges make overseas manufacturing less-attractive, we will see more production return to the US.
But we could greatly speed American job growth with the ideas I laid out.
Ya know.. I can see that the leaders of industry see themselves as creating a new world order where free trade will level the world playing field and make all pay and standards of living uniform throughout the world. And wealth will trickle down and spread like a warm golden shower of love from above. I just don't think that would ever happen. You have to account for the greed factor. There will always be the few greedy maligned people in the world who just don't want to follow the rules and feel they deserve more than everyone else. Those are the ones who keep society from ever achieving it's true potential. Unfortunately, those are the very people who seem to be running the show.
chrisp.. Protectionism isn't economically stupid. "Businesses don't make these decisions without careful consideration."... The sole purpose of a corporation is to create the most amount of profits it possibly can.. at the moment of their conception they hunger for profits ie.. the bottom line. At whatever cost. This is part of the calculation called the "Greed Factor" in common man speak. Any careful consideration would only be as to how many to cut to ensure their bonuses increase. It's a common business strategy. Don't bullshit me/us. How the hell did businesses and communities thrive and grow throughout most of the 20the century with all those pesky restrictions? lol WE did fantastic before republican-created NAFTA.
@Keeku: People (and Corporations) do what is in their "enlightened self interest".
Yes, the mission of a Corporation is to maximize return to shareholders.
But that does NOT mean "scorch the Earth" is the best way.
Today, we are demanding more social responsibility from many Corporations - we are enlightening Corporations that it's in their own best interest to do certain socially-responsible things.
If a socially-responsible Corporation competes against a "scorch-the-Earth" Corporation, the socially-responsible Corporation likely wins, even though their costs are higher.
Back to Free Trade...YES, it's good.
If we didn't allow Japanese cars to be sold here competitively, we'd all be driving crappy Chevys that get 10 miles/gallon.
Corporations (like people) are inherently lazy...they'll do whatever is required to get by...but when threatened/stressed, they marshall all resources and change into much-more-efficient entities.
Free Trade & competition are GOOD. When faced with a challenge, we become much better than we were.
Of course, if trade is not fair, that's another story.
It's not bad for a company to make money, we need successful companies. And successful people. Everyone wants to be successful.. but we no longer have that chance. I don't know of any responsible companies.. I just don't remember any.
Starbucks announced they're hiring more people than they think they need in order to try to help the economy.
I just read today BP is buying hundreds of wind generators from GE, probably in an effort to improve their tarnished image.
Apple just began a charitable-gift-matching program.
Some tech companies require their employees to volunteer in their communities.
Nestle is helping cocoa farmers improve farming techniques which both improves the farmer's income, and ensures Nestle a reliable and economical source for cocoa.
I could go on and on.
Companies just need to be enlightened about what's in their best interest.
Sorry.. I just don't see corporations as the good guys, I know better. There always seems to be a hidden agenda, tax write-off, or image issue involved. There are the few rare birds. But you don't get that big by playing fair.
@Keeku: There are no selfless acts. Not by corporations, not by people.
Acts which appear charitable may be motivated by a desire for recognition, or to feel good that you've done something you think is good. There is always an agenda - a self-interest - furthered by the act.
But just because corporations derive some benefit from their good deeds neither diminishes those good deeds, nor does it mean the company is not playing fair.
and remember.. for the last 30 years or so very clever high paid analysts and accountants have been busy at work in all those companies trying to figure out how to cut "costs". Labor and Taxes are each a "cost". each generation of new hires in new companies, new CEO's all snipping away at "costs". It's come down to 10 year olds in India working in sweat shops so we can pay less for cheap breakable products and clothing we have to replace in a year anyways. But market share values are soaring.. record profits and still they bitch. omg lol
NAFTA is not the only problem treaty.
The Democrats (not that it matters which party because we have a CORRUPT one party system) approved the GATT treaty.
And the GATT treaty was the the mother load of free trade agreements.
Watch this interview of a BILLIONAIRE who begged congress NOT to sign this job destroying treaty.
But congress signed it anyway.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4PQrz8F0dBI
I prefer to use NAFTA as an example because 98% of the 99% understand it better. Like my mom, she's a pretty common commoner. lol
Agreed, a perfect example of how powerless the people have become. So sad..
Lol that was great.
why does CEO make that much? no really, why?
ummm maybe it is because CEO gives back to politicians? get $ out of politics!
Separation of Corporation and State!
politicians aren't cheep and we have the best government that money can buy.
This is why big government should not be in the position of picking winners and losers.
When big government subsidizes or bailouts big business - small business and people suffer.
This is another example of why big government cannot be trusted with taxpayer funds.
Oblama is hopeless and everyone knows it.
reddy2.. ok, the "Big Government" scary words are just that.. big scary words. For the last 20+ years corporate funded lobbyists have been influencing, and yes, sometimes writing our very laws in favor of their very, very, rich patrons. Lobbyist money going to candidates.. gotta pay to play! The true purpose of Government is to protect the people from greedy imperialists and corporations like the East India Company... we can just call them the Koch Brothers. lol
that Obama sure knows how to pick 'em.
And yet you people are mad at the company who got the money instead of the government who gave it to them. It just astounds me.
I'm mad at the company that paid the lobbyist who paid the politician to vote to pay the company.
But your not mad at the politician? Don't you see how flawed that logic is? You can ask as much as you want for something, its a free country. But that doesn't mean you get it. A child asks for ice cream for lunch. Being the parent, and the one bearing the responsibility, is where the decision is made. The government is supposed to be responsible to the tax payer and not just give them our money. Be angry with those who have a fiduciary responsibility to you, not someone who is asking for something.
I was trying to be funny... bad joke? yes, mad as hell at the politicians for selling out, but you can't even run for office unless you're rich or have a millionaire sponsor. And even if you could run, it's the media who decides who's getting the good publicity. If the media doesn't like you, you are out of the game. Why is it ok to give out huge subsidies and tax cuts to already profitable companies, and deny the people who pay taxes the basic needs for health and survival?
...actually, yeah. It's a dope-fiend mentality.. "I got this extra $$ from 'x' so I'm gonna run away before he can collect on it."
Fairly simple.
(emphasis on 'fiend')
Did anyone say they supported the government for giving them a bailout?
Then why aren't they in DC? Nope, they are on wall street because of the progressive/marxist influence that is driving the eat the rich class warfare engine. They are being used as pawns. Or as the books that laid this whole process out 'useful idiots' describes them.
lol I think the rich are driving the eat-the-rich engine. But I worry about the protesters being used to promote an alternate agenda. Like that MTV deal.. that one makes me nervous. The editing room can twist the story.
I agree there should be an occupy white house but these companies who donate billions really run the government.
It's very important to get the facts correct. From AP:"The Whirlpool jobs to be cut are mostly in North America and Europe. They include 1,200 salaried positions and the closing of the company’s Fort Smith, Ark., plant.
The shutdown of the Fort Smith plant will affect 884 hourly workers and 90 salaried employees. An additional 800 workers were on layoff from the factory and on a recall list.
The company’s third-quarter net income more than doubled to $177 million, or $2.27 a share, from $79 million, or $1.02 a share. Revenue rose 2 percent to $4.63 billion.
“Our results were negatively impacted by recessionary demand levels in developed countries, a slowdown in emerging markets and high levels of inflation in material costs,” said Jeff Fettig, Whirlpool’s chief executive."
They only made $177m on $4.63B for this quarter.
I saw this on report on tv. Fact: Whirlpool just laid off 1200 worker. They got $19 million in a bailout. They made 4.63 billion instead of the 4.74 billion they expected to make. CEO makes 14 million a year. What fact wasn't correct? And I am not being a smart ass really.
what's a 19 million bailout?
You are correct except that their revenue was $4.63B, not profit. That was $177m. Yes it is 1200 workers in the US.
I agree obama is not the best but i cannot vote republican after what they tried to do to the unions.
Maybe there should be an Occupy Public Unions Movement. After all they get benefits that the average private sector employee don't get. Why is it that you think the Unions should get a pass on the whole movement?
I'm upset at the Unions, I'm anti union. But if I'm going to protest it, I'm not going to go picket the houses of union members. I'm going to go protest my local government for agreeing to such outlandish union contracts and enslaving the fiscal future to them.
If not for unions you would not have any of the labor law you have today. When people had to work all night, your kids were sick, or any other thing came up they would just find someone else to work. So if you work 40 hours a week and have weekends off thank the unions for starting the labor law movement. You let big companies tell you unions are bad so you believe it. And I never said we were above any of the lay off stuff. Unions are backing OWS. If everyone joined the union we could all work together. And my union andwe our members gave up money to save 54 members jobs.
Laws were passed. The work environment is not the same today. Unions now serve a different purpose. They are a wing of the socialist party today. If your not willing to admit that, then your lying to yourself.
And for your info, I've been in several unions. My wife is in the nurses union and works for the county. At least we both can admit to the truth about unions today. If everyone was in the union, our country would be long past bankrupt. The market simply cannot bear a workforce that makes 140% of a normal sustainable wage. And that pushes us towards greece and other socialist movements.
Unions are not needed for the purpose you stated above. They serve a new master. Open your eyes.
So you are against everyone making a good living from big business CEO's to blue collar workers? So no one can make a good living. Why doesn't your wife leave the union? Is her salary to much? Is she overpaid?
Even FDR said collective barganing rights, as normally held, should be applied to public unions. And really, thats what unions all boil down to is the collectivism and power it holds to get what it wants, especially financially.
I'm against artificially over inflating anything, including mandatory wages because just like everything else that is artifically inflated, it creates a bubble that will pop. The last two decades should have taught you that.
My wife has been with the county for over 15 years as a nurse. And soon, she will leave after this next year. It will be tough to find any nurse job that isn't tied to a union. But at least it won't be a public union. Seriously, public unions should be illegal. There is no counter balance to a public union. Private unions, when they get out of hand, have the the business to hold things accountable. And if the business fails, the union goes by by. But with public unions, if the union gets more and more greedy, the cost is just layed on the tax payer because the govt can't go out of business.
So for 15 years she was overpaid and is now going to leave cause she feels she should make less? Why don't you give back some of her salary to the county since she robbed them for years. Don't tell me they gave her free healthcare too. You should be ashamed. And clarify how they can force the county to pay them more?
I see what your trying to do. It doesn't hold water. First of all, my wife and I didn't even think about political stuff until about 4-5 years ago. She's been wanting to get out for a long time, but the housing market crashed and we want to move to a smaller town. So that means she can't risk not having a job, especially with a two year old at home as well. This is a tough time right now. She just changed her position for the experience she will need to make that transition, which meant taking a pay cut. So, yes we are in the process of changing.
Your name is teamster, and you don't understand how public unions hold the local govt, community, and tax payer hostage with collective barganing or contract renewals?
My union is public. we have not had a raise in 4 years. we are 2 years out of contract come the end of the year. We cannot strike or we are hit with the tayor law in new york. We gave up a 2% raise and a half million dollars in 2008 to save jobs. Then last year gave up overtime, another half million back , and an insentive check we used to get to bring back 54 people who got laid off. Now they are trying to make us pay for our healthcare and taking 10% from our salaries. So how do we hold them hostage. See you were all told we were greedy then when alot of unions gave back they kept asking for more so they could say see we told you they were greedy.
yeah yeah, fines and jail time. Problem is they never do it. It has no teeth, just like when our teachers went on strike in Tacoma this last month giving parents 12 hours of notice that they will need to find alternatives for their children or stay home themselves. Bunch of selfish pricks want to say 'its all about the children'. yeah, BS!.
My wife had furlough days and what not that she had to take two years ago. Then the following year they completely re-imbursed them for everything they sacrificed. But really, I'm sorry to hear that you gave up overtime on a job that rakes in at least 140% more than the private sector equivalent.
And now you have to pay some of your healthcare! Oh the HUMANITY!!!! Nevermind its still WAAAAAY less than what private sector people pay for their portion of healthcare.
Don't you get it. Its portion control. Even in the whine above your lamenting about Not getting mandatory raises. I bet you still got your COLA didn't you? Well guess what spanky, the private sector is getting its teeth kicked in and your crying about not getting enough caviar. Thats not a sacrifice.
To your credit, I will say that not all unions are created equally. Most are self serving entities, but there are a few out there that are better than others.
By the way, you know why you were talked into ponying up the things to get back the 54 people who were laid off? Because thats lost revenue in union dues for the union. But I'm sure it was all sold to the members as some altruistic cause. Read between the lines.
Good point Teamster! Everyone should read "The Jungle" it's about what life was like before labor laws and unions and minimum wage laws.
I know 20 years ago unions were great and people wanted to join. Now the media talk that we hold companies and government hostage and are bad. So people follow what the media says and want unions gone. If unions go I guarantee we all will get paid less then minimum wage. What will stop businesses from paying low wages people standing together and protesting and boycotting just like OWS is doing.
True strike! Unions have helped more than harmed. Chicago is famous for it's union busting. Which is funny considering that the labor movement pretty much started in Chicago in the 1880's when workers protested for a 40 hour work week.
Anyone who is anti-union is pro big business and corporations.
Well Obviously they didn't need the workers