Forum Post: WE need to get really really ORGANIZED***
Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 1, 2011, 3:21 a.m. EST by CaptainArmando
(0)
from Las Vegas, NV
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
Okay. We all know were here for one common purpose.
SOOOO. Lets make this really really LEGIT!
We need to start with our outfits. We need to make ONE color our symbol. Dress in that color at ALL times to represent the OWS movement. We need to train our bodys and become strong.(Push ups and joggs) We need to get ourselves READY. We need to become Our Own SOLDIERS. Organized Men ( Line of Men after Line of Men, After line of Men) *Kinda like Old Greek style of men in the lines of WAR. But were not to causing war on anyone, Keep this very peaceful :)
We want to let the World know that We`re HERE to STAY! Lets make this happen my brothers!
Darn, I thought this would be a thread about actually affecting change. Actually DOING something. That's what I want to see get organized.
Organize yourself.. Elect leaders. Decide a platform. Or the movement is doomed. Get judicial action to stop confiscations, which are designed to hurt, not help. Can't do that without leaders.
like
Is OWS a men's movement?
Just what I was wondering.
This fellow tries to ignore all the hard work women do, as has happened so often in history.
The great irony being that women and girls are disproportionately impacted by economic injustice.
I've been reading too many of these posts, I can't tell sarcasm from the serious any more. Now I'm curious about your choice of color for your battle dress. Just one serious question though, what is that one common purpose?
omg this is so patriarchal, cult-like, war-like, religious-like, and SEXIST.
I will have none of this patriarchal crap. Count me out if Occupy, like just about every protest action, is just another damn patriarchal event of men advocating beating their chests, etc.
This is EXACTLY why I almost never go to protests of any kind. Old-style male-think resurges, invariably.
I am a woman and a feminist and your patriarchy is NOT MY MOVEMENT.
Most guys who are there don't think like that though.
I totally agree with you though, no need for patriarchical claptrap.
I agree, but I think there is some truth in the underlying sentiment.
Oh Captain my Captain, when do we get started? I'm sick of the cockroaches on this forum who want to talk about theme songs instead of actually forming some hierarchies with leadership and organization. What's the plan? You have my sword (probably).
Really? Did you read the same post that I read? There will be no message, but there will be matching t-shirts. You're ready to give him "your sword"? Scary!!
can we have wristbands? that way lots of people know that we support OWS, on the street, in school, at work - that way people will know lots of people support OWS
http://knockknockrevolution.tumblr.com/post/11573860774/why-occupy-wall-street-flyers please give these out to non occupiers to convert them!
The OWS movement needs a theme song. My choice is "Aint No Stopping Us Now". Beat is slow but the lyrics are perfect.
... There've been so many things that have held us down, But now it looks like things are finally comin' around, yeah, I know we've got a long long way to go, yeah And where we'll end up, I don't know. But we won't let nothing hold us back, We gonna get ourselves together, We gonna polish up our act, yeah, And if you've ever been held down before, I know that you refuse to be held down any more, yeah yeah, Don't you let nothing, nothing, Nothing stand in your way. ... Ain't no stoppin' us now, We're on the move, (You said it, we've got the groove), Ain't no stoppin' us now. We've got the groove (Whoo-hoo-oo-oo Whoo-hoo-oo), Ain't no stoppin' us now, We're on the move, (We've got the groove), Ain't no stoppin' us now, We've got the groove (Yeah).
What is your choice?
Aqualung - I love that song!!
I kind of like paul kelley http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6_ndC07C2qw
I like the tune and message: From Little Things, Big Things Grow.
Love it. Definitely our song. Or maybe I Will Survive?
I vote that our uniform be a pink tutu, pig tails, ribbons and angel wings with glitter and sequins. This is WAR!
omg this is so patriarchal, cult-like, war-like, religious-like, and SEXIST.
I will have none of this patriarchal crap. Count me out if Occupy, like just about every protest action, is just another damn patriarchal event of men advocating beating their chests, etc.
This is EXACTLY why I almost never go to protests of any kind. Old-style male-think resurges, invariably.
I am a woman and a feminist and your patriarchy is NOT MY MOVEMENT.
omg this is so patriarchal, cult-like, war-like, religious-like, and SEXIST.
I will have none of this patriarchal crap. Count me out if Occupy, like just about every protest action, is just another damn patriarchal event of men advocating beating their chests, etc.
This is EXACTLY why I almost never go to protests of any kind. Old-style male-think resurges, invariably.
I am a woman and a feminist and your patriarchy is NOT MY MOVEMENT.
yes. exercise your bodies, because that will make more impact than...IDK PRESENTING something to CONGRESS?! lol
wow congress relly has been on the ball lately!
I've said before. If you brought the anti cronyism issue to the front and brought a proposal to congress, what congressman or president in their right mind would oppose it? It would be suicide. Got to get your foot in the door and here is a wonderfully useful wedge. Hammer that bitch in.
congress has lost touch with reality a long time ago. Obama had a all democratic congress and did nothing and now republicans are not doing anything. Congress must be replaced with a complete set of new members
Maybe, but you have to try to do whatever you can today, not trying will loose OWS support.
i believe with all my heart that if they came with a jobs plan and included everybody in a plan to run the government it can succeed
I see what you mean, but Jobs are not something that can be spun from air. You have to have substance to have a market. You can NOT legislate to create jobs, and jobs are not necessarily the problem, except where either they are needlessly outsourced, or people do not understand market fluctuation. Once again, focus the fight on the corporate lobbying and corrupted behaviour. Focus. Those issues are enough to interest the working class.
JOBS are the focus...look a corporation can hire a robot over a human the private is done helping the people it is time for a change and it has to be huge...We must pivot from our industries that are falling off to something new...
And that something would be? Look this has been coming because we have lost a great deal of production work. But goods are cheaper than they would be otherwise because of production labor shifts. Is this a sign that sustainability on a service based market is unsustainable....maybe, or maybe it is just being handled badly. If it is being handled badly make the issue the handler, not the horse. You will see success on the part of the horse much quicker.
omg this is so patriarchal, cult-like, war-like, religious-like, and SEXIST.
I will have none of this patriarchal crap. Count me out if Occupy, like just about every protest action, is just another damn patriarchal event of men advocating beating their chests, etc.
This is EXACTLY why I almost never go to protests of any kind. Old-style male-think resurges, invariably.
I am a woman and a feminist and your patriarchy is NOT MY MOVEMENT.
Must be selling tee shirts. :)
The conformity will not work with the colors we wear, the conformity will come from our voices, speaking from one tongue, with clarity...
We need a leader, we need a Patriot not a politician.
One who can speak for all The People...
Taxation Without Representation
The People do not have a voice in this government, only corporate voices being heard.
Other ideas for getting organized, including taking over the Democratic Party: http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/change/science_freshstart.html
there are a lot of "real-life" republicans that support a lot of your ideas as well.
Above all we need to tell the people that we shall succeed because we offer what people yearn for.
I'm replying here because for some reason I can't post into the window directly below "Captain Armando's" statement.
omg this is so patriarchal, cult-like, war-like, religious-like, and SEXIST.
I will have none of this patriarchal crap. Count me out if Occupy, like just about every protest action, is just another damn patriarchal event of men advocating beating their chests, etc.
This is EXACTLY why I almost never go to protests of any kind. Old-style male-think resurges, invariably.
I am a woman and a feminist and your patriarchy is NOT MY MOVEMENT.
Feminazis are funny....I read your posts below. That stuff about "boy"cotts was great! I'm a girl, I have had issues because I'm not a man and I still think you are a very silly person. I know this wasn't very constructive, but neither is your reading into words like boycott.
Humanism encompasses(includes) feminism what I mean to say is that if humanism gets implemented through this revolution then feminism automatically gets implemented.Feminism has a narrow objective while as the humanism has a broader objectives and aims.Feminism may call something which may or may not be against the womanhood in a society a disease while as the humanism focuses on all the real diseases in a society to find their remedy.
Our cry of battle has to be: "We are here to stay". Our chant has to be: "Bella Ciao" or "We shall overcome". We have to write again the principles of freedom of the Founders of democracy. Let's prepare flags with a red background and a symbol of liberty on it (a sauvage horse) and say to ourselves: "We are ready to struggle and to win forever our war for the human progress.
Don't love a revolution. Love it's goals.
I'm a pacifist, but I know that in this situation we'll obtain nothing, because the "fixed to the Freudian oral phase" don't intend to give up an inch of their wellness. The same thing is happening in every Country of the world. This is a struggle between the rich and the poor, the globalization and the return to the real economy. We haven't another choice.
With respect I may sketch my first plan as follows: first of all we must know our objective which is to change the political and the economic system.We must assume that their shall be tremendous resistance from the government about that as much that the government shall kill all the people of the country.why does not the government kill all of you this time is because the government of USA is dead sure that this movement shall not succeed.But when ever people get motivated by your arguments ,methods or people the government begins to turn to barbarism.We must know the ways the government can harm us for example government sends us people who are their agents FOR 1 spying 2 misguiding/misinforming 3 be fooling few boys into certain harmful actions 4 poisoning our food which leads us not to think thoroughly on any point that is arrests our thinking 5 poisons(solid liquid or gaseous) which slowly ruin our health 6 not only installing bugs at the place of protest but also install such things which harm us through radiations 7 waste our money in useless things or on things with lesser priority 8 providing useless suggestions or diverting our attention from necessary actions or the actions we have chosen.Next step is as follows:Our first step is to carry our message to the people so there shall be a group of people who shall be selected for the same for that we must have the people who are the best in knowledge among us.We need finance as well then we shall select people among us who shall be good at raising the money.We need people who shall expose the agents of the government among us though all of us have to do that but the selected people shall keep a watch on people ; we need legal help which shall have to be arranged by the first group who have to see our friends among lawyers.We need people who shall answer to the games the government plays with us.We need people who shall coordinate and communicate with other groups/people/organizations like us at different places.We need people who shall communicate and interact with the people or organizations which have ideology some what similar to us.We need people who shall keep a watch on the outcomes of all our different groups/organs.The able people among us should come forward to select different groups on scientific basis.We need a general council to deliberate on the over all situation and the next steps to be taken. We need researchers among us who shall look for our mistakes and or offer the remedies.You are welcome to add to my proposal.
A lot of people there aint got a job, how are they going to afford a uniform? Is it being provided?
Black clothing, head to toe, with thin, long cloth wrapped around the arms and torso. Different color for each faction. One hierarchy for socialists, one for libertarians, etc. They will never agree on a common leader, but they can rally behind a common cause. Bonus points if you can name the source of my screenshot.
http://www.upl.co/uploads/Adobe-Flash-Player20111029195815.png
I'm a fatty, but I'll train if this movement actually starts getting mobilized. I approve of this thread in every way. All of my +1
Uniforms sound distinctly creepy - I think hippies are much easier on the eyes than Brownshirts. But if you are interested in starting to get some sign of organization, there are lots of companies that sell those rubber LiveStrong-like bracelets with any arbitrary graphic you want to print on them for just a few dollars apiece, even for very small runs. Sell them on the Web for extra funds, and they'll give you a little of that consistency you want.
(Post #3: continuation of post #2, below):
We don't need uniforms and militias and males inciting childish, petty, and wasteful confrontations, vandalism, and violence.
Yuck. So last millenia.
Those all just promote the buildup of the police state, and encourage incursions to civil liberties. While wasting material resources when our planet can least afford it.
Healthy systems are diverse and diffuse.
Rather than focus on--and give away even more of our power--to the 1%, we need just the opposite of these protests:
We need to go back to our respective cities and dwellings, practice voluntary simplicity, living much more modestly, living far more within our means, and not FUNDING Wall Street and depleting the planet at the rates we have been with buy, buy, buy, and drive, drive, drive!
We need to focus on reproductive rights and pregnancy prevention, building mutually supportive local communities, and buying locally when we can.
This will help redistribute wealth away from Wall Street, while each of us work to build more sustainable lifestyles at home and in our communities, which in turn will rob the global human family less, as well.
(Post #2: a continuation of what I posted, below this)
Our automotive standards so high, we can't afford those either.
The middle and working classes have been able to, up until now, because businesses could keep finding new sources of capital (natural resources) or human labor to further exploit.
Those options are now gone. Any new sources of capital have been almost exhausted. Hence our crisis.
Bottom line: Americans, and the wealthy throughout the world simply have to get used to living on far less money than any of us currently do.
(Yes, even the poor in the US are quite wealthy by global standards: ~80% of the global population lives on less than ~$60/month/person.)
Re-distributing the wealth of the American 1% to the rest of the American 99% so that we can temporarily live as comfortably/luxuriously as we have been for the past 60-70 years is not going to solve our economic problems long-term.
We need to start getting used to living on less: for the more affluent, a lot less, permanently.
It's called living sustainably: living within the global human family's means.
Rather than demanding ever more pay, we need to begin to accept and embrace full-time jobs in which we can earn $10-15/hour plus benefits, and start saving.
And no, those are not bad or impossible things.
Living within the planet's means is rewarding. The west has an opportunity to learn what the east had long pursued: inward growth, rather than outward material growth. The east must learn to cope with newfound material wealth without going overboard and adopting American's materialistic habits.
We must also recognize that neither we as individuals, nor the planet, can afford to have us, the global wealthy, being careless about pregnancy, and bringing any more kids into the world.
Our kids cost us and the planet a lot more to raise than kids born to the 80% global poorest.
(A middle class American kid costs ~$200,000 to raise to age 18.)
Meanwhile, 20,000 children die daily around the world due to lack of ~50 cents each worth of food and medical supplies.
From a planetary survival perspective, as well as the lower wages we must learn to accept, every pair of Americans giving birth to even one child is no longer feasible (~1% birth rate.) We need to aim for a 0% birth rate, in the US, for personal and global sustainability.
We must grieve and learn to accept and find benefits in this new birthrate reality.
In California alone, at any given moment, there are 90,000 kids in the foster system in need of foster parents. Most are adoptable.
So anyone who really wants to raise a child could raise a foster child. (If you can't love someone else's child, could you truly love any child?)
Once again, this is an opportunity for inward growth, for drawing out the best within us--a greater capacity to love beyond ourselves and our own gene pool--borne of our global material crisis: the limits to growth.
So how do we jingle that money and political control out of the 1% wealthiest?
By stopping spending.
In other words, by stopping giving away our money to the 1%!
Economists give the 99% the impression we "consumers" should buy more, to create more jobs, so the US workforce can return to, say, <5% unemployment overall, and have money flow freely for more of us again.
This is nonsense.
As Ben Franklin said, "The fastest way to earn a penny is to not spend it."
For every dollar a person spends (who has not already accummulated enough wealth to retire), some of that dollar will go to the CEO of the company we purchased from.
Even if we do get a job with that company, or another, we will not, on average, recoup as much or more in income than the dollar we spent.
In fact, we will spend some money to earn part of that dollar back: transportation to work, job costuming, childcare while we're at work, work lunches eaten out, etc.
So Ben Franklin was right: hanging onto our dollars is the fastest way to accumulate them.
So don't go out and spend to "help the economy."
One way to think of it is that spending to "help the economy" is really only helping economists and other wealthier people in the business world. For every dollar we spend, they skim some of it for themselves, of course. That's why they're in business: to earn income off of what they sell. (We all do that, to earn a living.)
So let's stop giving the 1% our dollars, where we can help it.
Buy less, shop less, buy from small and local businesses, stop paying to go watch overpaid male athletes.
They don't need our charity.
I mean really.
How about protesting outside men's pro football and baseball games, instead of going in?!
BUYcott football, for crissake!
Rather than Occupy Wall Street, we should BUYcott Wall Street.
(Not "boy"cott. 51% of us aren't boys. Sexist language stalls cultural progress.)
I agree with you. Uniforms are so patriarchal and totally miss the point: in fact they are a massive part of the problem, not the solution. It is so easy for people to start rallying around uniforms and then toward militarism, which is exactly where the original author is going.
Symbols become a lazy alternative to critical thinking and dialogue.
The fact that Occupy is so aimless and focused on protest at all is an outcome of the poor thinking and old, outdated mindset of the Occupy initiators: "If something isn't working, let's blame this all-powerful group."
Yes, there is a serious problem that so much wealth and political power are concentrated among so few, but protesting the 1% totally misses the point.
All protest does is reinforce their power, by giving away our own.
Occupy is the opposite of what would be constructive.
If the visibility of the Occupy protests helps people start coming together to think through other ways to solve our profound economic problems, then it will have been useful.
The origins of our economic crisis are primarily:
the growing concentration of wealth among a few
the depletion of global natural resources which can be owned and harnessed to sell for income, and
that there are no new regions of cheap labor in the world which can be found and tapped (because all of them already have been), or which can be further exploited than they already have been for even lower wages to generate income off of, so...
American capitalists in the past decade once again looked toward home for a source of making more money, and found it in the form of home-buyers they could scam, then take their homes from, along with all the money the homeowners had paid, so far, for those homes.
As a result of the seemingly endless sources of money, Americans (all of us, not just the ever-smaller group at the top) have been living ever-higher off the hog for the past century.
We have gotten incredibly spoiled. Our building standards have become so high, we can't afford to pay that much in mortgage or rent anymore.
Your comment on building standards gets me going. There is an industry association for HVAC manufacturers called ASHRAE that proposes lunatic standards for "internal air quality" requiring that torrents of air be blasted through buildings. The noise of these turbine-topped monstrosities is absolutely intolerable, and in ecological terms the waste of hot air being pumped out into the winter night perhaps even more so. The actual bill in 2008 for "energy efficient buildings" pushed for improvements in building efficiency - but the first thing retrofitters had to do was to increase the airflow to these absurd levels or to "the physical capacity of the ventilation machinery". From that baseline any increase in efficiency was counted. The bill literally referenced ASHRAE by name!
So yes, the building standards are too high, and it is a terrible corruption.
people like different colors
Repeating what others say in a parrot like chant, and now dressing all in the same color. Sounds like cult type behavior geared towards silencing the inner critics of the group.
They repeat what the speaker says because loud speakers are not allowed in NYC. Thats why they always say "mic check!" and then repeat what the speaker says sentence by sentence. It's so the people in the back can hear them without a mega-phone/loudspeaker.. Something that you idiots aren't aware of. But it just goes to show how you people really understand nothing about the movement.
Stream and Tweet announcements
I know how this started, but I have seen the technique being used afterwards in small indoor lectures and even outdoors with microphones.
HOW DARE THEY REPEAT WHAT THE SPEAKER SAYS! Zomg. Who cares. My guess is that they aren't aware of the whole mic check thing and they think it's a trendy way to relay information. Nothing wrong with it though. It goes to show how enthusiastic people are.
Nothing wrong with it, except that it's a known and effective technique used for brainwashing. If brainwashing is not a goal OWS, they should drop the technique as it makes them look bad plus it as been proven by many studies to inhibit critical thinking.
lolz! Brainwashing? That's your new grievance with OWS? Doesn't surprise me. Just another straw argument from a straw-man.
Besides, why don't you prove that it's brainwashing.
I think they should keep the technique. Just to piss people like you off.
I'm not saying they are planning to do brainwashing, I'm saying the technique has already been proven to be one of the strongest tools for brainwashing, and it's possible that some get brainwashed unknowingly even if it's not a plan just because they use the technique. You should read on brainwashing and how it works. Anybody can be brainwashed, and it's not always obvious that it's happening.
If you want proof, just research the issue. You can do that by yourself.
Why would they want to piss me off? Wouldn't it be better for them to garner as many supporters as possible, instead of pissing some off because of side issues which aren't that important in the grand scheme of things.
Then the Pledge of Allegiance is brainwashing. So is praying, hymns, and a lot of the goings on in churches all across the nation.
See, that's the problem with stereotyping.
All of those things are milder forms of brainwashing, on the spectrum of influence and mind control.
And yes, churches are among the heaviest users of thought-stopping/mind control techniques. That's how they draw in their $$$$$$$$$.
There's no problem. I agree churches use all kinds of brainwashing techniques. One of them is repetition of gestures. Sitting, kneeling, every week the same thing. Do you really think you need to go to church every Sunday for the rest of your life to understand one book? Of course not, you simply go to get indoctrinated and reinforce your conviction that it's all true. Religions have been using brainwashing techniques since the beginning, they invented them!
The idea of repeating words for brainwashing others is thoroughly documented. It has been studied in detail. You should read up on it.
lolz@you.
Try this link. it will explain why this isn't brainwashing at all, but a highly enlightened way of showing support to each other.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Z4m4lnjxkY
But more seriously, all these people already support the general message of OWS. Why the fuck would they need to brainwash each other? They're already PROTESTING the same things.
You last paragraph indicates you might have been brainwashed. The truth is the general message of OWS is very vague, as soon as some people start expressing more detailed philosophies it becomes clear many people do not agree with each other. I don't think they are using brainwashing techniques on purpose, I think it's from naïve thinkers like yourself who don't have enough experience to see the problem. However, it could easily be argued that the reason for them to use it would be to fortify the movement, to solidify the main ideas that form it. If you listen to a speech where one person talks it is much easier to disagree with him or her if he is speaking alone then if a bunch of people repeat everything he says. When people repeat like this, it gives the illusion that they all agree with every word and the listener feels alone vs many, instead of alone vs one speaker. It is a very well known technique. Another question you might ask yourself, if everyone already agrees with the general message, then why bother giving more speeches where this technique is being used? Every speech is a chance to gain more protesters and followers and a chance to fortify the ones you already have on board. Doing the speeches with this technique reinforces the chance of success as this is a scientifically proven technique to convince others of the message. It makes the speech more successful.
Right. I'm sure.
OH! Btw, I live in Illinois, and haven't been to an OWS protest. I'm a supporter from afar. So...there goes your whole straw-man argument.
Great post!
Strangely, I can't reply to your message. Using a brainwashing technique doesn't mean 100% of the people will suddenly become zombies and follow every you tell them. That's only in the movies. Please read up on brainwashing techniques and how they work. The church uses them all the time, and there are many people who don't believe in the church. However, the people who do believe can sometimes become fanatics. Actually, the more a church uses these techniques the more fanatical followers it has. Look at how cults work. They always use repetition when doing speeches. Inform yourself. Learn.
Well, what you are saying is a perfect example of poor critical thinking. "Generally supporting" a message, without thinking critically about each thing said, can lead to real problems. It can sound 'generally" good, but we need to all be alert to problematic ideas creeping in, intentionally or not. It's easy for groups to go off on tangents / directions that might not be so good, and we all need to remain sharp within groups anywhere, analyzing each idea for how good or bad it is, so we can prevent ourselves and the group from going off in an unwise direction. Just handing one's brain over to something one "generally supports" is a recipe for brainwashing, group-think, and going off in undesireable, or unproductive, or counterproductive directions.
what a joke. Why don't you go UFO spotting in Roswell while you're at it. Just because someone doesn't agree with you doesn't mean they are brainwashed.
She's right: it is a known brainwashing, thought-stopping technique.
Any ritual is. People start feeling like they should follow the ritual to be part of the group. Rituals should be avoided, they discourage independent critical thinking, and we ALL need to be thinking right now, and always.
Thrasymaque is correct. What she is saying is true. Read about it in the cult-watch literature.
It encourages people to go along with the crowd, through the ritual, instead of listening and critically thinking what is being said, first.
VERY dumb and dangerous for any movement, or for anyone who cares about democracy, because critical thinking at all times is crucial for democracy.
Thank you! So true, and well said.
I propose that thousand people meet in a largte square of Auckland to repeat as a "mantra" some key word, like: revolution, equality, peace, job, freedom and so on. That would reach the effect to push all the citizen to partecipate to this historic struggle.