Forum Post: We are talking!!!!!
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 16, 2011, 11:29 p.m. EST by JWBethesda
(52)
from Bethesda, MD
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
We may not know exactly what is happening next, but if you are here, you recognize that something needs to change.
Thank you all for your time, regardless of opinion.
Don't believe everything they teach in economics class, for they are the ones that lead us into this mess in the first place, right? And just for the record, I spent the last 27 years working on this Business Analysis as a Marine, Certified Pubic Accountant, Computer Programmer, and Socioeconomic Analyst, so please, don't give me any crap about my understanding of economic theory. I understand these outdated theories quite well, but obviously you don't, and won't because you don't give a shit about the Bottom 90% of Workers, right? I'd expect that from someone who lives in DC.
Hey hey...easy killer..... I respect your opinion, but disagree. Just as you disagree with my opinion.
First, thank you for your service as a Marine.
I am a doctor and volunteer large amounts of my time to free community clinics. Not only am I part of the 99%, but I care deeply about the bottom 5%.
Plus, I live in the suburbs of DC, not DC proper. And, I share your sentiment about the DC politicos ;)
Perhaps our conversation has reached its plateau. Thanks for you time and goodluck in your pursuits.
Something definitely needs to change.
I'm just not sure protesting Wall Street will be productive. it might actually become counterproductive.
I think the anger and protests should be directed towards the government.
This i the problem IndyGuy....Wall Street IS the government. Its the root of government, in fact. Do you agree, or no?
I think it is more government as the enablers of Wall Street wrongdoing.
Wall Street may be and have been wrong in many of it's actions. But, those actions could never have been taken and accomplished without the complete acceptance and maybe collusion of government. Most especially the politicians and bureaucrats who populate our government.
Focusing solely on Wall Street seems very wrong. That will never solve anything.
Well...Do you think OWS is only focusing on Wall Street though? My understanding is the grievance is with the collusion government has had with Wall Street, versus Wall Street alone. In other words, how is it the Wall Street received bailouts for failed business ventures? The government. But how is it that government makes those types of decisions? Corporate (Wall Street) sponsorship.
Do you agree or disagree with that?
I see VERY little criticism of government coming from this movement.
What makes it more disturbing is that not only is there very little criticism of government, there is no specific criticism of any politician.
Any large movements of the past have always made direct criticisms of people in power.
I am suspicious of this movement because they seem to refuse to directly criticize anyone in power or the president himself.
It makes me wonder if this movement doesn't have an agenda. If a Republican guy was president, would this movement be so loathe to criticize the president?
I think we both know the answer.
You can't change Washington D.C. with a movement that is overtly partisan.
Exactly.
Your last point is exactly why identifying a 'target' for our frustration in the current political system never works. By picking 'a' republican or 'a' democrat is to suggest removing those individuals from government would be the solution to the problems. But, this is not the case.
Our current government is so corrupt, in my opinion, that is literally needs to be handed back over to the people, from the ground up. Again, in my opinion, any and every politician currently in the House, Senate, the Presidents seat is corrupt and needs to be replaced. Sure, we can write every individuals name on a piece of cardboard and carry it around demonizing them. Or, we can only accept a complete overhaul of our current politicians.....
I am certain an agenda will come together in the coming weeks. And, I have a feeling that once this agenda is released.....a lot of hell will break lose. I believe this because 1) the grievances will be tremendous and people will say it cant be done 2) this will only energize the Occupy movement and make it larger, as people will see how logical the demands are and 3) the media and politicians have effectively reduced this to small groups of disinfranchised students, versus the radical, society changing movement it actually is.
I wonder if the former British crown believed the same of the American founders?
Yes, and demands should be only for an Article V convention, our first constitutional right. It can cover anything we need.
Congress is very afraid of an Article V.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Convention_to_propose_amendments_to_the_United_States_Constitution "Congress acted preemptively to propose the amendments instead. At least four amendments (the Seventeenth, Twenty-First, Twenty-Second, and Twenty-Fifth Amendments) have been identified as being proposed by Congress at least partly in response to the threat of an Article V convention."
Our first right in our contract is Article V, the right to have congress convene delgates when 2/3 of the states have applied for an amendatory convention.
Article. V.
The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate.
Lots of facts here about Article V. http://algoxy.com/poly/article_v_convention.html
If you don't like our politician, vote for someone else. If you don't like your company, create one yourself The founders of our country worked their butts off and risk their lives, and did not expect the govt. to take care of them.
Great point 'crapbs'
I imagine by 'founders of our country' you are referring to the Founder Fathers? The ones that recognized the importance of separating from the British Crown because of gross disparities in wealth?
Many more people will come to your side when you are proactive (for “new” Business & Government solutions), instead of reactive (against “old” Business & Government solutions), which is why what we most immediately need is a comprehensive “new” strategy that implements all our various socioeconomic demands at the same time, regardless of party, and although I'm all in favor of taking down today's ineffective and inefficient Top 10% Management System of Business & Government, there's only one way to do it – by fighting bankers as bankers ourselves; that is, using a Focused Direct Democracy organized according to our current Occupations & Generations. Consequently, I have posted a 1-page Summary of the Strategically Weighted Policies, Organizational Operating Structures, and Tactical Investment Procedures necessary to do this at:
http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategic_legal_policy_organizational_operational_structures_tactical_investment_procedures
Join
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/
because we need 100,000 “support clicks” at AmericansElect.org to support a Presidential Candidate -- such as any given political opportunist you'd like to draft -- in support of the above bank-focused platform.
Most importantly, remember, as cited in the first link, that as Bank Owner-Voters in your 1 of 48 "new" Business Investment Groups (or "new" Congressional Committees) you become the "new" Congress replacing the "old" Congress according to your current Occupation & Generation, called a Focused Direct Democracy.
Therefore, any Candidate (or Leader) therein, regardless of party, is a straw man, a puppet, just like today, for it's the STRATEGY – the sequence of steps – that the people organize themselves under, in Military Internet Formation of their Individual Purchasing & Group Investment Power, that's important. In this, sequence is key to doubling your income from Bank Interest Income.
Why? Because there are Natural Social Laws – in mathematical sequence – that are just like Natural Physical Laws, such as the Law of Gravity. You must follow those Natural Social Laws or the result will be Injustice, War, etc.
The FIRST step in Natural Social Law is to CONTROL the Banks as Bank Owner-Voters. If you do not, you will inevitably be UNJUSTLY EXPLOITED by the Top 10% Management Group of Business & Government who have a Legitimate Profit Motive, just like you, to do so.
Consequently, you have no choice but to become Candidates (or Leaders) yourselves as Bank Owner-Voters according to your current Occupation & Generation.
So please JOIN the 2nd link so we can make our support clicks at AmericansElect.org when called for, at exactly the right time, by an e-mail from that group, in support of the above the bank-focused platform. If so, then you will see and feel how your goals can be accomplished within the above strategy as a “new” Candidate (or Leader) of your current Occupation & Generation.
Really!?!?!?? Did you just post a massive document to my comment? C'mon man. lol. I dont have time to read ALL of that. Can you reduce it down to 2 or 3 sentences??
If you want to double your income as a Bank Owner-Voter then you will profit well from reading it.
Oh. Maybe you misunderstood my original post. My excitement is not about profiting from failed government. My excitement is about the fact we are having conversations about how to fix the governing of our country so that there is no longer unequal representation.
I make plenty of money.
Yes, it's very exciting, but it takes people in coordinated action, as I'm sure you are aware, to make it reality. The movement has to about actions, not words, like so many similar movements in the past. I just want the group to focus on actions that will really work, that really change the system so it seeks liberty and justice for all, such as becoming Bank Owner-Voters, and thus doubling the income of the Bottom 90% of Workers (for starters). After all, many people are struggling quite hard just to make ends meet.
Hi atki,
Thanks for the note. I appreciate the time you took to explain your perspective.
I can say that I agree with you in regards to coming up with a plan.. Maybe this is a bit esoteric, but I believe this will happen in good time.
I wonder if you can try to help me understand how doubling the income of the bottom 90% will help the exponentially increasing level of debt we face at tax payers, the over representation of the 1% in politics, and the over representation of 1% in our modern media?
Thanks,
J
Doubling the Wealth & Income of the Bottom 90% disallows the top 1% from corrupting the system by using their control of 2/3 of all wealth & income to corrupt anyone else, but having enough wealth and income, when decentralized among all 100% by occupation and generation, that we can take coordinated action, locally and globally, nevertheless.
Don't believe everything they teach in economics class, for they are the ones that lead into this mess in the first place, right? And just for the record, I spent the last 27 years working on this Business Analysis as a Marine, Certified Pubic Accountant, Computer Programmer, and Socioeconomic Analyst, so please, don't give me any crap about my understanding of economic theory. I understand these outdated theories quite well, but obviously you don't, and won't because you don't give a shit about the Bottom 90% of Workers, right?
atki, you do realize that the top 1% makes 435 times the amount of the average U.S. employee, right? This is a fact you can find in recent NYtimes, Washingtonpost, and other media. We would all need to literally make 1 billion dollars a year to compete with these individuals in political discourse with the Senate.
I just dont believe increasing the wealth and income of the 99% makes any economic sense. I took micro and macro economics....lol. It just doesnt jive with any economic theory.
Because you can't control a thing, like debt, until you control the banks as Bank Owner-Voters that PERSONALLY allow that debt, which option you don't have today. Control the banks as Bank Owner-Voters and you can stop today's banks -- the true government -- with your own "new" Government (or "new" Banks).
Posted a new Draft Constitution in response to Member questions at: http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategically_weighted_policies_organizational_operating_structures_tactical_investment_procedures