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Forum Post: This movement does not endorse Obama.

Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 17, 2011, 11:28 p.m. EST by bigbangbilly (594)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

This movement does not endorse Obama nor Ron Paul. PERIOD!!!!

85 Comments

85 Comments


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[-] 4 points by MarcTwane (76) 13 years ago

To preface what I just wrote, I am only scratching the surface. Barack Obama is a great public speaker, but that is all. His actions paint a much different picture.

[-] 4 points by alwayzabull (228) 13 years ago

Obama is a puppet.

[-] 3 points by bigbangbilly (594) 13 years ago

However he isn't the only puppet. Puppets both sides is a guaranteed win.

[-] -1 points by kamoako (52) from Litchfield Park, AZ 13 years ago

kinda is, but you have to understand wouldn't you try to get a second term?

[-] 2 points by alwayzabull (228) 13 years ago

He's in it for tha benjamins.

[-] 3 points by TroubledYouth45 (71) 13 years ago

I hope people learn and don't support any of these candidates! The President is just a puppet. Pushing and Pushing for votes. Those politicians will say anything to get you on their side. Everything out of their mouths are lies. I hope America will wake up and see it.

[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 13 years ago

I invite you to review this plan - and imagine the possibilities. http://www.osixs.org/Rev2_menu_commonsense.aspx

[-] 1 points by TroubledYouth45 (71) 13 years ago

There is nothing in this world that would make me want to click on that link. I wish you all the luck if you continue to believe our "American" Politicians.

[-] 2 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 13 years ago

You've got me wrong - I have NO faith in our politicians or the system. It's totally corrupt! That's why I invited you to the site. It was created by computer geeks and engineers; that invented a super secure internet - The V2 - or internet version 2 (http://www.osixs.org/V2_Menu_V2.aspx). for citizens to vote and conduct oversight of the government. They also believe that our current government cannot be fixed; so they started a project called Revolution 2.0 - http://www.osixs.org/Rev2_menu_intro.aspx.

Overview: Welcome to the beginning of the second American Revolution.

The purpose is to educate and to move the United States and the rest of the world forward. We all know that something is terribly wrong with our country but we don't have a clue what to do about it. But we do know we cannot continue to sit around and do nothing. We are so confused, we don't realize how dangerous it is to continue voting for democrats and republicans. We've become mentally crippled and dependent on two parties and our current form of government. They can't help you. The best people to help the people are the people. Until you figure that out, you will remain lost. Welcome to the Revolution. Revolution 2.0 is a revolution in ideas and technology along with a vision to move this country forward. Read common sense 3.1 and the rest of the pages on the menu. This will give you a clear understanding of what the problems are, what we need to do about them and most important, how to proceed by taking real action. Our government didn't create itself and it can't fix itself. Problems never solve themselves… Common sense 3.1 is a call to action to address the problems of the nation. http://www.osixs.org/Rev2_menu_commonsense.aspx The second bill of rights are the baseline expectations and goals for Revolution 2.0 http://www.osixs.org/Rev2_menu_billofrights.aspx The Declaration of Dissolution and Termination (DDT) is a formal and legal declaration of grievances prepared by the people of the United States to be served to the government of the Untied States. The declaration is also a formal and legal order by the people to the government of the United States to cease and desist specific government operations in accordance with instructions laid down by the Execution of Dissolution and Termination. http://www.osixs.org/Rev2_menu_Intro_DT.aspx The Execution of Dissolution and Termination (EDT) is the formal process and rules for dissolving parts or all of the old government and then terminating the old government after the new government has been fully implemented. http://www.osixs.org/Rev2_menu_Execution.aspx Yes, you guessed it - this ain't no tea party. What I do like about this movement, is that it gets the job done without violence. If violence breaks out; the government can and will impose martial law and the rest of your rights will be stripped from you. With your rights gone; your vote; your signature; and your opinion are irrelevant. With the frustration that is building in America; I can envision this possibility. Revolution 2.0 sidesteps this pitfall. If you like what you see at this site; please vote here and let them know of your support: http://www.osixs.org/Vote.aspx

When the representative body have lost the confidence of their constituents, when they have notoriously made sale of their most valuable rights, when they have assumed to themselves powers which the people never put into their hands, then indeed their continuing in office becomes dangerous to the State, and calls for an exercise of the power of dissolution.

  • Thomas Jefferson
[-] 2 points by TroubledYouth45 (71) 13 years ago

My apologies to you. And I really wish you luck lol. I read it and I totally agree. There is no fixing. Thanks for introducing this to me.

[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 13 years ago

My pleasure :)

[-] 3 points by anotherone773 (734) from Carlyle, IL 13 years ago

Candidates should be non issues. Unless you regain control of the 535 members of congress it does not matter who the president is or if you control him or not.

The power needs to be put back in the hands of the people.

[-] 1 points by SparkyJP (1646) from Westminster, MD 13 years ago

"The power needs to be put back in the hands of the people." I think this would do just that. See what you think http://www.osixs.org/Rev2_menu_commonsense.aspx

[-] 3 points by mgiddin1 (1057) from Linthicum, MD 13 years ago

Four more years of Barry "Wars on 8 fronts" Soetoro!!

[-] 3 points by OldDucker (23) 13 years ago

Goldman Sachs owns Obama.

[-] 2 points by laoccupier (5) 13 years ago

This movement doesn't have to "endorse" Obama, but it doesn't have to attack him either!! I believe he is our best choice, realistically speaking, for 2012 and beyond. He was the one who tried to bring healthcare reform into the picture, changing the tax code, pass the new Jobs bill. The Republicans are trying to reverse all progress that has been made in favor of "each man out for himself" (i.e. capitalism). So he's not the "bad guy" everyone makes him out to be. Sick of Obama bashing by the right (and now, the so-called left).

[-] 2 points by vrptx (42) 13 years ago

I agree.

[-] 1 points by MichaelAshen (2) 13 years ago

Really the man came in with what could be the biggest mess this nation ever had to deal with. He's had to deal with a number of his own party saying 'no' on a number of things he wanted to do. Deal with a party who started as the party of no and well look what they turned into. And really? From what I'm seeing from the far right and Tea Party that has taken over things would be much worse with them fully running everything.

Everyone will hate to hear it but on the left get over the apathy, and for those on the right we need people who want to meet in the middle and work on compromise rather then screaming no and waving their don't tread on me flags around.

[-] 1 points by reason99 (1) 13 years ago

I agree with laoccupier. He did plenty of fundraising, and his appointments to offices may cross the line to cronyism. . . but he's better than the Republicans by a long shot. Even Ron Paul wants to cut corporate taxes from 35% to 15%, block grant entitlements (which will deeply cut social services for everybody and put the burden on the states), and destroy 5 cabinet positions that stand in the way of big business--and his is the most likely plan to be copied. Obama's Job's bill would have cut corporate tax loopholes and raised taxes on the 1% by a slim margin and at the same time invested in infrastructure and education. He's been demonized by the talking heads who get funding from the Koch Brothers: http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/08/30/100830fa_fact_mayer?currentPage=all

He's also made a lot of progress toward his campaign promises, he's just been completely obstructed by a party that would rather drag this country off a cliff just to blame it on him!

[-] 2 points by MarcTwane (76) 13 years ago

A very good article. I remember reading this article years ago, but I read it again. Thanks for posting the link.

[-] 1 points by Yepper (277) 13 years ago

Jeff Immelt and GE got $126 MILLION stimulus dollars despite making over $6 BILLION profit and paying ZERO TAXES at the same time. BaROKE Obumbler's $852 STIMULUS bill to create JOBS and start SHOVEL READY PROJECTS turns out to be a SLUSH FUND FOR CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTORS LIKE SOLYNDRA, GE, JEFF DOERR and STEVE WESTLY, other DONORS, fictitious zip codes,etc.. Obumbler blew $852 BILLION, NOW HE WANTS $450 BILLION MORE---SHOW US THE MONEY, WHAT DID YOU DO WITH THE $852 BILLION?? Criminals always return to scene of the crime, Obumbler's BACK TO STEAL MORE MONEY FROM TAXPAYERS! Millions went to foreign banks, $529 MILLION went to Finland to build hybrid cars, MILLIONS went to Hezbollah, MILLIONS TO CRONIES. The same type of CRONIES are on his JOBS BOARD! All we'll get from them is more LIES, DECEIT, FRAUD!

[-] 1 points by MarcTwane (76) 13 years ago

President Obama has done just the opposite of every campaign promise he has made during the campaign three years ago. If he was a man of the people, he wouldn't be having fund raiser dinners for $38,500 a plate with Larry Blankfein. Instead of the credit card reform legislation, he would be the one directing us to remove our money from the banks of November 5th.

He's an impostor. A failure. Not noble. And far from the leader we all thought he would be. The change he promised us, was no change at all. This isn't Obama bashing. He is only a part of the system. It is much larger than him, but he is the easy one to blame. I do see that he has been stalemated by the Republican party on many issues, but he has not once reached out to the real people in this country who elected him in the place.

[-] 1 points by vrptx (42) 13 years ago

But we must not give this to the Republicans. That would be suicide for all. We have a better chance with Obama.

[-] 1 points by MarcTwane (76) 13 years ago

We would have a better chance with an independent candidate with a Ph.D in philosophy. Barack Obama supports the doldrums of the day, and he hasn't done much for the promotion of the common man in America. You obviously have your mind made up already, so i'm not trying to change that, but throwing your support to Obama will just continue to promote the same agenda we are all attempting to eradicate from our government. The fact is, the Democratic Party will raise MORE money than any other election in the history of the United States, and this money will be poured back into the media we are attempting to detach and divorce ourselves from.

But keep supporting Barack Obama, and his corrupt administration, and keep believing in his hope speeches, because it's people like you that continue to keep hope alive in America.

[-] 2 points by ryanm (33) from Wichita, KS 13 years ago

The fact that we aren't given real choices for who to vote for is a significant part of the problem. I want an atheist, realist to vote for. We don't have any running, and even if one did they would never get in because people spend too much time bitching about stuff that doesn't matter, rather than focusing on the things that do.

[-] 1 points by bigbangbilly (594) 13 years ago

Most public office won't let you hold office if you are irreligious which is not a good policy.

[-] 2 points by freeflyer22 (49) from Portland, OR 13 years ago

The Democratic party is trying to hijack this cause!! Obama has publicly endorsed this cause to gain support among the sheep of this country.

[-] 1 points by bigbangbilly (594) 13 years ago

However we should not let the republican party hijack this cause.

[-] 1 points by freeflyer22 (49) from Portland, OR 13 years ago

BOO! Nobody should be allowed, but i doubt anyone will allow it, however we remain at risk just the same.

[-] 1 points by vrptx (42) 13 years ago

To not vote at all is to hand this over to the Republicans.

[-] 1 points by freeflyer22 (49) from Portland, OR 13 years ago

False dichotomy, there is no "real" delineation between either party, either way........at least not anymore.

[-] 2 points by unended (294) 13 years ago

Agreed. This movement doesn't endorse anything. It makes demands. And that's just the way I like it.

[-] 2 points by MarcTwane (76) 13 years ago

In a study by the Center for Public Integrity, 27 of the 36 campaign contributors who donated $500,000 or more to the Obama Campaign received appointments to Economic Advisory positions or ambassadorships. The percentage of campaign contributors donating over $200,000 who received appointments to positions in government is 80%. Here's a link - http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/8578546/Barack-Obama-campaign-donors-rewarded-with-government-jobs.html

Barack Obama reappointed Ben Bernanke as the head of the Federal Reserve, and nominated Timothy Geitner to the Head of the Treasury Department after failing in his job at the Federal Reserve of New York City. And this is the fallout - http://sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=9e2a4ea8-6e73-4be2-a753-62060dcbb3c3

What about the collusion between the Obama Administration and the BP Corporation? Read The National Commission on the Deepwater Horizon Oil Spill and Offshore Drilling - http://www.oilspillcommission.gov/

Also a book called Black Tide by Antonia Juhasz

Barack Obama accepted the Nobel Peace Prize, and built a campaign on promises of ending the wars as soon as he is elected. Three years later, military spending budget is the largest it's ever been in the History of the United States. And a whole long list of other things that documentaries have been made, Lifting the Veil -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AzULm4d8h8w

Barack Obama and the Democratic Party is just as guilty as anyone in our government for the injustices that have been visited upon us as Americans.

[-] 1 points by gawdoftruth (3698) from Santa Barbara, CA 13 years ago

Agreed. anybody fronting for someparty needs to stop and either run for office in the OWS party or STFU.

put down the ron and back away slowly or i kill your memes.

http://www.ronpaul2012.com/the-issues/

stop listening to exxon oil and republicanism and use your brain. i LOVE ron paul hes my one and only NOT EVIL republican i know of. the road to hell can still be paved with his good intentions. STFU WTF? This is about getting rid of ALL the republicans and ALL of the Democrats. If you are not on board for REAL change and want to land us a half mad science denying oligarch just crazy enough for them to control and just stupid enough to try republican economics- you are nuts.

You know i am all for ending the fed. HOW we do that is more important than merely doing it because the civilization is one organism and its econmic systems are organs. Play doctor like a mad fucking half genius insane brilliant wingnut republican... and your patient would expect to do as well as a 5 year old trying to do real live surgery after being smoked up on crack. You are not and he is not a system doctor. I am. And all you or he has for us is mor eentropy; not hard solutions. Now STFU and start working for a new party inside of OWS. I want YOU to tell me what office YOU are going to run for. GROK?

And let me be loud and clear over here. i love ron. but if you ron paulians don;t get the clue quick i will be forced to END him from THIS space. Don't call the lightning. just take Ron back out of OWS and i won't cook his campaign alive with fire from the sky. GROK?

I got no beef with ron. i love ron. STFU and get ron out of my court or i will take his platform by line item and SORT the genius from the WINGNUT. LIVE.

https://www.facebook.com/#!/prometheus.pan

https://www.facebook.com/#!/prometheus.pan?sk=photos

https://www.facebook.com/#!/note.php?note_id=10150438889880833

https://www.facebook.com/#!/note.php?note_id=10150409084095833

https://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=10150399526600833

https://www.facebook.com/prometheus.pan?sk=notes#!/note.php?note_id=10150398121910833

[-] 1 points by number2 (914) 13 years ago

I'm a Ron Paul fan but I agree with you. This movement should discredit the right/left system that clearly doesn't work for the people.

[-] 1 points by monahan (272) 13 years ago

No they endorse a communist revolution

[-] 1 points by wweddingMadeintheUSA (135) 13 years ago

I do!!!! Obama 2012!!!

[-] 1 points by qlawrence (4) 13 years ago

Has anyone suggested a workshop at the park on how to run for office like city council or the House of Reps? A workshop like that would scare a lot of people. Plus, a lot of protesters really should learn more about running for office and actually do it.

[-] 1 points by MyHeartSpits (448) 13 years ago

PERIOD.

[-] 1 points by psychofun (2) 13 years ago

This is a Bug's Life Movement: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmUD9Jhfh_U

[-] 1 points by gagablogger (207) 13 years ago

And the movement needs to support: General Strike.

[-] 1 points by RichardGates (1529) 13 years ago

well i thought it obvious the movement is not pro any politician. that would either require us all feel the same or voting to support a candidate and that hasn't even been suggested. don't let folks get to you. i voted for obama but i am only one, and that is only the opinion of one. carries no more or less weight than that.

[-] 1 points by Idahoamerican (57) 13 years ago

Everybody owns someone...not just goldman sachs owning obama...who owns you?

[-] 1 points by Bingspeak (3) 13 years ago

Whatever. Dodd Frank regulates Wall Street (or at least it's supposed to) and is a product of the Obama administration. Now Wall Street hates Obama, and is giving it's money to Romney. Nuff said.

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Dodd Frank would be a lot more effective if people like Ron Paul would quit fighting to fuck it all up. It was supposed to mean sweeping changes to the financial regulations to reign in the bankers.

Then you have idiots all over the place supporting Ron Paul and his deregulation bullshit.

It's obvious the GOP has unleashed it's internet propaganda machine on this forum. Keep fighting for the banks dumbasses.

[-] 0 points by Yepper (277) 13 years ago

Obama has recieved more donations from Wall Street than any President EVER!!

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Wall St. donates to any presidential candidate they think can win. Go look at the last few presidents and see who donated to them. Yep Wall St.

Doesn't matter to Wall St. if your a democrat or a republican, if it looks like you can win you will get their money.

[-] 0 points by Yepper (277) 13 years ago

Yeah and Wall Street broke all record with how much they gave Obama. Then there is this: Jeff Immelt and GE got $126 MILLION stimulus dollars despite making over $6 BILLION profit and paying ZERO TAXES at the same time. BaROKE Obumbler's $852 STIMULUS bill to create JOBS and start SHOVEL READY PROJECTS turns out to be a SLUSH FUND FOR CAMPAIGN CONTRIBUTORS LIKE SOLYNDRA, GE, JEFF DOERR and STEVE WESTLY, other DONORS, fictitious zip codes,etc.. Obumbler blew $852 BILLION, NOW HE WANTS $450 BILLION MORE---SHOW US THE MONEY, WHAT DID YOU DO WITH THE $852 BILLION?? Criminals always return to scene of the crime, Obumbler's BACK TO STEAL MORE MONEY FROM TAXPAYERS! Millions went to foreign banks, $529 MILLION went to Finland to build hybrid cars, MILLIONS went to Hezbollah, MILLIONS TO CRONIES. The same type of CRONIES are on his JOBS BOARD! All we'll get from them is more LIES, DECEIT, FRAUD!

[-] -1 points by goeib1 (163) 13 years ago

Chris Dodd and Barney Frank.... why don't you all actually investigate the two writers of this atrocity and THEN say it should be supported. These two men (?) are DIRECTLY responsible for much of what you 1% ers are bitching about and NOW they have the audacity to write regulations for financial institutions?

[-] 2 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

You are a moron.

[-] 0 points by Yepper (277) 13 years ago

Republicans were in control from 2000-2006 before the Democrats took over congress in 2007. In 2006, the final year under President Bush and a Republican Congress, the unemployment rate was 4.6%. Today, under Obama and a Democrat congress, the unemployment rate is 8.9% (according to the Federal Government - but 16% according to Gallup). Under Obama & the Democrats, poverty has reached its highest level since 1959. The numbers don't lie. The failed economic policies of Democrats have been destroying lives, wrecking our economy & shattering the American dream since the Democrats took over congress in 2007. The before & after statistics prove it.

A brief history lesson: 1977: Jimmy Carter (D) signs the Community Reinvestment Act, guaranteeing homes loans to low-income families. 1999: Bill Clinton (D) puts the CRA on steroids by pushing Fannie Mae & Freddie Mac (F&F) to increase the number of sub-prime loans (owning a home is now a 'right'.). 1999 (September): New York Times publishes an article, 'Fannie Mae Eases Credit To Aid Mortgage Lending', which warned of the coming crisis due to lax lending policies of the Clinton (D) administration. 2003: White House calls Fannie and Freddie a "systemic risk". The Bush (R) administration pushes Congress to enact new regulations. 2003: Barney Frank (D) says F&F are "not in a crisis" and bashes Republicans for crying wolf and calls F&F "Financially Sound" Democrats block Republican sponsored regulation legislation. 2005: Fed Reserve Chairman Alan Greenspan voices warning over F&F accounting "We are placing the total financial system of the future at a substantial risk" 2005: Sen Charles Schumer (D) says "I think F & F over the years have done an incredibly good job and are an intrinsic part of making America the best-housed people in the world.". 2006: John McCain (R) again calls for reform of the regulatory structure that governs F&F. 2006: Democrats again block reform legislation. 2008: Housing market collapses: Democrats blame the Republicans.

Obviously the Republicans aren't free of guilt concerning the cause of this crisis because they didn't try hard enough to prevent it and in some cases allowed it to happen (one of the reasons conservatives and independents disliked Bush by the way and one of the reasons that many of those votes went to Obama as a 'protest' against Bush's liberal tendencies). But as can plainly be seen the Democrats hold the lion's share of blame for the economic melt down we're currently enjoying.

How can it be the 'fault' of the Republicans when the democrats are the ones that caused the current recession/depression and have been in complete control of the purse strings of the country from 2007 - 2011? Only in the mind of the socialist propaganda machine can it be 'Bush's fault' when 90% of the blame rests squarely on the shoulders of the democrat party.

Seems like it's CLEARLY the democrats that are the ones doing this to us...and to a WAY lesser degree, the Republicans. Maybe Obozo misspoke and he actually meant the democrats want to make the U.S. a third world nation

[-] 0 points by goeib1 (163) 13 years ago

very deep analysis there. you post comments with NO intellectual backing and call ME a moron.... LOL

[-] 1 points by BHicks4ever (180) 13 years ago

Agreed.

[-] 0 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

You don't speak for me.

Name me one better electable candidate.

[-] 1 points by bigbangbilly (594) 13 years ago

Actually I don't speak for you nor this movement. The individuals in this movement speak for themselves or at least some of them.

[-] 0 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Then delete your post and rewrite it as "I don't endorse Obama!"

You won't because you're a GOP shill that's here to cause trouble, correct?

[-] 1 points by MyHeartSpits (448) 13 years ago

You're totally misreading the purpose of this movement if you think we endorse the establishment (Obama). That's the one thing this movement agrees on.

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

You can endorse whoever the fuck you like and I will do the same. Quit trying to speak for other people.

[-] 1 points by MyHeartSpits (448) 13 years ago

Right, all I'm saying is that this movement was called to protest corporate government and Obama is practically its poster boy. I don't really see why you'd want to be a part of OWS if you support the establishment.

[-] 1 points by bigbangbilly (594) 13 years ago

I am not a "GOP shill". Besides this movement does not support the GOP either. If the only choice is Obama and a Republican I would vote for Obama however there can be a third choice.

[-] 1 points by gerryb (37) 13 years ago

Ron Paul

[-] 2 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Ron Paul will never be elected president. I know it's a big pill to swallow but you just gotta.

Also he wants to further deregulate the banking industry. The ones that got us in this mess in the first place. lol

[-] 1 points by gerryb (37) 13 years ago

You have it backwards. Government got us in this mess in the first place, the banks grew up around it to take advantage. Ron Paul wants more regulation of the biggest bank of them all, the Federal Reserve, and to return choice to consumers(the 99% of us) in all facets of our lives(banking, eating, speaking, contracting with each other for services, etc.)

[-] 2 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Ron Paul will never be elected president. How many times does it need to be said? How many votes did he get in the last election?

The banks fucked everyone over because they were allowed to. Do some actual reading on the subject instead of watching clips of inspirational speeches that go on about some ideological utopia of free markets.

[-] 1 points by gerryb (37) 13 years ago

And how exactly are you going to reform government so it can not be gamed by the corporations to their advantage again and again? Their is only one logical solution, bring the government to its Constitutional functions of protecting life and property, and the corporations will not be able to utilize it to gain an advantage over us.

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

100% public financing of elections and campaigns, paper ballots and congressional limit of 4 terms in office.

That's a good start. Then you've got Dodd-Frank that needs to be completed, along with strict regulation of many other industries.

If you think the "free market" rules all, give me an example of when a totally free market succeeded.

[-] 1 points by gerryb (37) 13 years ago

100% public financing won't solve anything. The media controls elections, and unless you want to get rid of one of societies foundational liberties(free speech) you will never get around that ability. You can't regulate "fair access" as 1) it is a violation of free speech, and 2) who will determine if fair representation was given to the other sides. Who determines the "other" sides? Elections will always be manipulated if the benefit of owning the government and setting policy outweighs the cost.

What has strict regulation gotten us? 80% of the livestock market is owned by 4 companies, and if my neighbor wants to buy a single chicken from me, I would have to comply with hundreds of thousands of dollars of regulations. My neighbor wants my chicken, but I can't legally sell it to him. Yet the CAFO's get to feed chicken shit to their cows. Great. This example is played over and over in every other market. The big guys get regulatory advantage over their smaller competitors, and you have a consolidation of the market due to government intervention. Policy will always be manipulated if the benefit of owning the government and setting policy outweighs the cost.

Free markets succeed every day, when you are allowed to make your own decisions on what is best for your life, your family, and your community, free from coercion. When has giving people a choice free from coercion ever failed?

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

"and if my neighbor wants to buy a single chicken from me, I would have to comply with hundreds of thousands of dollars of regulations."

Can you cite for me the regulations that would costs "hundreds of thousands" of dollars in startup cost for you to sell some chickens?

Have you looked into it that closely? Do you know specifically what it costs to start a chicken farm in terms of complying with regulations? I'm guessing you haven't, and that it's no where near that much. Do you think regulations are taxes or something?

Let's have a little thought experiment about "free markets" aka the ability for people to police themselves, without any outside forces interfering.

Fire all the police. Fire the FBI the CIA, the lot of them. Now make everything legal. Would people just magically behave themselves? Probably not.

I don't think regulations that disallow people from participating in business at a reasonable price are good for anyone but there needs to be structure.

[-] 1 points by gerryb (37) 13 years ago

Re: FBI and CIA and police.. Do you understand what a Constitutional government is? Look up Classical Liberalism. In my original response I said "bring the government to its Constitutional functions of protecting life and property". The role of government should only be to protect your natural rights from infringement by others.

Re: chickens. Yes, have you? Without finding loopholes in the law, the costs are astronomical. With loopholes, it can be done with a few thousand dollars, but lots of legal liability and a bureaucrat can come in and muck it up at anytime. All my neighbor wants to do is buy a chicken I have raised and eviscerated and cleaned for them. Why do we need government involved in that transaction at all? How about a dairy farmer? Why are they constantly raided for selling unprocessed milk to their neighbors? In both of these cases, I can give them a gift of these products with no government involvement. How come when they want to buy it from me does it become the concern of a government bureaucrat?

Watch the documentary "Farmageddon" which is a good documentary of the raids on small farms, and read the book "Everything I Want to Do is Illegal". It's a good read on the plight of a small farmer trying to produce good food to sell locally.

[-] -1 points by quietlike (194) 13 years ago

You are just parroting the MSM. And even if you did think that, what other person running has at the very least been honest with the people? Banks fucked everyone, yes, and Ron Paul has been pointing that out for 30 years! The FED is the biggest bank of them all, and he wants to expose their fraud. Its the fractional lending thats killing us. You can't fix the economy without at least looking at the central bank that plans it.

If YOU (all of you) voted for him, he would win. It is that simple.

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Congress has failed everyone actually. You can spit out "fractional lending" and "fiat money system" all day long but in the end it was congress that failed to regulate the financial market.

I'll vote for Ron Paul in the primaries, just like I did last time, but he won't win, period. I'd rather have someone that is principled that I don't agree with in office instead of someone that isn't.

[-] 1 points by quietlike (194) 13 years ago

Congress cant regulate the private federal reserve... otherwise we'd audit it already. I agree that congress also participated by spending borrowed money, instead of getting real with the people and telling them they cant afford shit.

But the FED and govt work hand in hand. Fractional lending and fiat money is the power over the people. Congress wouldn't need to regulate them if we had sound money, and a 100% reserve rate. Only would have to prosecute fraud and counterfieting.

You cant fix the economic problems without addressing the monetary issue. Otherwise there will always be economic planning through central bank lending.

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

We just audited the Fed. I guess you don't keep up with what's actually happening?

The audit didn't turn up anything too crazy either. Certainly not plans for world domination.

http://sanders.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/GAO%20Fed%20Investigation.pdf There's the report if you care to do some reading.

[-] 1 points by quietlike (194) 13 years ago

16 Trillion given to multinational corporations and foreign banks??? That's not crazy??

http://sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=9e2a4ea8-6e73-4be2-a753-62060dcbb3c3

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Read the report. You really think they wrote checks for 16 trillion? That's not how it works.

Loan someone 10 billion, they pay you back the next day, immediately renew the loan, for 30 days. You could say they loaned them 300 billion, but they only had 10 out at a time.

[-] 1 points by quietlike (194) 13 years ago

Yes, that called swap deals. This is exactly how they can manipulate currencies.
Then I ask you this, where do they get the money in order to do this? Created out of thin air, and if/when those loans go bad, taxpayers are on the hook. While at the same time that creation of money supply reduces the value or purchasing power of the dollars you hold already. So you get taxed to pay interest, then taxed again through inflation. At the same time, the bankers are skimming off the top to pay the fees and commissions, all to make their balance sheets look good -so that there is "confidence" in the banking and by association, govt systems that depend on them. This is accounting fraud and a literal transfer of wealth from the middle and poor to the rich.

[-] 0 points by mgiddin1 (1057) from Linthicum, MD 13 years ago

Yeah, it better not - I'm already fed up with all of the people defending him on this site.

The only president that has exceeded Bush 2 in being a complete liar and selling us all up the river is Barry Soetoro.

[-] 1 points by itsme (21) 13 years ago

Agreed