Forum Post: They are laughing at you.
Posted 12 years ago on Nov. 24, 2011, 3:12 a.m. EST by stuartchase
(861)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
The 1% is laughing at the OWS because they are able to portray us as a bunch of filthy pigs rampaging and making a mess wherever we go. Whether we like it or not, the Tea Party didn't leave a mess. They made their point and left. I said we should use Toshiba as one of our first targets because they are easy, and they do so much damage. They are also very stupid. A great deal of people have bitched and whined at my idea.
As for the 1%, some are good and some are bad. Some might have received their money through luck or fraud, but usually they had to get off their sorry asses and work around the clock for it. Whether you are a movie star or Donald Trump, you will realize if you want to maintain your wealth and status, there are no vacations, you work 24/7. Just ask Lou Reed. Anyways, I would like you to check out my message and leave a comment. It doesn't matter if it's good or bad. I won't delete it either way.
http://www.occupywallst.org/forum/make-a-stand-join-the-clan/
That's all I have to say about that.
I agree with you about Toshiba. I paid $1,500 for a laptop which was advertised offering a $400 rebate. I never got my rebate and the laptop was a defective piece of crap that broke 3 times in the first 9 months I had it. Trying to get Toshiba to honor the warranty was almost impossible. I don't like credit card companies at all - but at least since I paid for the Toshiba laptop on an American Express credit card - the extended warranty helped me get a partial refund on the piece of crap Toshiba laptop.
Now about the 1% who you posit "some are good and some are bad" - If you can let me know who are the "good" 1/% I would be quite interested. Donald Trump was a rich kid who inheirited all his wealth from his zillionaire father. Donald Trump and has filed for bankruptcy about 3 times. Only Larry King has filed for bankruptcy more times than Donald Trump.
Donald Trump is actually a terrible businessperson, he has floated through life on water wings and is more of a Barnum Bailey showman charlatan than a businessperson. He is really more of a "personality" and reality tv star than a corporate executive.
I don't believe that the 1% is "laughing" at OWS. I think they are pretty nervous and scared. I just read that the American Bankers Association has hired a high powered public relations firm to do a hatchet job on OWS. If the 1% was "laughing" at OWS they wouldn't bother trying to do damage control by hiring a P.R. firm to enact a national campaign to smear OWS as wing-nut's.
Jack Lalanne. He was the most honest man I ever knew. He earned every dollar he ever had. He treated women as equals before it was cool.
Like anything, being rich has it's perks, but if you're in a place where people, including your family, just throw it in your face all the time, it loses some of it's luster. You'd be suprised how many people it happens to, and the irony is they only wanted to become rich to take care of their friends and family. Then there are greedy bastards that just want money.
Well, I do suspect the bankers are definitely scared. More people joined credit unions around Bank Transfer Day than anytime in history, something like 40,000 people joined.
Nah, their not scared. $40,000 people and their accounts is nothing. Think of the millions of people, industries and businesses that keep their wealth or have their wealth managed in a TBTF bank. The combined assets of 40,000 or even 200,000 is still a teeny tiny small slice of the pie not to mention how many TLTFB have been busily acquiring smaller community based banks. You can scare government who has the power to in turn scare the banks but OWS alone isn't going to frighten the banks.
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Some might have received their money through luck or fraud, but usually they had to get off their sorry asses and work around the clock for it. Whether you are a movie star or Donald Trump, you will realize if you want to maintain your wealth and status, there are no vacations, you work 24/7.
Maybe, but did they actually contribute to society value worth the billions they hold? Can one man possibly contribute more than an entire small town full of people who, also, are working hard round the clock? Of course not. They gamed the system from the top. They may have worked hard at gaming it, but that's not the same thing as having earned (ie contributing to society) as much as they have.
And I think you'd be pretty surprised at how much leisure time some of these people have. Trump, and other celebrities, are of course busy round the clock, not because they are rich - but because they are celebrities. If Trump was behind the scenes and not out playing celebrity, he would recover a hell of a lot of free time. Think about it.
The essence of profit, in the business sense, is this: you own a business (or a share in a business) and that ownership entitles you to pocket the difference between the sale price of the goods that business produces, and the wages and other costs it pays out. You don't have to work there. You don't have to lift a finger. Ownership grants you the privelege to extract that money.
And if you imagine all these guys are working class heroes who sweated their way to the top, I think you would do well to take a good long look at a random sample of these people and their backgrounds.
Well, if you don't think they deserve it, go take it away from them.
Hey look, the world isn't perfect, and I'm perfectly willing to accept we need these people, just as we need janitors or meter maids. But I think they're full of their own self-importance and their demands to be able to just do as they please no matter how much harm it does to society, are childish and absurd. They can even game the system a little and get unearned money, because a workable alternative doesn't really seem possible, so I'm willing to accept that. But we do need to govern for the good of society, not just a small fraction of society, and that means regulating for public order, economic stability, and so on. I don't even care about all the extra money they managed to plunder from the last 30 years of buying government and using the media to promote their little deregulation/privatization fetish. Call it a write-off, and let's just roll back these policies to a time when capitalism - or rather the mixed economy - actually worked. Function and results are everything.
Hey, I've been preaching that very same thing on OWS for two weeks about Toshiba, and people just call me a spam bot and tell me to go to hell. Sadly to say, most people on OWS are just bitter, and want to bash Authentic American companies, while companies like Toshiba slip right under their nose and wreak havoc. But don't take my word for it, have a look:
http://www.occupywallst.org/forum/make-a-stand-join-the-clan/
And feel free to join, the KTC would love to have you as a member.
I'm Canadian so ... not going to support US protectionism, sorry. The way this plays out in the real world is that you guys enact protectionism for your own industries, then demand everyone else drop theirs, at which point you flood them with cheap imports and destroy their industry. I know, it hurts when it happens to you, but ... a good deal of your economy is built on doing just that to others. Or at least it used to be, and would be again if you could.
Actually, we've been practicing unilateral disarmament since the 90s. Most of our trade deals are with partners that have significantly higher barriers to trade than we do. Hence the 1.7T deficit.
This is simply not true. US barriers to trade are some of the highest on the planet - and there isn't anything new about that, it's been like that since Alexander Hamilton (ie from the get-go, pretty much). Hamitonian protectionism has been the hallmark of US foreign trade policy since forever, and it's simply never been revoked (though it may have toned down a notch during FDR's time, but that's about it).
You should probably update your opinion. Here's a differing perspective:
http://economyincrisis.org/content/real-cost-%E2%80%9Cfree-trade%E2%80%9D
I can find plenty of op-eds that express a contrary view and throw a few statistics around, too. So what.
Wow. So much for constructive conversation, huh?
We are being gutted by so-called free trade agreements with nations around the world that subsidize and protect their internal interests while we hang ours out to dry. Your opinion doesn't change the fact of a 1.7T annual trade deficit.
You trot out Hamilton, which has next to nothing to do with the America that's been rocked by the neoliberal revolution of the past 30 years. I don't know what your angle is, but.. whatever.
I think I explained my angle: I'm Canadian. My job depends directly on exports to the US.
Most of the trade we do with you is natural resources (the only thing that saves us from having a deficit just like you). Per unit, we make much more selling to just about anybody else. But nobody buys the volumes you do and we simply don't have the infrastructure to deliver if they wanted to, since overseas exports are bottlenecked by port capacity (among other things).
And we aren't blameless either: all the G8 nations do this. We get together and talk a fine game of free trade, use the IMF to bully developing nations into dropping their protectionism while we keep ours. Neither of us could possibly compete with agricultural exports from the developing world. We subsidize our farmers and keep our tarriffs up to protect our own, but strongarm the developing nations into dropping theirs in whatever other sectors they're just developing industry. We call this "free trade" but it hardly is.
Agriculture is about the only place that our protectionism survives, and that's a good thing for the most part (but its misapplied; for example, to corn).
We're not going to agree, which is odd, because I don't think anyone is calling for more protectionism w/regards Canada. China is the problem. They are destroying us, and mostly because of that unilateral disarmament aspect of our free trade policies with them - they subsidize everything.
You'll find much more to argue with here: http://occupywallst.org/forum/can-we-have-fair-tradeyes/
Toshiba is everywhere. They sell in Canada, Germany, Austrailia, etc. It's good to know you're just some anti-American tool. Besides, you don't go excuse bad behavior by pointing to other bad behavior. By the way, I heard you lost your ball, Dubs.
http://www.amazon.com/Dubs-Goes-Washington-Discovers-Greatness/dp/1439280266/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1322190238&sr=8-1
I'm not anti-American. I just think nationalism should be a little less important. Borders seem arbitrary lines to me.
As far as Toshiba. Sure, I bet they're a rotten corporation, but to focus on specifics like this is missing out on the bigger picture and holds in it the danger of OWS simply being co-opted as a tool. Just like all the people who want to co-opt it and bend it to serve electoral politics by channeling it against their political rivals (McCain or Obama or whoever), well who's to say you don't work for one of Toshiba's competitors?
When a foreign company can push around the USA like a child, and they are partly responsible for the Japan Nuclear accident and no one cares, I think they are a pretty big fucking deal. That was like saying Adolf Hitler wasn't a big deal and look what he did.
Not saying it isn't a big deal but Toshiba isn't the only multinational in the world, you know. If OWS gets drawn into specifics like this, what's to prevent one multinational from using OWS against its competitors? How does anyone here know you don't just work for one of Toshiba's corporate competitors?
You bring one bad company down and then move on. Furthermore, you don't know whether or not I work for one of Toshiba's competitors. The fact of the matter is you won't even take a stand against a bad company. However, if you change your mind, here's the link.
http://www.occupywallst.org/forum/make-a-stand-join-the-clan/
No, I don't know who you work for, but what's to prevent something like that if OWS gets drawn into specifics? What's to stop politicians and corporate competitors from co-opting OWS to serve their electoral or market interests if OWS allows itself to get drawn into focusing on individual trees rather than the forest as a whole? What's to stop it from becoming a puppet of the very political and economic interests it stands against?
You just don't want to support the post because it was created by a black man, you fuckin' racist! OWS is already going after Walmart. Why will OWS go after Walmart but not Toshiba. Toshiba is a lot worse!
What the hell? I'm confused. Which black person started what? Toshiba, or OWS? And how was I supposed to know he's black, and what difference would it make anyway? For that matter, how do you know I'm not black? Or maybe native, or Asian? Or all three?
Of course some of the 1% are good and some are bad. Some of the 99% and some are bad. That's not the point. The point is the government of the 1% and the corporations do not serve the material interests of the vast majority. It's not about who is good or bad. This is not a Santa Claus fantasy. It's about whose interests are being served by the current political and economic arrangement of society.
Then vote them out.
It's not a matter of voting anybody in or out. No matter who is in or out it is still THERE state. A perfect example of why voting doesn't matter in this context is what is happening in Europe. Every European nation has a mass social democratic or labor party. Unlike the Democratic Party in the United States these are genuine parties of, by and for the working class.
But the mistake that they made was believing that they could administer a corporate state and that they could do it in the interest of the vast majority. Today they are failing everywhere and rightly so because, even though they really are mass democratic parties of the working class, they picked the wrong side of history. They chose to try to administer the states of the 1% and they are being punished for it now and rightly so. Solidarity forever!
How are you going to fix things?
We need to organize, organize, organize. We need to organize to the point where there is a GA in every county, every municipality, every neighborhood, every block, every nursing home, every school and university, every drug rehabilitation clinic, every homeless shelter, every mental institution, every military barracks, every jail and prison, every work place. Then we will be in a position to begin reorganizing society democratically from below. Actually, probably a lot before then, but that is the direction we need to go in. I'm not proposing anything new. I simply agree with Naomi Klein and Chris Hedges that we need to keep on doing exactly what it is we are doing. Organize, organize, organize. Solidarity forever!
Good luck with that. I can't even get people to take a stand against Toshiba.
http://www.occupywallst.org/forum/make-a-stand-join-the-clan/
But the fact is more people are becoming involved with OWS and organizing GAs and participating in occupations every day.
I stand by my statement. This dumb company sold U.S. military secrets and the government was going to boycott them, but then they backed down. I've let everyone know how Toshiba rips off people around the world and they look the other way. Nothing will change. It will be business as usual.
“First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”
http://vgdhi.cjb.net
If the consensus becomes we are a problem, then were done.
By the wayside they laughed and scorned Jesus, Gods Son. What more wont they not do to us. Let them laugh, let them spray their mace, strike with batons, kick, pull and shove. Have you not seen that all those who are abducted from OWS by police return to stand and occupy their ground yet again and again. At thee appointed time they will be crying as the gold in their teeth literally starts to melt and drip down their throats into their lungs and hearts and choke the breath of life right out of them.
Love, light and truth always prevails, we have not to fear the words that are being thrown at us like stones. The pictorials truthfully portray the events that are unfolding day to day. Violence begets violence and soon the machine will turn in on itself and collapse. As more and more people join and stand peacefully with OWS in nonviolent defiance of the power mongers, less and less people are there to oil the gears that keep the greed machine working. You do know what happens when you don’t oil the gears.
WOW!
And what has the party accomplished other than giving the US a credit downgrade?
What party?
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More profound words have never been spoken or typed.
Too much triglycerin in the turkey today
Nope, I was working all day. No time for turkey.
OMG....you people are fucking stupid.....you have know idea what the fuck you are talking about or doing......70% of all employment comes from small companies that fucking struggle to do it right and you motherfuckers threaten not just big business but everyone else....my boss is a millionaire and a great man and he has bent over backwards for me and my family.....fuck you.....and yes there is such a thing as corporations...... fucking big deal...they mostly get it right but sometimes don't...it is not a perfect world....grow up......they're is no such thing as this magical utopian world that you stupid fucking assholes think exists or want to exist....i hate your movement and so do most people...go away.......
Am I included in the stupid group?
even if you had a point, you expressed it WAY too poorly: inflammatory, derogatory, punctuation.
I think in general, small business' aren't being targeted by the OWS. Primarily large mega-corporations like Wal-mart that swallow up small business.
You dumb fucking bitch. Nobody gives a shit about your fucking boss. Not relevant. Got it? I fucking hate uneducated pieces of shit like you and so do most people. You stupid fucking twat.
Actually, I believe small business' like kellywankenobis boss ARE relevant. Plus I think your response was uncalled for, and tends to reinforce the dismissive attitude towards OWS. Just my opinion.
My response was uncalled for? Fuck you, too. How do you like them apples?
No sweat off my brow. Doesn't bother me at all. Should it?
Good for you, Are we done here?
I'm done. are you?
Depends.
I see you have the need to have the last word. Speaks volumes. Back to you. Over and out.
:D Have a nice day!!!
Thanks. Same to you. :)
last word.
Aren't you sweet. Why are you so cranky? Tired of not accomplishing anything?
You are desperate for attention today. You may have the next 30 seconds. Times a tickin'.
Wow, a response from you without profanity. Mission accomplished. Now do you have anything productive to say?
Let me see. Go fuck yourself.
Yep. :D
Oh thanks. I don't feel left out now. You must lead a very lonely life if you talk like that to all you come in contact with.
does this mean we aren't going to the prom???? by the way bitch....i'm a man....
No, I had it right the first time. You're a little bitch.
That's hot. Dinner?
You're funny. I got tired of watching him chase that Turack (?) guy and nobody was going to say anything.
Was that in the 'trolls we have known thread?' I haven't been paying much attention to that one... You just caught my attention in the recent comments with "fucktard" <3
Is that where he made the comment that he came over to laugh at him? He made several comments all over the place.
yikes, kitty got claws.
do you have a point or are you still the illegitimate cumshot that blew out of your unknown daddy
That the best you have? You are a day late.
so you are the illegitimate cumshot that blew out of your daddy......girlfriday you lose bitch.....fuck off cunt
You lost a long time ago. You are done, Fucktard.
LMAO
Wow! Talk about the pot calling the kettle black.
Pfffft. That mattered.
this is why most of us working class types HATE YOU......you claim to represent the 99% but secretly you all are wannabe elitist's so that makes you a liar....you don't represent me....i thought OWS represented me ....hmmmm....by the way i have a masters in mathmatics.....
You stupid fucking cunt. You have the brain cells of a gnat. I don't claim to represent anybody. The last person that I would represent is fucking troll like you. Fuck your degree. Nobody gives a fuck.
Goodness you are nasty and foul mouthed. Just a bit of advice, a calmer more sane approach might motivate people to listen to your ideas a little more. If you have any....
Really? Put your dog Kellywanker on a leash and then get back to me.
Just saying....
No, you aren't actually saying anything. That is par for course.