Forum Post: There Is Only One Issue in America 1
Posted 12 years ago on Dec. 12, 2011, 9:32 p.m. EST by squuid
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Yes. Getting money out of politics is the number one issue of this movement.
Share this with everyone you come into contact with. The people in the office I work at think the movement is a bunch of hippies looking for a handout because they are buying what the establishment media is saying. For the sake of our children I hope people wake up to the real cause! Occupying a foreclosure or getting some new financial regulation in place will do nothing if, on day 2, the corporations and special interests still have the ability to influence our laws through campaign donations and paid lobbying.
AND: Getting money out of politics is a goal that people from all points on the political spectrum can agree on. More people working toward the same goal = more power to get results. We can argue about our ideological differences on other issues later...AFTER we all get together to demand an end to the corruption that hurts EVERYONE, regardless of their ideological/political positions.
You said it! The support is already there, but the message is being lost. We need to shout it louder!!! The people at the office I work at think the protesters are all homeless hippies wanting handouts because that is all there hear on the TV. They laugh about the protests, we then talk about the corrupting influence of corporate money, they agree it is bad and they want it gone, but they do not connect it with these protests. The media would have a real hard time spinning things if the message came through clearly.
Thank you. Please check out this post also: http://occupywallst.org/forum/ows-image-problem-jeopardizes-potential-support/#comment-434438
Also, check out Dylan Ratigan's website, and his petition for a constitutional amendment prohibiting the private financing of campaigns: http://www.getmoneyout.com/ http://www.dylanratigan.com/
I try to get this point across whenever I have the chance but this forum could use some moderating. A few weeks ago this was the clear message on these pages, today, the forum is all over the place. I don't get it, but I'm not running it so I only post on seemingly sane posts. Let's not give up though.
Have you signed the petition at www.getmoneyout.org ?
And, are you aware that Rep. Ted Deutch is introducing the "Occupied Amendment" to get corporate money out of our elections?
I agree, Yes and Yes. I was reading the other night, and came across a poll that said the majority of Americans already support the concept of reducing influence of corporations and special interests in our politics. But unfortunately rather than going for the real prize of gathering popular support to fix our election laws ( and thus opening the door for the American people to call the shots) we are losing the PR war by occupying ports and foreclosures. Makes good TV (for the establishment media) but won't mean a thing if the corporations can still buy off our politicians at the end of the day.
I understand what you are saying and agree it should be the number one issue above all others, but the protests that are going on around the country are calling attention to this movement as a whole and that is not a bad thing.
I agree - it was a moment of frustration.
I hear you.
On a hunch, I just checked. There have been well over 100 articles posted within the last 24 hours hyping up a possible Bruce Springsteen tour. As usual, the ticket prices will be fucking OBSCENE.
Guess who plays guitar for Springsteen. Go ahead everyone. Take a wild guess. I'll give you a clue: A few weeks ago, I promised to rip on any filthy disgusting rich celebrity pig who had the nerve to promote themselves on this site.
I'll give you another clue:
Springsteen and Van Zandt just made the list.
How do you suppose they feel about the obscene concentration of wealth?
Just fine. Thats how.
As promised, I will create another page tomorrow ripping on Springsteen and Van Zandt. They better hope I don't get any dirt on them. If I do, you can bet the days pay that a Springsteen ticket will cost you that I will post it here.
No excuses. Filthy disgusting rich celebrity pigs stay the fuck out of OWS.
Make that two. This is where some of that money comes from.
http://occupywallst.org/forum/make-a-stand-join-the-clan/
The Revolution starts here!
What a shock: I never would have guessed it: Not only is the filthy disgusting rich celebrity pig using this site to promote himself (through his filthy disgusting rich guitarist), but he, like so many other filthy disgusting rich celebrity pigs, is a tax dodger. Check this out:
MYFOXNY.COM – Bon Jovi and Bruce Springsteen have been making hit music for years and its no surprise that they've earned enough money to buy big mansions with acres of property, but what might surprise you is the huge tax breaks they, and others, are getting.
It turns out, as far as New Jersey tax collectors are concerned, that they are farmers.
Almost a million acres in New Jersey are certified as farmland. Owners who own at least five acres, practice some kind of agriculture, or manage the trees on their property and sell $500 worth of goods a year qualify for a significant tax break.
They do have to pay the full taxes on their homes, and non-farm property.
Through a trust, Bruce Springsteen owns more than 200 acres in Colts Neck. the taxes for his house and three acres are more than $138,000. But because of the farm tax break, the tax bill on a little more than 200 additional acres is less than $5,000. Town officials say he has horses and an organic farmer working some of the land. A lawyer for the trust had no comment.
In another part of Monmouth County, Bon Jovi has and estate on the Navesink River. Taxes on the mansion and some property add up to $295,68 but his tax bill on an additional 6.85 aces is $104 because he raises honeybees.
A spokesman for Bon Jovi issued a statement saying, "Jon is scrupulous about paying his fair share of taxes. The exemption for raising honey bees existed long before he purchased that land, and he continues to employ a beekeeper and raise honeybees…"
Max Weinberg, E-Street Band drummer, and former band leader on Late Night With Conan O'Brien owns 36 heavily wooded acres near Bon Jovi. Taxes on his home and two acres are $49,068. But the tax bill for the additional 34 acres is $122 because he sells wood.
It's not just celebrities getting the break.
Steve Katz owns pharmacies in Brooklyn. He moved to Colt's Neck so he and his family could have horses and a place to ride. He pays $18,616 in taxes for his house and one acre of land. The tax bill on an additional five acres of farmland is only $65 because he sells hay.
And 9 other homeowners in the same subdivision get the farm tax break.
The tax break law dates back to the 60s, And in the 90's when Republican Christine Todd Whitman was first running for governor it became a big issue because she and her husband claimed the tax break for their farms.
But many say these tax breaks help preserve New Jersey open space and limit development. And Middletown manager Tony Mercantante thinks that can be a good thing.
Merchantante says, "Farming certainly is an activity that the state's been looking to preserve to the extend possible and farmland assessment has allowed farmers to survive."
People in favor or the tax breaks worry that backlash will force a change that hurts real farmers and possible jeopardize agriculture in New Jersey.
But Mercantante says change could occur, and bring more tax money to town's like his, without hurting real farmers.
"I think there should be a sliding scale approach to farmland assessment based upon the extend of your farming activity," Merchantante says.
New York State has a tougher standard. It requires land owners sell $10,000 worth of goods for the farming exemption. That's a dramatic contrast with New Jersey's $500 in sales.
State Senator Jennifer Beck thinks the time may be right to change the law.
Beck says, "I think it is unfair to our other property taxpayers. If you are a fake farmer, and you don't legitimately farm, you are getting a property tax break you are forcing your neighbor to pick up your tab. And that was not the intent of the law. It's violation of the public trust."
It's not just celebrities and people who like the country who get this big break. Large corporations are holding on to cropland and hiring farmers so they can score tax breaks.
Because of the complicated tax rules it's not clear how much money the state might gain if the law is changed. A spokesman for New Jersey Governor Christie said the issue isn't on his radar yet, but it might be in future.
If you don't trust FOX, you are welcome to do your own research. Springsteen is another filthy disgusting rich celebrity pig tax dodger.
Just to make it crystal clear: The filthy disgusting rich celebrity pig has chosen to farm some miniscule little sliver of his 200+ acres specifically to save tens or hundreds of thousands in annual taxes.
Mark my words: I will get better dirt on Springsteen and post it tomorrow. Its become very predictable. Like shooting fish in a barrel. The filthy rich are always hypocrite pigs. Always without exception.
Bingo! You hit it on the head. For the sake of this movement it better figure out what the root cause is because most of what I see getting talked about is just the symptoms. Here's my 2 cents:
There are a lot of improvements that need to be made. The list reforms people Americans want to see is long and varied depending on who you talk to. That said, I believe there is one reform that would provide the American people the best chances of seeing other meaningful reforms actually happen - that is REAL, loop-hope free CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM! I have seen others on this site calling this the "fulcrum" or pivotal issue. Right now the current legalized bribery, pay-to-play system of campaign donations and paid lobbyists has disenfranchised the American voter. Until this is fixed, any other reform the politicians may try to placate us with (be it a change to healthcare, clamping down predatory school loans, new financial regulations, etc.) will be about as effective as a farmer putting a new roof on his CHICKEN COOP, but still letting the FOX guard it.
We need to go back to the original political currency. Instead of the current system of who can collect the most money from corporations and special interests it should be who has the BEST IDEAS to EFFECTIVELY RUN THE COUNTRY (we don't need "Wealth Redistribution," what we need is "Political Influence Redistribution")!
For the sake our our children and future generations of Americans, we need to take back our democracy from the rich and powerful who are using their vast sums of money to "speak" as if they represent millions of Americans. This "Corporate Personhood" that has crept into our laws is allowing them to manipulating our policies in their favor at the expense of the average American (the recent "Citizens United" Supreme Court ruling is a miscarriage of justice and must be reversed. The $50 or $100 a normal American may give to a political campaign becomes meaningless when corporations or other special interests are handing our millions to buy political access to the decision making process.
For decades now the corporations and special interests have had our "representatives" bought and paid for (both on the right and the left). Concentrating our efforts on getting the money out of our politics is the best way we can create an environment in which further reforms can be realized. Until we end the current system of legalized bribery (campaign donations) and paid lobbying our politicians will continue to be the LAP DOGS of the corporations and special interests. What we need first and foremost is real, loop-hole free CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM!!!! If the corruption is not dealt with first, the chance of any other meaningful reforms becoming a reality is almost zero - the special interests will just use their money to buy votes and put forward bills that create loop-holes or otherwise twist the law in their favor. If we want our children to live in a country where there vote matters, we need to get the money out of our politics, otherwise they will increasingly become the 21st century version of the "landless peasant." Spread the word - End the LEGALIZED BRIBERY!!! CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM needs to be THE main goal of the protests!!!
No, you have to get corrupt companies out of Washington!
http://occupywallst.org/forum/make-a-stand-join-the-clan/
The Revolution starts here!