Forum Post: The Federal Reserve is NOT Private !
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 28, 2011, 9 p.m. EST by Rico
(3027)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
I quote from the Encyclopedia of Business and Finance, 2nd ed. which you can read at http://www.encyclopedia.com/topic/Federal_Reserve_System.aspx#2-1G2:1552100128-full
'Designed by Congress and subject to congressional authority, the Fed is a politically independent and financially self-sufficient federal agency ... The Fed's primary policy-making group is the seven-member Board of Governors. Appointed by the president and confirmed by the Senate, members serve for one fourteen-year term only. A member who is appointed to fill an unexpired term may be appointed for an additional full term. From among the seven members, the Board's chairman and vice chairman are also appointed and confirmed by the president and the Senate for four-year terms."
If you like, you can also read Title 12 paragraph 3 of the Federal Code that created the Fed at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/12/usc_sup_01_12_10_3.html . It says the same thing in legalese.
Though the member banks of the Federal Reserve System ARE private, the Governing Board sets POLICY. We The People control the Federal Reserve. This relationship where a regulating agency works closely with the industry being regulated is replicated in the FCC, the FDA, etc. In ALL cases, We the People set policy, and the regulated companies have just as much influence over policy as we decide their input merits.
As for this whole panic over printing money, people need to remember money is just a token we use to facilitate commerce, and it has no intrinsic value. The VALUE in an economy is defined by the goods and services exchanged in commerce, NOT the number of tokens. People who obsess over these tokens, whether the rich who hoard them or the poor who vest them with too much meaning, suffer from a delusion. See my post at http://occupywallst.org/forum/what-is-money/
Note that if we did NOT maintain an elastic supply of tokens, we would be in DEEP trouble right now because the rich and China hold so MANY of our tokens that there wouldn't be enough left to facilitate commerce. Fortunately, we can just print more tokens to ensure there are enough to meet our needs.
The Federal Reserve is your FRIEND !
And no, the Fed is NOT a friend, it was a corrupt concept from the beginning.
G. Edward Griffin is an expert researcher on the subject, please watch http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxCX_D5xVLM
The FED is your friend? Are you insane? maybe if you are in the 1% and own a lot of stock in one of the member banks that own the FED it is, but for the rest of us it isn't. When they start buying my toxic assets up like my underwater house at premium prices like they buy the elites toxic assets up when they do QE, or when they give me 0% interest loans, maybe I would believe that.
The member banks that own the New York Federal Reserve control the entire Federal Reserve system, here is the list, and no its not that Kuhn-Loeb Lazzard Brothers Israel Moses seif conspiracy theory list, there is a more accurate one the the FEDs own website. http://www.newyorkfed.org/banks.html Second District State Member Banks Adirondack Bank Adirondack Trust Company Alden State Bank Amboy Bank Banco Popular De Puerto Rico Banco Popular North America Bank of Cattaraugus Bank of Millbrook Bank of New York Mellon BPD Bank Chemung Canal Trust Company Community Bank of Bergen County, N.J. Deutsche Bank Trust Company Americas Empire State Bank Five Star Bank Goldman Sachs Bank USA Gotham Bank of New York Manufacturers and Traders Trust Company Mizuho Corporate Bank (USA) Orange County Trust Company Peapack-Gladstone Bank Solvay Bank Tioga State Bank
As you can see one of the Megabanks (Goldman Sachs) is on the list, and many of those other banks are connected to the big 6 megabanks. This is why JP Morgan Chase CEO Jamie Dimon also sits on the board of the New York FED, they are one of the owners.
John F. Kennedy vs. the Federal Reserve
On June 4, 1963, President Kennedy signed Executive Order 11110, to strip the Bank of its power to loan money to the United States Government at interest. With the stroke of a pen, President Kennedy declared that the privately owned Federal Reserve Bank would soon be out of business.
http://www.john-f-kennedy.net/thefederalreserve.htm
The FED will cease to exist as taxpayers become informed and tell other taxpayers. The news media and Congress will have no choice but to meet the demands of grass roots America.
The POLICY MAKERS of the Federal Reserve are appointed by the President subject to approval by Congress. This is a simple matter of LAW. Please read Title 12 chaper 3 of the Federal Code.
The POLICY makers of the Fed DO consult with the banks they regulate, MUCH as the FCC and FDA consult with the industries THEY regulate. The POLICY MAKERS assign whatever weight they DESIRE to the inputs they receive from a NUMBER of sources, but the officials APPOINTED by the President subject to Congressional approval MAKE THE DECISIONS.
The Federal Reserve is NOT private, but the Federal Reserve SYSTEM does include private banks. The POLICY making arm of the Federal Reserve is comprised of US Government officials assigned by the President subject to approval by Congress in EXACTLY the same fashion as used to fill MANY Government offices.
Cute cartoon: The American Dream By The Provocateur Network http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPWH5TlbloU
Allan Greenspan, former Chairman of the Federal Reserve, Board of Governors admits it is private
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TjKn_Dxfw3M
And the fed it self admits it as well
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uEJRjGesumo Don't be a George soros troll George soros doesn't want you to know the truth about the fed. He send his trolls here to confuse people so they keep talking about 99 percent bullshit. Instead of the real enemy the FED
[SIGH] This is a matter of FACT and LAW not a matter of opinion, no matter WHO you quote or WHAT opinions people spout.
Quoting from Title 12 chapter 3, sub-chapter II, section 241 available at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/pdf/uscode12/lii_usc_TI_12_CH_3_SC_II_SE_241.pdf , "The Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System (hereinafter referred to as the “Board”) shall be composed of seven members, to be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate..."
This is FACT and LAW, not an OPINION, and it is not subject to DEBATE.
The Federal Reserve Board of Governors is an independent (its own word) entity “within” the government (i.e., something much like an independent, internal parasite in a host organism), with 14 year, reform-proof terms (i.e., only one of 7 can be replaced every two years).
The Fed was deliberately designed to appear as a sort of government body to hide the fact that it is a private banking cartel whose member banks share in the vast profits of seigniorage (i.e., the difference between the cost of printing/minting or otherwise creating money [a few cents per $100], and its face value). Yes, the Department of the Treasury does still mint our coins (at the US mint) but that represents under 1% of the US money supply, the great bulk of which is simply bankbook entries – electronic keyboard impulses in computer memories – created by banks on-the-spot to fund loans they make in response to loans applications their “customers” submit (hence the competition by banks for your loan applications and credit card borrowing).
Wouldn’t you love to have that exclusive ability – simply to type numbers on your keyboard creating bank accounts, and then write checks or charge purchases to those accounts (actually, no – it is gravely unjust to everyone else and is impoverishing the world for that power to be in private hands).
The Board of Governors of the System consists of 7 members, one appointed every two years (one term begins every two years, on February 1 of even-numbered years, a full year after inauguration day) by the President and confirmed by the Senate for 14 year terms. Wow -those are really long terms. Why? Let’s see: if a new President comes into office pledged to reform the Fed, end its independence from effective government oversight, throw the rascals out and replace them with his own appointees, he had better be very patient, as he can only replace one member every two years. So in his four year term (10 years less than Fed Governors – terms) he can replace only two of the 7 members. Of course, he had better be able to sustain the ire of the remaining Governors (almost all connected to financial institutions indirectly in various academic and think-tank institutions financed by banks and bank grants or loans, or which they hope to join in revolving door relationships after their single terms are up), who can run the economy up, down or sideways, in the interim.
But assuming the President can sustain the fight with the Fed, its bank-PAC financed cheerleaders in the Senate, voters upset over a suddenly sinking economy, the banks who control the Fed and the media giants they also own, then all this brave but foolhardy President has to do is get elected to a second term, and hang on long enough to appoint two more Board members. Thus, assuming all of this goes well, in the span of seven years (a glacial pace in American politics), near the end of his second term, he can finally begin some reform – if he manages to get his four appointees confirmed, is still in office and has any allies left – even in his own party. We think the prefixed word quasi-governmental is a good one, if you understand quasi- to mean pseudo.
http://www.themoneymasters.com/faqs/
So... the people that run it say that it is privately owned, and... you disagree? I'm a bit confused what the hold up here is for you. Is it because the President gets to pick from a list of people that the Owners compiled? Is it because there's a time limit? (14 years is enough time to make insane amounts of money and destroy world economies.)
You go on about how it's a "Matter of law" but all I can see is that the Law allows the president a token gesture in that general direction every once in awhile to appoint the man who gave him the money to appoint him.
It's a bribery system. FED Man gives Running Presidential Candidate tons of money, and in return FED Man gets appointed. It's a pretty simple scam. I'm failing to see why you think it's benefiting you.
The "token gesture" you allude to is the same "token gesture" the Founding Fathers established for Supreme Court justices.
The difference being that a Supreme Court Justice then acts in the Public Courts in front of the Nation.
The Federal Reserve does not. It operates behind closed doors, with no public scrutiny. It is able to lend enormous sums of taxpayer money to anyone, at any time, and that will be unaccountable.
The Federal Reserve is responsible for the American Economy, and the people don't know what it's doing. That's the core of the issue.
Doesn't it bother you that no one has been prosecuted? Doesn't it bother you that no one has even gone to trial over this horrific debacle of an economic meltdown? If a Supreme Court Judge managed to do the kind of damage the FED did, wouldn't they be forced to resign in disgrace? Where are those actions for the people who are responsible?
Your assertion that the Federal Reserve operates completely behind closed doors is false. Want to see the Fed's balance sheet? Go to http://www.federalreserve.gov/monetarypolicy/bst_fedsbalancesheet.htm . Want to see the current state of the Maiden Lane accounts where we stuck Bear Stearns and AIG ? Go to http://newyorkfed.org/markets/maidenlane.html .
I posit that the core of the issue, as you call it, is that few Americans are capable of understanding the Fed yet they know it has great power and that scares them. I wouldn't take a 10:1 bet that anyone reading this post will even go look at the accounts I linked to above, and if they did, they probably wouldn't put in the effort and self education required to even understand what they show.
The meltdown. Let's see, if we trace it back to it's root cause, it was the general population that watched "Flip This House," decided "you can't lose money in real-estate," signed up for loans they either couldn't afford or intended to pay-off in 6 months after their house value went up by $50,000, then decided not to repay what they had borrowed. This is how all bubbles start, including the infamous Dutch Tulip Panic (which occurred under the gold standard); people just get into a frenzy of greed.
Banks do what banks do. They lend money, and We The People asked them to do so. In the old days, they wouldn't lend to people who couldn't afford it, but thanks to technological and statistical "innovations," they figured out they could bundle the risk and sell it off, so they had no reason to deny any loan and lose the origination fees. The credit rating agencies were overwhelmed by the number of instruments moving through them and they employed another technological "innovation" in the form of computer grading and stamped the debt "AA." The problem was that none of the assumptions coded into all the computers included a term for systemic downturn, and the entire system collapsed when that downturn occurred due to consumers FINALLY asking whether a house was REALLY worth the asking price. This is how bubbles ALWAYS collapse... sanity sets in.
We the People went nuts. We the People signed up for mortgages. We the People walked away from those mortgages. All the other factors are secondary including the policies of the Fed, Fannie and Freddie, technological innovation, etc. Per the Zeitgeist movement, the financial system is much like a living breathing life form that evolves. I'm not sure there IS much blame to be placed (other than where criminal intent can be proven). All we can do is learn from it and try to ensure it doesn't happen again. You've already seen that process begin in the form of revisions to the law regarding finance practices.
"We the people walked away from those mortgages."
Yeah, so what? All a mortgage contract says is that if you, the borrower, stop making payments (for ANY reason), the bank gets the property. END OF STORY. So if a homeowner finds himself underwater on a rapidly depreciating home and decides to stop making his mortgage payments and hand the keys to the bank, that homeowner is FULFILLING the mortgage contract! That's the deal that both he and the bank signed! Now, of course, normally the bank would have required the borrower to put 20% down in cash, which the borrower would forfeit if he defaulted on the loan. That, of course, makes perfect sense--this way, the borrower has a good amount of skin in the game and is much less likely to walk. But when the banks started offering a gigantic asset like a house for little or no money down, what did they THINK was going to happen? LOL! "Free houses, everyone! And if you discover later that you can't afford it, you can just drop the keys off and lose NO MONEY!" LOLOLOL...what kind of idiot WOULDN'T take that deal? Are you nuts? Sorry, pal--the banks got greedy and sloppy, and now they're paying the price. As the old saying goes, "Bulls make money, and bears make money, but pigs get SLAUGHTERED."
Commodities Futures Modernization Act of 2000 and Gram-Leach- Bliley..Read these bills and realize that these laws which caused the housing bubble and TBTF banks were legislated on the behest of the Corporations and the Banking industry...Enron and Citibank to be specific.
The 2008 Financial Meltdown was Enron on a national scale.
Sure, laws and regulations contributed to the problem (as I acknowledge above), but at the very core of it all is the average American signing a mortgage they either couldn't afford or had no intent on repaying.
Sorry, the banks signed the same document--and they're supposed to be the "experts." LOL...too funny...
Rico I blame the people who invent the scheme and yes the victim can hold certain responsibility for being a sucker for this American Dream that gets peddled about and people get conned into..
So... In your mind, the problem isn't the Bankers, or the System, it's the people.
Your suggesting that the people who took the loans are the ones to blame. The people who put faith in the system and then got screwed by it are the ones to blame?
Yes, and it's hard to argue against it. If those mortgages hadn't gone band, the crash wouldn't have happened, correct ? That puts the people who signed for them at the very start of the chain of events.
If you have ever bought a house, you are familiar with the Federal Truth in Lending Action Disclosure you have to sign as a part of a home loan package. This form very specifically tells people not to listen to anything the banker says regarding your loan and that the summary provided on the form reflects the true costs of what you are signing up to without any fine print. It's a one page form and it's very simple. Everyone who got a home loan signed it. Nobody made them do so.
Do I think the "SYSTEM" let us down ? ABSOLUTELY.
First, start with education. EVERY citizen of a capitalist society should be REQUIRED to complete classes in basic financial management of their household. This education is a LOT more important than many other things we require our schools to teach, and we let millions of Americans enter the capitalist system with zero education. With a little education about finances, bubbles, and so forth, people probably would have been more careful in making their decisions.
Second, if you've ever bought a home, you're intimately familiar with the importance of the "conforming loan limit" set by Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. This limit virtually DEFINES "affordable" in the housing market. Unfortunately, they bowed to political pressure and kept jack up the limit year by year at rates completely unsupportable by the historical trend of reasonable movement in housing prices. Why would they do this? Hmmm.... maybe because of contributions by the realtors, carpenters, electricians, and labors as shown at http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php ?
Third, the Federal Reserve could have slowed the bubble by jacking rates, but they did not. I'm not sure why they did that, but it sure didn't help that they kept money cheap.
Fourth, regulatory agencies responsible for overseeing the financial system. They let flawed "innovations" enter the system, and those "innovations" were flawed at their core.
Fifth, the deregulation of the banking system under Bush.
Sixth, the financial system. I put them last because they all behaved VERY predictably. They seek profit wherever they can find it, and they push risk out of the way whenever they can. They can be counted on to do whatever they can to improve profit whether it's good for the country or not. It's their Zen nature, and expecting them to do anything different than they did is like expecting a scorpion not to sting. The breakdown is in our oversight and regulation of them. We let the scorpions out of the cage, so to speak, and then got mad because they stung people.
So why did we let the scorpions out of the cage ? Perhaps because the Realtors, carpenters, electricians, laborers, and banks identified at http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php wanted them let out ? That's why I wrote the proposal at http://occupywallst.org/forum/we-the-people-in-order-to-a-proposal/
Why should every citizen be required to complete classes in basic financial management? The banks were left holding the bag on mortgage contracts that THEY signed! Shouldn't THEY be taking the classes?
I'm fairly confused as to what you're arguing here frankly. You open by saying "It's the people who accepted bad loans from the people who were supposed to tell them that they were bad loans." Which would be only true in the most technical of ways. It would be like saying it is my responsibility that my car exploded suddenly because I should know that cars can explode from time to time.
And by the end you're arguing my point, which is that the system is broken. And your proposal is as radical an idea as I've seen in the OWS movement to date.
I'm a bit confused what you're fighting for.
Your exploding car example is overly dramatic. You DO know how your actions can affect your car, right? You don't red-line it, you check it's fluids now and then, you consult experts in its repair, and you know not to run it into something. People need this same level of understanding regarding their personal finances.
In my prior comment, I acknowledged there are many things that need a 'tune-up.' If you personally go under your hood and attempt this, you better know what you're doing. It's quite dangerous to try to fix something so complex if you don't understand it or have an overly simplistic view of how it operates based on erroneous information.
Campaign finance reform is hardly 'radical.'
Ben Bernanke was first nominated by George W. Bush, of the Bush Crime Family, who brought us into wars and bankruptcy. Look it up Rico and educate yourself And Benny boy was re-nominated by Obama – whose presidential campaign was mostly funded by Wall Street– need I say more?
It seems to me that you are you one of the enemies of OWS, just another obtuse shill for the Fed who comes on our forum to demean and denounce the democratic principles that WE THE PEOPLE are standing for.
Never doubt the power of a group of committed people to change the world. That's about the only way it has ever happened in the past
While on this site, I kept running into folks saying things about the Federal Reserve, so I did some research. Surprised by how wrong much of what I was hearing was, I posted links to the truth lest people make uninformed decisions.
As usual for your crowd, anyone who disgrees with your unsubstantiated opions is a "shill" or a "troll" . If you had taken even one moment to check into me befpore judging me. you might have found my post at http://occupywallst.org/forum/one-percenter-ready-to-join-if/ or my proposal at http://occupywallst.org/forum/we-the-people-in-order-to-a-proposal/
People like you scare the crap out of most of America because you simply will not engage in reasoned or civil discourse. People who behave the way you do discredit the many fine people here who do so.
Let me point out that in the post you refer to, you repeatedly mention “OWC” – not OWS. Perhaps you are just an absent minded or dyslectic conservative, and therefore deserves some compassion, not the ridicule your sort often spews on OWS protestors.
It’s quite obvious that you DO NOT UNDERSTAND the history of the infamous Federal Reserve banks, so here’s a well-researched, factual and accurate documentary that will help you. How the Federal Reserve Banking System began http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6507136891691870450#
And this is a must see for your education. G. Edward Griffin, author of "The Creature from Jekyll Island: A Second Look at the Federal Reserve" http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6507136891691870450#docid=-1353648499382948626
I must say, unlike you, I am not confused about the purpose and goals of OWS To your credit, however, is your statement. “I respect the passion, knowledge, and rational approach that many people here exhibited in our discussions. I'm REALLY glad I spent some time here getting to know some of you rather than listening exclusively to the media.”
Good luck you Rico
G. Edward Griffin is NOT an economist, he is an AUTHOR, and authors write books when they see a market for them. YOU are his market, so of course you agree.
Here's a short bio of G. Edward Griffin from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G._Edward_Griffin :
"G. Edward Griffin (born November 7, 1931) is an American film producer, author, and political lecturer.[1] He is perhaps best known as the author of The Creature from Jekyll Island (1994), a critique of much modern economic theory and practice, specifically the Federal Reserve System.
Starting as a child actor, he became a radio station manager before age 20. He then began a career of producing documentaries and books on often-debated topics like cancer, Noah's ark, and the Federal Reserve System, as well as on libertarian views of the Supreme Court of the United States, terrorism, subversion, and foreign policy. Since the 1970s, Griffin has promoted laetrile as a cancer treatment,[2] a view considered quackery by the medical community.[3][4] He has also promoted the Durupınar site as hosting the original Noah's ark, against skeptics as well as near-Ararat Creationists."
According to G. Edward Griffin's own web site, his only FINANCIAL credential is a certificate in Financial Planning from the College of Financial Planning in Denver, which was founded in 1972. Per the college's web-site, the courses required to obtain a Certificate in Financial Planning are:
CFPE 1101 Financial Planning Process & Insurance
CFPE 1102 Investment Planning
CFPE 1103 Income Tax Planning
CFPE 1104 Retirement Planning & Employee Benefits
CFPE 1105 Estate Planning
THIS is your "EXPERT" ... ZERO knowledge of finance but for 5 classes at what is essentially a community college. He's an AUTHOR who has made a CAREER out of feeding the suspicions of folks like yourself.
“The study of money, above all other fields in economics, is one in which complexity is used to disguise truth or to evade truth, not to reveal it. The process by which banks create money is so simple the mind is repelled. With something so important, a deeper mystery seems only decent.” John Kenneth Galbraith (1908- ), former professor of economics at Harvard, writing in ‘Money: Whence it came, where it went’ (1975).
There's a nice reference. I'll go read the full text of what he said.
See... this is you making a direct attack on a person, instead of on their points. Does it matter if he is an economist? The more we find out about the corrupted economic system the more we come to see that it is basically all propped up on faulty premises. Economy is basically a Religion now. What's the "Unseen Hand of the Market" but a god?
If you wish to discuss Mr. Griffin's points, that'd be super. But attacking his background is simply FOX-ish.
Yes, it matters whether the people advocating a position actually know anything about the subject. Neither you nor I have the time to become experts in the field, so we end up formulating our opinions based on what we read. There are people saying anything you want to hear today, and we are faced with a choice: Do we adopt the positions of those who lack any formal education in the subject and profit from their opinion, or do we adopt the positions of those with formal education who's positions are widely regarded by their peers in that profession. Nobel Prizes are awarded Economics and the average man with no education is not capable of understanding this highly complex field.
Hm... there is a vast difference between a person knowing something, and a person getting a piece of paper from a corrupted institution for it. There have been a few documentaries out there about why the current economic system is corrupt. The best one I've seen is called "Inside Job." It lays it out pretty clearly that the economic principles that guide the nation, (IE, Economists) are basically shills.
Right. Anyone who disagrees with you is corrupted, no matter that they have spent a lifetime researching the topic and are well regard by their peers who have done the same. This is rather self-justifying. Per your logic, I guess my opinion on physics is just as good as Einstein's or Feynman's !
By the way, if you want to read an interesting and credible new paper on Economics, read the one at http://atlas.media.mit.edu/media/atlas/pdf/HarvardMIT_AtlasOfEconomicComplexity.pdf . This paper presents recent research showing there may be a more direct way to understand the distribution of wealth across the nations of the world. The download is a bit slow as the paper was just published, and Economists/Students are downloading it like mad !
Einstein's was mostly self-educated, he finished 3 years of elementary school and 7 years of middle and high school which he quit at 15. All the years of indoctrination and practice of authority obedience doesn't mean much in our technological age. Here is quote for you, by Einstein btw. "Education is what remains after one has forgotten everything he learned in school." - Albert Einstein Here is another quote from Einstein too: "The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil." - Albert Einstein And you need to know all the economic complexity only if you what to try to maintain the system on life support while it naturally tends to collapse on it's own inefficiency.
1) Your opinion on physics is just as good as Einstein's or Feynman's. If you have points to make, and no one can refute them, then they must be acknowledged. To do otherwise would be disingenuous.
2) I have little difficulty saying that the people responsible for keeping an obviously abusive system of power and control in tact are themselves corrupted. There's a wonderful documentary called "The Inside Job" that talks about this very thing.
3) I'll download that and check it out right now.
I'm only through the first chapter and I already see the problem. In these people's minds everything ties back to "Products" and how to best make them. It's consumerism at it's core.
Why don't we make an economy for people? Why don't we make an economy that sustains humanity, and isn't based on Greed and Selfishness?
I don't think the authors are trying to advocate anything about how the world should BE, they are simply trying to improve our understanding of what it IS, a routine perspective in all sciences.
Yes, I can publish my opinions. But like those who published "cold fusion," I would likely be shown very quickly that I don't understand what I'm talking about. One way to avoid that fate is to understand the work that has come before so the world will take me more seriously. Most of the references people cite in this forum have NOT been subjected to peer review, and most that have are widely refuted.
I take no position as to the future end-state of the world economy. It has and will continue to evolve. If I were to take the Zeitgeist position, I would have to point out that the very nature of society, civilization and knowledge being an evolutionary life-form contradicts the entire concept of abrupt change; we can't MAKE it happen, it evolves, and TRYING to make it happen is as dangerous as trying to "improve" the human genome. We'll get there, but it will by evolutionary steps.
Why you should be scared of the Fed Reserve Cartel. This an amazing video,http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6507136891691870450# thanks. I hope everyone watches this including Rico. Rico needs to break the spell of denial and or be man/woman enough to admit they are a Shill. Can't wait to watch the next link you provided.
Rico how can anyone possibly " engage in reasoned or civil discourse " about the merits or otherwise of an organisation that shrouds itself in total secrecy and is impenetrable even to be elected representatives in Congress?
If the Federal Reserve was apart of the Federal Government then please explain why we the taxpayers pay interest to the Fed for printing our money for us? Every cent of our federal income tax dollars goes to pay the interest on the money that the Fed prints. Anytime this country operated free of the International Central Bankers, this country has prospered. They are the root of ALL evil on the planet. I want to see EVERY central banker on the planet in prison where they belong and the wealth of all of the nations they stole it from returned.
The Fed is PRIVATELY owned, the OP is trying spread more BS disinformation. Watch the documentary called, "Money Masters, the History of the Federal Reserve". It's quite enlightening.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=7757684583209015812
I refer people to REPUTABLE sources including the Federal Law. You send people to watch an OPINION piece.
Do NONE of you do your OWN research to form your OWN opinions based on FACT or do you ALL simply PARROT whatever OPINION you hear that happens to appeal to your FEARS and SUSPICIONS ?
hmmm NONE of you do your OWN research to form your OWN opinions based on FACT or do you ALL simply PARROT whatever OPINION you hear that happens to appeal to your FEARS and SUSPICIONS ?
sounds like a very apt description of you and your conservative "associates"
Interesting comment since I have published my sources and they include Federal Law, Encyclopedias, etc. In contrast, you offer nothing but opinions of those who agree with you.
"The financial system has been turned over to the Federal Reserve Board. That Board ministers the finance system by authority of a purely profiteering group. The system is Private, conducted for the sole purpose of obtaining the greatest possible profits from the use of other people's money" -- Charles A. Lindbergh Sr., 1923
"The Federal Reserve bank buys government bonds without one penny..." — Congressman Wright Patman, Congressional Record, Sept 30, 1941
"We have, in this country, one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever known. I refer to the Federal Reserve Board. This evil institution has impoverished the people of the United States and has practically bankrupted our government. It has done this through the corrupt practices of the moneyed vultures who control it". — Congressman Louis T. McFadden in 1932 (Rep. Pa)
"The Federal Reserve banks are one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever seen. There is not a man within the sound of my voice who does not know that this nation is run by the International bankers — Congressman Louis T. McFadden (Rep. Pa)
Yes, some other people, NONE of whom are economists supports your view. Does that somehow make that view RIGHT ? Would it help you if I went and found some OTHER people who DISAGREE with you ? There are plenty, ESPECIALLY in the Eurozone these days.
"The powers of financial capitalism had [a] far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert by secret agreements arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences." -- Quote from Caroll Quigley's Tragedy and Hope, Chapter 20
LOL ! Quigley was a professor of history, not economics, and his greatest "contribution" to the world were the conspiracy theories behind the John Birch Society. He used correlation to suggest causation without any supporting evidence. His irresponsible methods fueled the fears of the common man who doesn't understand the world and is thus fearful of it and wont to blame mysterious forces.
If you'd like to read materials promoting irrational fear and suspicion visit the John Birch Society web page. There you can buy such well regarded books as Tragedy and Hope, None Dare Call It Conspiracy, etc.
I personally think Caroll Quiqley and the John Birchers are incomplete in their conspiracy theories. They left out the Illuminati, Knights Templar, Masons, Catholic Church, and my neighbor Mike who I'm SURE is up to no good !
Carroll Quigley was born in Boston, and attended Harvard University, where he studied history and earned B.A, M.A., and Ph.D. degrees. He taught at Princeton University, and then at Harvard, and then at the School of Foreign Service at Georgetown University from 1941 to 1976.
"When Bill Clinton was nominated by the Democratic Party for the presidency his acceptance speech ended with a tribute to a college professor who had been Clinton's mentor at Georgetown. Clinton said that this professor had seen the future more clearly than anyone. His name was Caroll Quigley.
Quigley claims to be the only man ever allowed access to the private files of the the Council on Foreign Relations. Quigley said that he was allowed to read all their papers from its inception, and that the CFR had a clear, organized, rational plan to eliminate war and to make life - ah - efficient.
In "Tragedy adn Hope," Quigley said that he approved of the plan; what he didn't approve of was the secrecy. But before he died, in1977, Quigley gave a series of lectures at Georgetown, called the Oscar Iden lectures. In the Iden lectures, Quigley said that he no longer accepted this as a moral or a decent thing to do, and that we had to take up arms against this plan.
Zero credentials as an economist, and strong money motives are sufficient to make me skeptical of his value as a reference in any reasoned debate. He ALSO advocates laetrill as a cancer treatment and takes positions on Noah's Ark, and he ALSO makes money from advocating THESE positions as well.
“Banking was conceived in iniquity and was born in sin. The bankers own the earth. Take it away from them, but leave them the power to create money, and with the flick of the pen they will create enough deposits to buy it back again. However, take it away from them, and all the great fortunes like mine will disappear and they ought to disappear, for this would be a happier and better world to live in. But, if you wish to remain the slaves of bankers and pay the cost of your own slavery, let them continue to create money.” – Sir Josiah Stamp, Director of the Bank of England (appointed 1928). Reputed to be the 2nd wealthiest man in England at that time.
“Banks lend by creating credit. They create the means of payment out of nothing. ” Ralph M Hawtry, former Secretary to the Treasury.
“… our whole monetary system is dishonest, as it is debt-based… We did not vote for it. It grew upon us gradually but markedly since 1971 when the commodity-based system was abandoned.” The Earl of Caithness, in a speech to the House of Lords, 1997.
“The bank hath benefit of interest on all moneys which it creates out of nothing.” William Paterson, founder of the Bank of England in 1694, then a privately owned bank
“Let me issue and control a nation’s money and I care not who writes the laws.” Mayer Amschel Rothschild (1744-1812), founder of the House of Rothschild.
G. Edward Griffin advocates laetrill as a cancer treatment and takes positions on Noah's Ark not Carroll Quigley.
You seem to have a real problem with people giving information that doesn't tightly adhere to some kind of informational requirements for you. How is this not exactly like a Fundamentalist Christian saying "Only the Bible is True!"?
Yes, I do hold high standards for the information I allow into my head. Comparing the debate over the literal or interpretive reading of the Bible to a discussion of economics, however, is specious.
People can substantiate an opinion about nearly anything these days by simply pointing to what someone said here or there on the Internet. In this environment we have to make a choice; Do we chose to believe those telling stories that resonate with our own prejudices, biases, and fears even when there's no objective evidence of truth, or do we choose to believe those who have dedicated their entire life to studying the field and are well respected by those who have done so, even if their conclusion disagrees with what we want to believe ? I chose the later.
There are Nobel Prizes awarded in Economics every year. It is a very complex field of study that is beyond the layman. If we decide that peer review and credentials are meaningless, then I suppose you or I could receive the prize just as well as any other man. By the same regard, I suppose my understanding of physics would have to be considered equal to that of Einstein and Feynman ! Silliness.
These conspiracy theories are good reading and the authors make good money from them. The mere existence of shows talking about ghosts, however, does not prove that ghosts exist, it simply proves there is money to be made in talking about them ! Likewise, small fortunes have been made by authors catering to people's fears of conspiracy in every aspect of life. This only proves people are fearful and enjoy reading these stories full of suspense and intrigue, nothing more.
If you want to read an interesting paper on economics, read the one at http://atlas.media.mit.edu/media/atlas/pdf/HarvardMIT_AtlasOfEconomicComplexity.pdf . The paper discusses a new theory explaining the distribution of wealth across nations. The download is slow because it just came out, and Economists/Students are downloading it like mad.
You don't think Economics is a Religion then? How odd. What's the "Hidden Hand of the Market" then? Is that a concrete Scientific Phenomenon? Where can I see it working. Can I measure it? Can I chart it? I think The Bible and Economics have more to do with one another then you're comfortable admitting.
Also, mmmmmaaaaybe you want to look into who is funding the Nobel Prize in Economics. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nobel_Memorial_Prize_in_Economic_Sciences
Aren't you suspicious of a Nobel Prize that is funded directly by a Bank? Aren't you suspicious of a Nobel Prize that isn't actually a Nobel Prize, but is cleverly named to appear as one? Don't you think that a Bank would want certain Economic Policies in place over others? Shouldn't you look into that?
I also enjoy that when a group of people show facts to you, it's a conspiracy theory. But a bunch of Bankers getting into a room to talk to one another... that's cool.
I think you're missing the fundamental difficulty. I'm not interested in fixing a small part of the system. I think the system is fundamentally broken to it's core. It's a system that demands and requires misery to succeed. That is how it functions.
No source is fact. (The earth was flat was a fact for awhile) Information is information, neither good or bad, right or wrong. It's what you do with it that matters and that is where critical thinking comes in. Frankly, the fed being public or private is of little concern, it's the fact they they are doing unnecessary and unreasonable things such as charging interest to the government, which is like paying yourself to do your own chores. If they truly are government operated it only shows the lack of intelligence in the creation of the US currency.
Book List:
"The Creature from Jekyll Island : A Second Look at the Federal Reserve," by G. Edward Griffin
"The Web of Debt: the Shocking Truth about Our Monetary System and How We Can Break Free," by Ellen Hogsdon Brown, J.D.
"The Lost Science of Money," by Stephen Zarlenga
"Once the government reclaims the power to create money from the banks, it will no longer need to sell its bonds to investors. It will not even need to levy income taxes... government-issued money would actually be less inflationary than the system we have now; and it is precisely because power and money corrupt that money creation needs to be done by a public body, exercised in full view and with full accountability... what has allowed government to be corrupted today is that it is actually run by the money cartel. Big business holds all the cards, because its affiliated banks have monopolized the business of issuing and lending the national money supply, a function the Constitution delegated solely to Congress."
Ellen Brown, Web Of Debt
The Money Masters is a documentary film.You should watch it.
Alex Jones sent them here ;)
There's mountains of evidence that backs up what I and millions of others know to be true. I just posted that link because it goes over a couple hundred years of history about central baking cartels, not just ours.
[Deleted]
You don't think that they can print whatever they want in textbooks? Look at most US history text books put in front of our high school kids, they are full of pro-American propaganda crap. Hell, in Texas they got academia and the text book companies to put creationism into their science books. And we wonder why we have so many mindless drones? There's a difference between gaining knowledge and attaining wisdom. Wisdom is being able to see through the lies in the knowledge. ;)
Right. NO SOURCE is reputable, so we should just abandon REASON and just believe whatever we WANT based on our individual FEARS, BIASES, and SUSPICIONS.
Any good researcher KNOWS how to evaluate the quality of a reference, but nobody can DO SO when none are OFFERED. Don't they TEACH critical thinking and research in COLLEGE anymore ?
NO they only teach how to embrace neo-liberal views and to be good patriotic tax paying citizens. Thinking outside one's self and critical thinking skills are not taught at most schools. Look at where our graduates rank globally - near the bottom of all western civilized countries in most categories.
YES it's Private!
A member bank is a private institution and owns stock in its regional Federal Reserve Bank. All nationally chartered banks hold stock in one of the Federal Reserve Banks.
The POLICY MAKING body of the Federal Reserve is appointed by the President subject to approval by Congress. This is a simple matter of LAW. Go read Title 12 chapter 3 of the Federal Code.
What are you afraid of say it "it's a Private bank"
Because to do so suggests our money supply is under the control of private bankers rather than by officials select by and approved by our elected officials. Fortunately, that simply isn't true, and I think others should know just how badly people are distorting the truth in regards this topic.
Bottom line, I'm not AFRAID to lie, I simply REFUSE to do so.
The President appoints one member to the Board of Governors every 2 years, and the selection must be approved by the Senate.
The President selects from a list compiled by the banks. The first appointment is at the end of the first year in office. It would take 7 years before a President could appoint a majority of 4, to the 7 member board.
If a President were to deviate from an acceptable "bankster" plan, the banks have power to bring a depression, simply by withholding loans.
"A private central bank issuing the public currency is a greater menace to the liberties of the people than a standing army...We must not let our rulers load us with perpetual debt."
Thomas Jefferson
"Central banks were supposedly the guardians of money. Yet, they have created the biggest liquidity bubble in history."
The Economist
"Regarding the Great Depression, you’re right, we did it."
Ben Bernanke, Federal Reserve Chairman
1) Thomas Jefferson died nearly a century before the Federal Reserve was chartered.
2) The Economist statement is just one opinion of millions out there on the Internet. Would you feel better if a Googled some for you?
3) The Great Depression.
I wonder how much you actually KNOW about the Great Depression. It happened only 16 years after the founding of the Federal Reserve which had yet to be tested. Under political pressure by Hoover, the Fed did NOT print dollars and we suffered extreme deflation. To make matters worse, Hoover raised the top tax rate from 25% to 63%, raised corporate taxes, AND passed the protectionist Smoot-Hawley Tariff.
The actions of Hoover during the Great Depression should sound VERY good to most people here. After ALL, he REFUSED to print dollars, RAISED TAXES on the RICH and the CORPORATIONS, and tried to make Americans buy American products to boost unemployment. These are the PRECISE policies many here promote. They were DISASTROUS.
Fortunately, we LEARNED a LOT since 1929, so we DID NOT repeat our past mistakes. We PRINTED dollars, we CUT TAXES, etc... all the VERY SAME policies you and yours CRITICIZE so vocally.
Finally, if you were HONEST you would have put Mr Bernanke's comment in CONTEXT. He was SPECIFICALLY saying that it would be a DISASTER to follow the same policies as employed in 1929, the policies YOU love so much, to help explain the RIGHT action.
The Federal Reserve is an INDEPENDENT entity within the Federal Government !
The President appoints one member to the Board of Governors every 2 years, and the selection must be approved by the Senate.
The President selects from a list compiled by the banks. The first appointment is at the end of the first year in office. It would take 7 years before a President could appoint a majority of 4, to the 7 member board.
If a President were to deviate from an acceptable "bankster" plan, the banks have power to bring a depression, simply by withholding loans.
The Federal Reserve was intentionally set up to operate much like the Supreme Court (but with shorter terms). This was done INTENTIONALLY to ensure the politicians couldn't use it for their own politcal ends. In it's early days (i.e. during the Great Depression), the Secretary of the Treasury and Comptroller of the Currency (both short term presidential appointees) sat on the Governing Board of the Federal Reserve, and it was they who advocated Hoover's position regarding liquidity. Subsequent revision of Title 12 banking law passed in 1933 very specifically REMOVED them from the board as it was clear they had improperly influenced the decisions of the Federal Reserve during the start of the Great Depression.
The President is no more restricted in his nomination of Federal Reserve Board Members than he is in nominating Supreme Court justices. His nominations, MUST however, pass confirmation in Congress, so successful nominees usually have a record of achievement in their field. Overseers of the banking system usually have extensive background in economics, and some have experience in banking. Ben Bernanke is an economist, and he has never worked for a bank.
Note early in his tenure as the Chairman of the Federal Reserve, Bernanke was VERY vocal regarding the position of the Federal Reserve. In this sense, he was providing more "transparency" into the policies of the Fed. The immediate reaction of the markets to each of his statements caused him to stop making those announcements and he reverted to the more subtle and ambiguous style of his predecessors.
Yes, Banks can crash the economy by simply refusing to lend money, but lending money is how banks make their profits. Banks failed left and right during the Great Depression, and vast fortunes of the "banksters" were lost. Assuming the "greedy banksters" will destroy the source of profits and wipe out their own fortunes is silly. History shows that banks lend as much as they can, in fact, they will lend much more than they SHOULD if allowed to do so. Our recent experiences are clear indicators of this.
Man Rico, you are a big Wall Street shill aren't you?
Nope, just an average citizen with an interest in economics. I kept hearing all these statements about the Federal Reserve, so I went off to find the TRUTH rather than just accepting the opinions of OTHERS as my OWN. Goven what I was hearing, my research surprised me, so I thought I should post it for EVERYONE to see.
Yeah, I did the same thing. I used to think the FED was a govt body too. I used to really respect Greenspan. Then I heard that its private. I didn't believe it either. And I looked for myself. My experience isn't any different than yours, except I'm not so closed minded that I can't see the truth when it's staring me in the face. You refuse to admit that the FED was created by the banks to profit the bankers.
Did you ever read The Creature from Jeckyl Island? Ever see a film on it? The banksters in the early 1910s schemed, met in secret on the private island Jeckyl Island, and created the Federal Reserve Act. Then they had someone else give it to congress and they publicly argued against it, because they knew that the public would reject ANYTHING they wanted. So in the public's eye, if the bankers didn't want the FED, THEY wanted it. Sneaky bastards. Then DURING THE CHRISTMAS BREAK of 1913 congress voted the act in.
This is all a matter of public record.
Why does the FED need to reimburse interest when it could just not charge interest in the first place? Surely it's using the SIGNIFICANT interest to gain while it's holding it.
And it does.
The constitution is clear. The FED is not allowed.
"The constitution is clear. The FED is not allowed." is an UNSUBSTANTIATED ASSERTION. Furthermore, the Supreme Court CLEARLY disagrees with you. Do you have an advanced degree in Constitutional Law or some other experience that makes your OPINION carry more weight that of the Supreme Court ? I bet NOT.
Do you?
Lewis v. United States
"Plaintiff, who was injured by vehicle owned and operated by a federal reserve bank, brought action alleging jurisdiction under the Federal Tort Claims Act. The United States District Court for the Central District of California, David W. Williams, J., dismissed holding that federal reserve bank was not a federal agency within meaning of Act and that the court therefore lacked subject-matter jurisdiction. Appeal was taken. The Court of Appeals, Poole, Circuit Judge, held that federal reserve banks are not federal instrumentalities for purposes of the Act, but are independent, privately owned and locally controlled corporations."
My original post said "Though the member banks of the Federal Reserve System ARE private, the Governing Board sets POLICY." Now let's look at the Lewis v. United States case.
From http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/680/1239/200393/ we see that Mr Lewis was NOT struck by a vehicle driven by a member of the Governing Board, but by a vehicle belonging to one of the private member banks I mentioned in my original post. I quote...
" Each Federal Reserve Bank is a separate corporation owned by commercial banks in its region. The stockholding commercial banks elect two thirds of each Bank's nine member board of directors. The remaining three directors are appointed by the Federal Reserve Board. The Federal Reserve Board regulates the Reserve Banks, but direct supervision and control of each Bank is exercised by its board of directors. 12 U.S.C. § 301. "
The above quote is in complete AGREEMENT with my original post. So is Title 12 chapter 3, sub-chapter II, section 241 available at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/pdf/uscode12/lii_usc_TI_12_CH_3_SC_II_SE_241.pdf . Again, I quote...
"The Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System (hereinafter referred to as the “Board”) shall be composed of seven members, to be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate..."
What part of the LAW do people fail to understand ?
Good reply, SmartAlx
Mayer? Is that you? Or helicopter Ben?
BAHAHAHA! guess what every smart founding father from Ben Franklin to Jefferson to Lincoln said? Central banks, or the Fed, will screw the country, no matter who what when where or how. but i hear they weren't intelligent or anything though, so i probably wouldn't listen to them..
http://sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=9e2a4ea8-6e73-4be2-a753-62060dcbb3c3
The Fed Audit
July 21, 2011
The first top-to-bottom (partial) audit of the Federal Reserve uncovered eye-popping new details about how the U.S. provided a whopping $16 trillion in secret loans to bail out American and foreign banks and businesses during the worst economic crisis since the Great Depression. An amendment by Sen. Bernie Sanders to the Wall Street reform law passed one year ago this week directed the Government Accountability Office to conduct the study. "As a result of this audit, we now know that the Federal Reserve provided more than $16 trillion in total financial assistance to some of the largest financial institutions and corporations in the United States and throughout the world," said Sanders. "This is a clear case of socialism for the rich and rugged, you're-on-your-own individualism for everyone else."
Among the investigation's key findings is that the Fed unilaterally provided trillions of dollars in financial assistance to foreign banks and corporations from South Korea to Scotland, according to the GAO report. "No agency of the United States government should be allowed to bailout a foreign bank or corporation without the direct approval of Congress and the president," Sanders said.
click on link and read the entire article
Please try to constrain the discussion to the Federal Reserve which was chartered in 1913, well after all the luminous people you mentioned had died.
I understand this, however they all warned of what a central bank could do. You do know the Fed is a central bank right?
It is ONE FORM of a Central Bank, and it differs MARKEDLY from the North American Bank, the First Central Bank, and the Second Central Banks that came before.
haha yep. and they definitely have the American people in mind with their policies. Honestly though, why are you defending a corrupt system? what is it benefiting for you?
The benefit I reap from the Federal Reserve is a functioning economy. The benefit I HOPE to reap by injecting some FACTS into this discourse is a more REASONED discussion of the policies adopted by this movement (which I support).
Rothschild...
Rothschilds and the Federal Reserve
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=NzLIz27GqWs
Greenspan Admits The Federal Reserve Is Above The Law & Answers To No One - - - at 7:51
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ol3mEe8TH7w
The Federal Reserve Home Page states that the Federal Reserve is an INDEPENDENT entity within the government --- the very definition of a PARASITE !
Over time, whoever controls the money system, controls the nation.
ignorance is bliss
I respectfully disagree. Yes the board is appointed and yes it was created through congressional mandate but it is a private institution.
You do know that their meetings are secret, closed to the public and media.
Also, it is a bank and the board has the congressional mandate of keeping high employment but they also have the responsibility to make money for the investors and members.
There are private and public elements.
I think that it should be totally public.
"Politically independent and financially self sufficient"... isn't that the definition of private?
Only problem I have with the fed is that it is housed with protégés of bankers. I believe the reason it was created was to negate the consequences of the economy being used as a political football. Greenspan should have never been given the job; he had a conflict of interest.
Probably the dumbest post I've ever seen. I hate to break it to you, but every "token" you print that's not backed by gold simply increases the money supply and devalues the currency (in fact, the dollar has lost 97% of its value since the creation of the Fed in 1913). And that, in turn, creates inflation, which is nothing more than a backdoor tax on the public that was designed to allow the government to spend as much money as it wanted, whenever it wanted, wherever it wanted, FOREVER (which is exactly why FDR decoupled the dollar from the gold standard--how else would the government be able to finance the endless wars that it's waged over the last 70 years?). Now, of course, the American public has been able to tolerate this backdoor tax for the last 80 years because wages (at least here in the U.S.) have also inflated, along with everything else (e.g., the stock market--you didn't really think that corporations have simply gotten more "valuable" over the years, did you? LOL...). But wait! Suddenly, two billion new people around the planet have decided that they, too, would like to get in on the capitalism party, and guess what? They're willing to do it for salaries that are a fraction of what we're used to getting here! OOPS! Given a choice of paying an American worker $80,000 or someone in Malaysia $15,000 to do the same job, who do you think your beloved corporations (which, of course, are just SO patriotic...LOL!) are going to hire? And when that happens, how are suddenly unemployed and unemployable Americans going to pay their bills, and service their debt, and pay for all that ridiculously inflated food and fuel? Answer: They're NOT. They're going to be POOR! That's what your government and your "friend" the Federal Reserve have done to this nation over the last 80 years. And you don't think there should be a revolution? LOL...you fools. You've been HAD...
The Federal Reserve is a private entity granted a monopoly on the us monetary policy by the Federal Government.
It exists now with zero Congressional oversight. Which is why a separate bill granting a sneak-peek audit was required. The Chairman of the Fed testifies before some Congressional committees but there is nothing in the original charter which mandates honest reporting or open books to either the government or the people.
You also dismiss the harm of inflation by saying it has no intrinsic value which is actually a problem not an excuse to hand waive away the situation. If it had intrinsic value we wouldn't have to worry as much about them putting more dollars into circulation. The only thing that backs up our dollar right now is China owning 2 trillion and not wanting us to collapse, our military might threatening OPEC not to unlink the dollar from oil purchases, and a bunch of people too worried about the Euro to look at the dollar. Now understand all your savings are in dollars. When their value decreases your entire savings decreases - retirement accounts, pension accounts, college savings accounts all dramatically decreases in purchasing power. This destroys the middle class and makes it very very hard for the poor to advance.
You are in effect defending your own oppressor Rico.
The federal reserved as other central banks in the world are a part of currency manipulation regime. Yes the law makers always find an excuse to blame others country central bankers in some part of the world that their currency are being manipulated too low against the US dollar but the reality is the feds are just part of the game. Remember whenever you point your finger to one direction the other fingers will point back at you!
I'm gonna go on a limb and say Rico is either a paid shill, or way off-base in his analysis.
Either way, take what he says with a grain of salt as there are many facts in his post/responses, but the analysis of those facts is flawed. Because private or public is a moot argument? How about beneficial or detrimental?
There's enough info on this post and throughout the internet to discredit his love for the fed, but again, private/public he may be correct saying it is public, but public utilities can be used to loot the populous often better than private ones. Again, how about beneficial/detrimental instead of public/private?
It doesn't take an economic genius to put the facts together and realize the fed is on of many leeches placed on we the people. And before I get attacked by Rico I have a MA and BS in Econ, I will attest it is a bullshit degree. The entire subject of Econ is like intro level physics: you do a bunch of calculations in a vacuum before going on to the same problems but adding friction. Except Econ stays in the vacuum by using models based on a "rational" person and never deviates from these models, even though it is quite obvious nobody is 100% rational and those who are the most rational have emotional spending/saving habits at some point. So please stop touting all these fucking econ experts as their mind's find it difficult to admit they spent a large part of their lives dedicated to a truly dismal science. Same way I don't need to be a doctor to tell the majority of Americans they just need to eat well, exercise and stop smoking, but they would rather have a doc give them a pill or surgery because, well... they're a doctor!
As well, I worked for an investment firm (non-disclosure won't let me say who) until I quit after being tired of the way our financial system fucks over most people from their own lack of knowledge, always using the claim it's the account holders responsibility. The sad part is the vast majority of what the financial industry does is legal, but legality and immorality are not mutually exclusive.
The one place Rico and I may agree is education. The mass of Americans are, frankly, ignorant (see what I said above about doctors). The answer can stare them in the face but because they quit math once letters got involved, quit science once math got involved, watch TV all day long, etc, etc, they can't see the forest from the trees to realize the massive amount of useless diversionary crap our political leaders, or anyone for that matter, spew from their mouths.
If the Fed was truly a public entity there would be some provisions for it under USC title 31. You know because they issue Money. But that money is private. And since we are on the subject of title 31, what up with United States notes. How come we can only have 300,000,000 of them? And furthermore, why is it the federal reserve notes are not redeemable in lawful money? check out the clause on any federal reserve note before 1964, they all say redeemable in lawful money at any federal reserve bank.
Watch "The Money Masters": A history of Central Banking and the Federal Reserve. The information in this video has never been debunked. Sorry RICO.
Watch the video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JXt1cayx0hs&feature=player_embedded
Wikipedia Article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Money_Masters
To everyone defending the Federal Reserve: Your mention of the President's and Congress's involvement through Title 12 chapter 3, or any other law that provides evidence of a coalition between the two parties in question (Federal Reserve and the Government), only provides amunition to pin the human injustice this whole thing is about on all parties involved . So now Congress and the President are responsible for the atrocity against universal human rights as well.
And Rico, you're either a government lobbyist, or you've been misled by the government you so trust, because what the fractional reserve system does is loan money, it doesn't print it for free. The loan is to be paid back with interest. Your so-called tokens come with a price, meanwhile they cyclically deflate in value of which in turn inflates the markets. It's a no win situation, designed strategically that way. Really an ingenious system to gain or consolidate power, because it continually requires more money in than it puts out - they say pay-back's a bitch... Well I think the people are sick of it! ConsiderIng, as you so eloquently put it, they're just tokens - Great! You just pointed out that the whole system that governs the quality of our lives is merely a mirage, a fabrication, one that imposes a mirage like wealth and status but really, as you so matter-of-factly put it, has no intrinsic value.
several years after signing the Federal Reserve Act: “I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is now controlled by its system of credit… We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments ...in the world - no longer a Government of free opinion, no longer a Government by conviction and vote of the majority, but a Government by the opinion and duress of small groups of dominant men.”
The Federal Reserve is your FRIEND ! hahahahha take the blue pill hilarious.
Court Rules Federal Reserve is Privately Owned Case Reveals Fed's Status as a Private Institution
680 F.2d 1239: John L. Lewis, Plaintiff/appellant, v. United States of America, Defendant/appellee
http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/680/1239/200393/
Asked and answered at http://occupywallst.org/forum/the-fderal-reserve-is-not-private/#comment-235738
By the way, what do you think about my ideas at http://occupywallst.org/forum/an-idea-employee-stock-ownership/ and http://occupywallst.org/forum/marijuana-prohibition-a-letter-to-my-elected-offic/ ? I value your input.
Will check these out tomorrow, after the world is through with me.
(((getting late))) I respect you too. One requires conviction and some effort to debate you.
~Goodnight Rico~
100% Reserve lending only (no more bailouts, no need for the fed, no manipulation of interest rates).
The government will need to issue a bank account for every citizen with an amount deposited yearly reflecting a per capita percentage of the desired yearly growth of the overall money supply (probably will be several thousand a year for every citizen over 18). The reason you need to do this is because with 100% reserves banking, you need to replace the old mechanism of using fractional-reserve lending for the overall money supply to grow.
The account will be split in two, one part for spending and the other part for saving. Deposits to the spending side would increase when unemployment is high, decrease when there is too much inflation. Money placed in the spending part of the account cannot be used for saving; we need to do this because of the paradox of thrift. The yearly total amount credited to both the spending and saving sections of our accounts will always equal the per capita percentage of desired growth of the overall money supply. If the government runs a deficit and needs to borrow, the first place it would borrow would be from our savings in the government bank accounts, with the appropriate interest paid to us.
well, when you can get money from the FED at 0% interest, then yes it is your friend
I don't know why you say this case does not indicate that the Federal Reserve is private..It does.. http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=8518
Can we get a new topic on how smoking is actually good for you..I have research from the Tobacco Industry that says so. I know many of you dummies out there won't understand the analysis so I'll translate it for all you heathens.
"Fortunately, we can just print more tokens to ensure there are enough to meet our needs." ...Well Genius who do you think is paying for these fucking tokens to be printed...
It's been determined court case after court case that our Central bank is indeed a private entity....We don't need a Private Federal Reserve..Read "The Creature From Jekyll Island"
If by "court case after court case" you mean the Lewis vs. United States case, then you should be careful to read the actual ruling rather than just quote it for convenience.
From http://law.justia.com/cases/federal/appellate-courts/F2/680/1239/200393/ we see that Mr Lewis was NOT struck by a vehicle driven by a member of the Governing Board of the Federal Reserve, but by a vehicle belonging to one of the private member banks I mentioned in my original post. I quote...
" Each Federal Reserve Bank is a separate corporation owned by commercial banks in its region. The stockholding commercial banks elect two thirds of each Bank's nine member board of directors. The remaining three directors are appointed by the Federal Reserve Board. The Federal Reserve Board regulates the Reserve Banks, but direct supervision and control of each Bank is exercised by its board of directors. 12 U.S.C. § 301. "
The above quote is in complete AGREEMENT with my original post. So is Title 12 chapter 3, sub-chapter II, section 241 available at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/pdf/uscode12/lii_usc_TI_12_CH_3_SC_II_SE_241.pdf . Again, I quote...
"The Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System (hereinafter referred to as the “Board”) shall be composed of seven members, to be appointed by the President, by and with the advice and consent of the Senate..."
G. Edward Griffin, the author of "The Creature From Jekyll Island," is NOT an economist, he is an AUTHOR, and authors write books when they see a market for them. He has a long history of pandering to people who want to hear about and will PAY to read about various controversies. YOU are his market, so of course you agree.
Here's a short bio of G. Edward Griffin from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/G._Edward_Griffin :
"G. Edward Griffin (born November 7, 1931) is an American film producer, author, and political lecturer.[1] He is perhaps best known as the author of The Creature from Jekyll Island (1994), a critique of much modern economic theory and practice, specifically the Federal Reserve System.
Starting as a child actor, he became a radio station manager before age 20. He then began a career of producing documentaries and books on often-debated topics like cancer, Noah's ark, and the Federal Reserve System, as well as on libertarian views of the Supreme Court of the United States, terrorism, subversion, and foreign policy. Since the 1970s, Griffin has promoted laetrile as a cancer treatment,[2] a view considered quackery by the medical community.[3][4] He has also promoted the Durupınar site as hosting the original Noah's ark, against skeptics as well as near-Ararat Creationists."
According to G. Edward Griffin's own web site, his only FINANCIAL credential is a certificate in Financial Planning from the College of Financial Planning in Denver, which was founded in 1972. Per the college's web-site, the courses required to obtain a Certificate in Financial Planning are:
CFPE 1101 Financial Planning Process & Insurance
CFPE 1102 Investment Planning
CFPE 1103 Income Tax Planning
CFPE 1104 Retirement Planning & Employee Benefits
CFPE 1105 Estate Planning
THIS is your "EXPERT" ... ZERO knowledge of finance but for 5 classes at what is essentially a community college. He's an AUTHOR who has made a CAREER out of feeding the suspicions of folks like yourself.
I'm sorry you're wrong....You'll also argue that the Federal Reserve prevents such crisis' as we had in the Great Depression...It was later found that action by the Federal Reserve actually was in part the cause of the Great Depression...No the Central Bank is private and has a appointed stooges that do whatever the member banks of the Private Federal Reserve want...
I wonder how much you actually KNOW about the Great Depression. It happened only 16 years after the founding of the Federal Reserve which had yet to be tested. At the time, the Secretary of the Treasury and Comptroller of the Currency, both short-term political appointees, sat on the Governing Board. Under political pressure from President Hoover, the Fed did NOT print dollars and we suffered extreme deflation. To make matters worse, Hoover raised the top tax rate from 25% to 63%, raised corporate taxes, AND push the protectionist Smoot-Hawley Tariff through.
Do Hoover's policies sound familiar ? They should. They were DISASTROUS.
Fortunately, we REMOVED the Secretary of the Treasury and Comtroller of the Current from the Governing Board in 1933 to INSULATE the Fed from political control; one of the lessons learned from the Depression. We ALSO created the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation at that time as we learned that monetary policy alone wouldn't stop a panic; we also needed to DAMPEN the tendancy toward panic in the general population.
Yes, the Federal Reserve contributed to the Great Depression, and that's on the record in a statement made by Ben Bernanke. Unfortunately, lot's of folks like to quote him out of context. He was SPECIFICALLY saying that it would be a DISASTER to follow the same policies as employed in 1929, the policies many in these forums seem to support. His movement to generate liquidity during the 2008 crisis were diametrically opposed to those taken in the Great Depression. We are all FORTUNATE to have had an EXPERT in the Great Depression at the helm.
Finally, the President is no more restricted in his nomination of Federal Reserve Board Members than he is in nominating Supreme Court justices. His nominations, MUST however, pass confirmation in Congress, so successful nominees usually have a record of achievement in their field. Overseers of the banking system usually have extensive background in economics, and some have experience in banking. Ben Bernanke is an economist with a long record of service in academia and various government posts. He has never worked for a bank.
I like your comments..incredibly verbose. You don't prove how the Federal reserve isn't private though. How was the Federal Reserve created...Let's start from there. I do wonder why you are such a proponent for the Federal Reserve..
Unfortunately for the Twitter/Facebook generation, there remain some topics of sufficient complexity they require more than a "sound bite." I know that having to read several paragraphs strains the attention span of some, but I honestly don't know how to distill discussion of such a complex and far ranging topic to a mere sentence. Sorry.
In the interest of brevity, I will simply refer you once again to Title 12 paragraph 3 of Federal Law in response to your question about the chartering of the Fed.
You wonder whether I have motives in disagreeing with your position. Yes, I do. I would like people who advocate changing something to at least get their facts straight before messing with it lest my family suffers great harm from their well-intentioned but misinformed policies.
You're right in not wanting to change something that is working...But can we actually say the FED is working for the best interest of people who are not speculators on Wall Street..I'm a "saver" getting stomped on.
I didn't say we shouldn't change the Fed, I only said we should be better informed before we do !
Of course we should have an informed populace...You also have to understand something about Nick...I've been on this issue for a while now since 2007-8...I know the official role of the Fed and I also know the history of European Style Central Banking our Central Bank is much the same as the others.
Rico EDUCATE YOURSELF We The People DO NOT control the Federal Reserve.
it's regulated by the CORRUPT FCC, and the FDA, which is run by BIG PRIVATE CORPORATIONS WHO OWN BIG NEWS MEDIA AND BIG PHARMA http://www.vegsource.com/news/2011/06/unbelievable-story-of-fda-corruption---full-documentary-online-thru-monday.html
In ALL cases, We the People DO NOT set policy
GET A LIFE - The Federal Reserve is NOT your FRIEND !
we the people do not control the fed but we should. the fed and fiat currency are not the problem. it is an important question and there is lots of bad info on this site and at the park about the fed and the gold standard. Ron Lawl has it wrong!
Ha Ha Ha ....Designed by the 1% in secret on an island with the bankers who became the primary lenders the fed now successfully infiltrated all governments and other corporate interests.. Who are these primary dealers???????? They are the frigging 1%
OUR FRIEND..LOL
what is the difference between pickles labeled 'kosher pickles' and pickles that have the U symbol (Meaning Kosher) on them, which no one knows what it means? Also, what is the difference between organic crackers that aren't Kosher and organic crackers labeled with the deceptive Kosher U symbol??? Anyone know out there? Why are we being deceived?
You raise a valid issue, the Constitution requires a 'separation of powers' to reduce corruption and yet many of these institutions are legislator, judge, jury and executioner of their own policies while having policies so complex no one can understand (for instance: Title 26 C.F.R is "13,458 pages in total. The full text of Title 26 of the United States Code [the part written by Congress] is a mere 3,387 printed pages, bringing the adjusted gross page count to 16,845." from: http://www.trygve.com/taxcode.html).
We the People have been hoodwinked by our gov't while they not-so-secretly have established laws incomprehensibly complex while tailoring to special interests, and thus ensuring their own livelihoods as politicians and also as lawyers (at our cost).
I don't know whether the Fed is harmful or helpful (largely because I can't) but I know that for a long time now our gov't has been disregarding the Constitution and it's safeguards and creating institutions that are incestuous and opaque.
I AGREE with many of your observations (and respect you for your honest statement regarding the Fed). That's why I WANT MY GOVERNMENT BACK !
See http://occupywallst.org/forum/one-percenter-ready-to-join-if/ for some background then read my proposal at http://occupywallst.org/forum/we-the-people-in-order-to-a-proposal/
Once we have TAKEN OUR GOVERNMENT BACK, we can put things back in PROPER order !
Hahahahahaha. We the People had a heck of a time getting our bank audited. Do we vote-in the FED board of supervisors? Who really appoints the heads of the FED. The member banks. Everything else is for show.
Per Federal Law, the President appoints the Governing Board subject to approval by Congress. I seriously don't know how to make it any simpler. Go read Title 12 chapter 3 of Federal Law. ALSO note we did not 'vote-in' any Supreme Court Justices or ANY of the heads of the Cabinet Departments. What's your point?
Like I said, it's for show.
Right. In YOUR universe, you get to believe WHATEVER you want because no objective fact or statement can be trusted. So much for REASON, we'll just operate on collective opinion based on FEAR and SUSPICION. Are there any Jews around ? They've been a good target for FEAR and SUSPICION over the years, even in the "advanced" and "civilized" nations like 1930's Germany.
And in your universe we'll just believe everything we read in the Encyclopedia of Business and Finance without taking into account human frailty or real-world experience. AND WE'LL USE A LOT OF CAPITALS...for emphasis.
HitGirl, without passing judgment on arguments (I don't disagree I am just uninformed), that is a biting and insightful summary! I actually laughed out loud.
If the protesters across the nation don't figure out that ENEMY NUMBER 1 is the Federal Reserve, it will be a wasted moment in time. They cause the downturns in the economies, which they refer to as "regular business" cycles. They are responsible for manipulating the gold trade for decades which in turn has taken down countless country's economies across the globe. They are responsible for creating and enslaving the 3rd world from South/Central America, Africa and SE Asia. The are now in the process of taking down Europe, and when they are done, it will be our turn. They are priming our economy for the final collapse now. When they are done, they will turn out this entire country, every last public service will be privatized and handed over to the usual handful of transnational corporations. They've been doing it for 100 years and they will not stop until they own everything on the planet. The OP either works for the Fed or one of its "member" banks.
Zero facts, vacuous, and sophomoric.
I do like your username though, because it will be RICO laws that we will use to tear down that criminal enterprise. ;)
Good Point ! ! RICO laws . . .
You're not 100% right, the whole concept is complicated on purpose, it's actually a hybrid (public/private) banking cartel that has gone into a partnership with the federal government. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SxCX_D5xVLM
but my token capacity keeps shrinking... value is directly proportional to quantity of tokens printed
I already live in inflation
If "we the people" control the Federal Reserve, then how come NOBODY knows what it is doing? If we have so much control, why does it take all kinds of political games to uncover all kinds of secret loans and handouts to corporations and other countries? Secret loans and handouts, I might add, that are a direct theft from "we the people"?
The overall Federal Reserve balance sheet is public information and can be seen at http://federalreserve.gov/monetarypolicy/bst_recenttrends.htm . If you browse through the various links at that site, you'll find a wealth of information regarding what they do.
What you will NOT find in most cases are the specific NAMES of the banks and financial institutions they are trying to help. Their JOB is to prevent panic and, when people hear they're helping one bank or another, public confidence in the bank falls and runs ensue. This defeats the purpose of the intervention.
If we want to have DETAILED oversight of the Federal Reserve, then it's going to have to be done by a subcommittee similar to those overseeing Defense, Intelligence, etc, and THOSE subcommittees don't publish THEIR details either.
I tried correcting some of the Tea Party anti-Fed rhetoric around here for a while, but the fear is too strong in these people. It's futile. Anti-Fed sentiments are a perfect fit for the vague and nebulous anti-establishment sentiments that this movement is based on.
"The Federal Reserve bank buys government bonds without one penny..." — Congressman Wright Patman, Congressional Record, Sept 30, 1941
"We have, in this country, one of the most corrupt institutions the world has ever known. I refer to the Federal Reserve Board. This evil institution has impoverished the people of the United States and has practically bankrupted our government. It has done this through the corrupt practices of the moneyed vultures who control it". — Congressman Louis T. McFadden in 1932 (Rep. Pa)
International bankers — Congressman Louis T. McFadden (Rep. Pa)
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/10/federal-reserve-board-rife-with-conflict-of-interest-gao-report/
From ABC News:
The makeup of the Federal Reserve’s board of directors poses a conflict of interest and there is concern that several financial firms and corporations could have reaped monetary benefits from their executives’ close ties to the Fed, according to a new report released today by the Government Accountability Office.
In one case, the Federal Reserve consulted with General Electric on the creation of a commercial paper funding facility and then provided $16 billion in financing to the company while its chief executive, Jeffrey Immelt, served as a director on the board of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York. Immelt is now President Obama’s “jobs czar.”
JP Morgan Chase could also have benefited from its chief executive Jamie Dimon’s position on the board of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York, according to the GAO. The bank received emergency loans from the Federal Reserve at the same time it served as the clearinghouse for the Fed’s emergency lending program.
read the entire article . . . click on link at top of comment
@ thoreau - what you said
To get this county going strong again we need to cerate jobs. I have a plan if you would hear me out. Like the tariffs we could use the IRS to charge more taxes to companies that are American companies but build over seas. Example Company A does everything here they pay 15% (let use fake number for easy of explain) Company B has it factory over seas and it customer service there as well let charged them 45% and, Company C just has it factory over seas lets charge them 30%. this way we encourage company to stay here and even bring back there factories , but most important new companies to form here. Think of it this way, wash machine company make a good wash machine for $700 here and another company make a let quality machine in China for $450. but the one in Chine now cost $650. I would buy the better one make here because it is a better deal. This encourages customer to buy American and not just shop by price. Plus this the Government get to taxes from all the worker in the American factories and the Factories overseas no taxes from workers the Government can make up the taxes from the companies. I would like someone to get back with me and let me know if interested in hear more details. This could help make America strong for years to come
To get this county going strong again we need to cerate jobs. I have a plan if you would hear me out. Like the tariffs we could use the IRS to charge more taxes to companies that are American companies but build over seas. Example Company A does everything here they pay 15% (let use fake number for easy of explain) Company B has it factory over seas and it customer service there as well let charged them 45% and, Company C just has it factory over seas lets charge them 30%. this way we encourage company to stay here and even bring back there factories , but most important new companies to form here. Think of it this way, wash machine company make a good wash machine for $700 here and another company make a let quality machine in China for $450. but the one in Chine now cost $650. I would buy the better one make here because it is a better deal. This encourages customer to buy American and not just shop by price. Plus this the Government get to taxes from all the worker in the American factories and the Factories overseas no taxes from workers the Government can make up the taxes from the companies. I would like someone to get back with me and let me know if interested in hear more details. This could help make America strong for years to come
Well, the FED is not our FRIEND, but you are correct that the FED is NOT PRIVATE, although it has aspects of a private corporation, it is under the Charter of the Federal Reserve Act. All member banks are forced by Congressional law to be members, stock in the 12 Regional Banks pays a dividend of a flat 6% and the FED is required by law to return all interest payments received on U.S. Treasuries back to the U.S. Treasury. This year, for instance, the FED received around $87 billion in interest, but it paid the U.S. Treasury $78 Billion, the remainder is retained for FED overhead and the payment of dividends to member banks.
There is no AUDIT -- but they wouldn't lie, would they?
The Federal Reserve Act of 1913 was fraudulently passed, since a bill cannot alter the U.S, Constitution.
Article 1 - The Legislative Branch Section 8 - Powers of Congress
The Congress shall have Power to coin Money, regulate the Value thereof, and of foreign Coin, and fix the Standard of Weights and Measures;
http://www.usconstitution.net/xconst_A1Sec8.html
The Supreme Court has found in several rulings that Congress is not suthorized to pass their responsibilities (as defined by the Constitution) to a private entity.
Oh, I absolutely agree that the Federal Reserve Act is unconstitutional and that they FED is probably one of the most dangerous quasi-government agency ever created. It is however, the lapdog of this government, it benefits this government with the power to inflate the money supply in order to function outside the auspices of the Constitution.
There has never been an audit so there is no way to know how much money they really are making and how much they are cheating us out of. I know it has to be a hell of a lot higher then 87 billion for sure.
Actually, the call for an audit is not to determine the amount of money they are bringing in, that amount is accountable due to the amount of Treasuries that are sold at a certain interest rate. The call for an audit is to determine just what the monetary policy of the FED is and how the policy of Quantitative Easing is allowing it to print untold Trillions in various types of "bailouts". The actual interest on Treasuries is a known value, therefore the amount of interest payments on those Treasuries are also a known value as well as the amount of payments that go back into the Treasury. The problem is not how much interest payments they bring in through the Open Market Committee, but the amount of Quantitative Easing that is taking place, how those "non-attached" dollars are being used and where those dollars are being distributed. It is the monetary policy that is in need of an audit, that is where the major problem is and that is where there is a very definite affect on every individual in this country.
The Fed is PRIVATE. The Federal Reserve banks pay taxes. The employees are not Civil Servants, The Federal Reserve is not listed in the Government Section of the Phone book.
The FED is not private, it is a chartered government monopoly, all the FED employees are, in fact, paid by the federal government, the receive federal benefits, while the employees do pay income taxes and the FED itself DOES NOT pay any taxes at all.
The Federal Reserve Act, forces membership in the FED by all National Banks, which means, by law, they must become "stockholders" of the 12 Regional FED Banks. They have no voting rights, they cannot change the "by-laws" of the banking system, the only thing they can do as member is vote to place 3 of the 9 Board members in each of the 12 Regional Banks. The Federal Reserve Bank itself in NY, is directed by the Board of Governors, who are all appointed by the Government, they must undergo Senate approval and again, they are all employees of the federal government.
Additionally, Section 31 of the Federal Reserve Act declares that Congress may repeal the Act at any time, dissolving the Bank and it has the ability to sell off all bank assets. Certainly, there are aspects of a corporation within the FED, but it is not, in a usual sense a private corporation, there can be no individual ownership of stocks nor any individual control. All ownership is limited to member banks and those are forced, by law, to be members and there is a flat 6% dividend that is paid for that forced membership.
The idea that the FED is a completely private organization relieves this government of the actual responsibility of not only allowing it to be created, but to allow it to continue to destroy this People. It is a mercantilist system that allows for a mercantilist government.
So who was appointed to be the chairman and vice chairman? Also who are the seven members of the board??
Public information at http://www.federalreserve.gov/aboutthefed/bios/board/default.htm
Everyone knows the Fed is not Private.However it's run by Morons.
The VALUE of CURRENCY is determined by how much it is bought. If you print too much money (like what the Fed does), PRICES go up. This is in EVERY economic textbook (both Austrian, Keynesian, every school of thought agrees on that)
WHY ? Imagine a mayor prints money and sends it out to people. People get new money, however it is not money made by FIRMS. So the people are going to buy stuff with it. So suddenly you have more people buying stuff without firms producing more.
Remember firms produce more, more profit, more cash in households. So when people buy stuff, it usually means there is enough stuff to satisfy consumption based on income. However, when you print money, income increases without "Stuff" increasing. So when people buy stuff, there is NOT ENOUGH. So a store like Apple will increase prices because there is suddenly more customers with more cash in their pockets.
Printing money ----> INFLATION (which means increase in price level)
By the way GOODS AND SERVICES can be explained in terms of MONEY, because you usually get a good or a service in exchange of giving up $$$
Rico is clearly a moron. A currency and money are two different things.
Your understanding of the issues is SOPHOMORIC.
The USA does NOT live in isolation, it is a part of a GLOBAL economy.
How do you explain the fact that we've suffered DEFLATIONARY periods since 2008 ? In FACT, please explain why people are now concerned we may be entering ANOTHER period of deflation ? You need to move past your HIGH SCHOOL understanding of money and study INTERNATIONAL economics.
HA! You are certainly wrong about that! Get you information straight! Do you work for them? The Illuminati?
Yes. I am ALSO a card carrying Mason.
Article 1, Section 8 of the Constitution states that Congress shall have the power to coin (create) money and regulate the value thereof. Today however, the FED, which is a privately owned company, controls and profits by printing money through the Treasury, and regulating its value.
The FED began with approximately 300 people or banks that became owners (stockholders purchasing stock at $100 per share - the stock is not publicly traded) in the Federal Reserve Banking System. They make up an international banking cartel of wealth beyond comparison (Reference 1, 14). The FED banking system collects billions of dollars (Reference 8, 17) in interest annually and distributes the profits to its shareholders. The Congress illegally gave the FED the right to print money (through the Treasury) at no interest to the FED. The FED creates money from nothing, and loans it back to us through banks, and charges interest on our currency. The FED also buys Government debt with money printed on a printing press and charges U.S. taxpayers interest. Many Congressmen and Presidents say this is fraud (Reference 1,2,3,5,17).
Who actually owns the Federal Reserve Central Banks? The ownership of the 12 Central banks, a very well kept secret, has been revealed:
Rothschild Bank of London Warburg Bank of Hamburg Rothschild Bank of Berlin Lehman Brothers of New York Lazard Brothers of Paris Kuhn Loeb Bank of New York Israel Moses Seif Banks of Italy Goldman, Sachs of New York Warburg Bank of Amsterdam Chase Manhattan Bank of New York (Reference 14, P. 13, Reference 12, P. 152)
These bankers are connected to London Banking Houses which ultimately control the FED. When England lost the Revolutionary War with America (our forefathers were fighting their own government), they planned to control us by controlling our banking system, the printing of our money, and our debt (Reference 4, 22).
The individuals listed below owned banks which in turn owned shares in the FED. The banks listed below have significant control over the New York FED District, which controls the other 11 FED Districts. These banks also are partly foreign owned and control the New York FED District Bank. (Reference 22)
First National Bank of New York James Stillman National City Bank, New York Mary W. Harnman
National Bank of Commerce, New York A.D. Jiullard
Hanover National Bank, New York Jacob Schiff
Chase National Bank, New York Thomas F. Ryan Paul Warburg William Rockefeller Levi P. Morton M.T. Pyne George F. Baker Percy Pyne Mrs. G.F. St. George J.W. Sterling Katherine St. George H.P. Davidson J.P. Morgan (Equitable Life/Mutual Life) Edith Brevour T. Baker (Reference 4 for above, Reference 22 has details, P. 92, 93, 96, 179)
How did it happen? After previous attempts to push the Federal Reserve Act through Congress, a group of bankers funded and staffed Woodrow Wilson's campaign for President. He had committed to sign this act. In 1913, a Senator, Nelson Aldrich, maternal grandfather to the Rockefellers, pushed the Federal Reserve Act through Congress just before Christmas when much of Congress was on vacation (Reference 3, 4, 5). When elected, Wilson passed the FED. Later, Wilson remorsefully replied (referring to the FED), "I have unwittingly ruined my country" (Reference 17, P. 31).
Now the banks financially back sympathetic candidates. Not surprisingly, most of these candidates are elected (Reference 1, P. 208-210, Reference 12, P. 235, Reference 14, P. 36). The bankers employ members of the Congress on weekends (nickname T club -out Thursday...-in Tuesday) with lucrative salaries (Reference 1, P. 209). Additionally, the FED started buying up the media in the 1930's and now owns or significantly influences most of it Reference 3, 10, 11, P. 145).
Presidents Lincoln, Jackson, and Kennedy tried to stop this family of bankers by printing U.S. dollars without charging the taxpayers interest (Reference 4). Today, if the government runs a deficit, the FED prints dollars through the U.S. Treasury, buys the debt, and the dollars are circulated into the economy. In 1992, taxpayers paid the FED banking system $286 billion in interest on debt the FED purchased by printing money virtually cost free (Reference 12, P. 265). Forty percent of our personal federal income taxes goes to pay this interest. The FED's books are not open to the public. Congress has yet to audit it.
Congressman Wright Patman was Chairman of the House of Representatives Committee on Banking and Currency for 40 years. For 20 of those years, he introduced legislation to repeal the Federal Reserve Banking Act of 1913.
Congressman Henry Gonzales, Chairman of a banking committee, introduces legislation to repeal the Federal Reserve Banking Act of 1913 nearly every year. It's always defeated, the media remains silent, and the public never learns the truth. The same bankers who own the FED control the media and give huge political contributions to sympathetic members of Congress (Reference 12, P. 155-163, Reference 22, P. 158, 159, 166).
Lot's of words, but they don't CHANGE the fact that the Governing Board of the Federal Reserve sets Federal Reserve POLICY, and the MEMBERS of that board are appointed to office by the President subject to approval by Congress.
The concept of "agency law" by which the various branches of the Federal Government VEST their authority in an agency has been contested many times over the years and has withstood every challenge. If you want to be concerned over an AGENCY, be concerned about the IRS; it has the vested authority to MAKE law (vested by the Legislative Branch), ENFORCE law (vested by the Executive Branch), and ADJUDICATE law (vested by the Judicial Branch) ! The Federal Reserve operates with power from only ONE branch, the Legislative Branch, perhaps two if you include their double-vested authority from the Treasury (which was ITSELF vested authority by the Legislative Branch).
Agency law stands.
Your arguments AGAINST the Federal Reserve all perpetuate the DELUSION that money has intrinsic value in and of itself. This is wrong. Money is simply a "token" we use to facilitate commerce. A Nation's WEALTH is defined by the goods-and-services it produces, and it's PROGRESS is defined by it's standard of living. NEITHER are defined by the amount of "money" or tokens it holds. See my post and ESPECIALLY the discussion at http://occupywallst.org/forum/what-is-money/ for detailed discussions.
Your FINAL arguments citing one person or another who agree with you are meaningless. A "citation" must include FACTS, and no number of men who agree with a falsehood can make it true.
The FACT is that both the WEALTH and STANDARD OF LIVING of America have done nothing but IMPROVE since the Federal Reserve was chartered. While I can't say this is a CAUSAL relationship, I CAN say it DISPROVES theories that declare the Federal Reserve System a complete failure.
The Fed isn't a failure, its the way its been run, used and manipulated...
Perhaps it could be run BETTER, but it is NOT a private bank, and we HAVE enjoyed a REMARKABLE increase in WEALTH and STANDARD OF LIVING since it was chartered in 1913. Not CAUSAL, but pretty direct PROOF it hasn't "ruined' America. All I ask is that people be INFORMED and apply REASONING when discussing the Federal Reserve, nothing more.
We've enjoyed an increase in wealth and standard of living due to scientific and technological development, not due to the FED. We've enjoyed an increased standard of living DESPITE the actions of the FED. If it weren't for the FED, we would be living in a utopia.
Need I remind you that the FED failed to protect the country from the great depression?
BTW, who tells the President who to appoint to the FED board? The banks that own the FED. Does the Pres have enough information to make the decision on his own? Even if he doesn't make back-room under the table deals, he has advisors. Economic advisors. Advisors who are in the business of protecting the banks, not the American public.
The whole system is a clever ruse designed confuse people like you.
Your first statement is an unsubstantiated assertion. Even if it were true, you most certainly cannot claim the interest rates managed by the Fed had nothing to do with the capital investments required to advance technology.
Yes, the Federal Reserve failed to protect us from the Great Depression which occurred shortly after it's founding before there was much experience or understanding in how best to operate. The Fed HAS saved us from many OTHER deep cycles since.
Finally, having accepted my position that the Governing Board of the Federal Reserve is appointed by the President subject to Congressional Approval just like many OTHER positions in Government, you NOW decide to argue your case from the perspective of SUSPICION and FEAR.
You don't KNOW what an elected official is thinking when they make a decision. The opinions we hold in the absence of objective evidence are more a reflection of our own character than of any objective reality. In this case, you have told me one of two things: Either A) If YOU were an elected official, YOU would be corrupt, or B) You believe ALL men are liars and cheats that cannot be trusted. NEITHER speaks well of you.
I understand the FEAR that many develop when confronted with powerful forces they do NOT UNDERSTAND. The correct REMEDY for such fear is EDUCATION, not HATRED. You might want to go GET some lest you become a Nazi and start advocating violence toward, and unfair treatment of, those you do not understand.
You are wrong. Look up member banks. They get a 6% annual return.
The Federal Reserve is NOT private, that is my ONLY point. We the People appoint the Board of Governors which set the Federal Reserve's POLICY. It is NOT a PRIVATE bank. My post and ESPECIALLY the discussion at http://occupywallst.org/forum/what-is-money/ argue that a POPULIST movement in a country deeply in DEBT should SUPPORT the current policies of the Federal Reserve.
That is a ridiculous notion! The length of great depression was the fault of the FED. The reason we have the issues we do is the fault of the fed holding interest rated artificially low, incentivesing borrowing. That coupled with Gov secured loans lead to the crash of 2008.
How do we appoint the members of the fed? Through our appointed officials?
No answer to that Rico?
No he is a propagandist! He has no idea what he is talking about. If you read the federal reserve act (http://www.federalreserve.gov/aboutthefed/section23a.htm If im not mistaken in this section.) you will see that it is a gov instituted, private bank that craps on the American people!
Good point!!!!
its a quasi agency. anyone familiar with the law would know this.
Sure, like the IRS, but it is most assuredly NOT private. That's my ONLY point here.
EXACTLY!!!!!"The Federal Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities..." — Lewis vs. United States 9th Circuit 1992
Congressman Kucinich has introduced legislation that should unite principled anti fed conservatives and the anti Wall Street left and advance the "demand" of the OW movement.
http://americanfreepress.net/?p=1094
[Removed]
now listen up Ben Shalom Bernnake -go back in your hole
you are quite right.
Congress makes the budget. Treasury writes checks. Fed cashes checks. Fed does not control money, nor does it cause depressions. No magic about Fed. Except that it can ALWAYS cash the check.
Wrong.
The Fed has exclusive control over the money supply. Our money supply was privatized with the creation of the Fed. The Fed creates Federal Reserve Notes and credit out of thin air and they "loan" in to the government and into circulation. Every bill in your wallet and every digit in your bank account is DEBT, loaned from the Federal Reserve. On the debt that they issue as currency, they make interest. Remember, they have no reserves, no money of their own; they merely order the "money" created and then make their profit on the interest. The entire national debt is owed to the Federal Reserve Bank, and the balance (over 14 TRILLION) accumulates interest (their profit) every second. Neither the Fed nor the IRS, their collection arm, are government agencies. Contrary to the disinfo in the OP, the Fed is owned by member banks and their shareholders, and other shareholders not part of the member banks. All shareholders are private. The Fed is a privately owned, for profit corporation, created in 1913, to loot the American people. Prior to their creation, our money was owned by the people and issued interest free, and not for the profit of a private cartel of international financiers. Privatizing our money was harmful as privatizing all water would be. We need to reclaim the people's money and abolish the private cartel that is raping us. The creation of the Fed was unconstitutional. Our founders warned about our money supply falling into private hands (because this financial cartel has operated for centuries) and the constitution mandates that our money supply belong to the people.
The Central Bank is an institution of the most deadly hostility existing against the principles and form of our Constitution. . . . I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. Already they have raised up a monied aristocracy that has set the Government at defiance. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people to whom it properly belongs. If the American people ever allow the banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the people of all property until their children will wake up homeless on the continent their fathers occupied.
– Thomas Jefferson
Dr. Paul 2012
Jefferson words will bring down this corrupt system-
quite old quote, don't you think it is time to refresh your knowledge? Fed reimburses interest.
You have already demonstrated that you have no idea what you're talking about and no, the interest belongs to the private, for profit corporation. It is not returned to the people. It is the mechanism by which they make money from nothing.
Indeed, it's an old quote. The same principals and truth applies today. The truth does not change.
TRUTH DOES NOT CHANGE. Read the new report from the Government Accounting Office.
The non-partisan, investigative arm of Congress determined that the Federal Reserve lacks a comprehensive system to deal with conflicts of interest, despite the serious potential for abuse. In fact, according to the report, the Fed provided conflict of interest waivers to employees and private contractors so they could keep investments in the same financial institutions and corporations that were given emergency loans.
For example, the CEO of JP Morgan Chase served on the New York Fed's board of directors at the same time that his bank received more than $390 billion in financial assistance from the Fed. Moreover, JP Morgan Chase served as one of the clearing banks for the Fed's emergency lending programs.
In another disturbing finding, the GAO said that on Sept. 19, 2008, William Dudley, who is now the New York Fed president, was granted a waiver to let him keep investments in AIG and General Electric at the same time AIG and GE were given bailout funds.
http://sanders.senate.gov/newsroom/news/?id=9e2a4ea8-6e73-4be2-a753-62060dcbb3c3
What's ironic is that that link is from bernie sanders and he was one of three senators who torpedoed Dr Paul's audit the Fed legislation by amending it from full and ongoing audits and complete transparency to just the bailout. Sanders did that to PROTECT the banks.
Despicable, I was not aware of that.
There is manipulation going on behind the scenes by self appointed OWS "leaders" who are pro big banks and the Fed. They are the ones who have diverted OWS from going after the financial international and redirected the focus to OWS becoming an arm of big labor. Here is one of their emails:
Mark, I agree with you completely. In fact just last night I was reading the section in Grieder's book on the Fed where he contrasts the class base and resulting politics of 19th vs. 20th century populists (progressive and reactionary respectively). (See bottom of page 265 for his punchline on this.) That's why I spoke of both left and right wing populists today. The kids today at OWS who are proworker, antiracist, antisexist, anti-imperialist, but who think the solution is ending the Fed, or restoring Glass-Steagall, or breaking up the big banks, or moving our money to credit unions -- isn't left populist a fair term for them? And it's meant not in an elitist or dismissive way, but as a sign of their lack of exposure to basic socialist ideas -- for which we all, of course, share some responsibility.
http://www.marxmail.org/msg96959.html
http://www.marxmail.org/threads.html#96936
These people are pro big banks and the Fed (the financial international) because they are Marxists. The financial international financed the Bolshevik revolution and has a long history with promoting communism for the peons with them as mastas over the global plantation. Communism for the slaves lorded over by an elite few. Those who are diverting attention away from them are interested in securing their perceived piece of the stinking, corrupt pie, as big labor has always done.
Thank you. I am aware of this and that is one reason for my attention to this site.
I read "Wall Street and the Blshevik Revolution," by Anthony Sutton. It is available for a free download at www.reformed-theology.org
Henry Makow wrote a very interesting article. http://www.henrymakow.com/occupy_wall_street_is_cointelp.html
Thank you for those links! Both are great researchers.
well - look it up. Fed reimburses interest to the Treasury.
If you are talking about Treasuries that are owned by other banks and countries - then yes - they get their interest. But then the interest is in US dollars, so US can always pay it. It does not have to borrow from some foreign bank.
I think you're confusing the interest charged to We the People with securities that are held by the Fed. They also charge interest on loans, such as those given in the bailout. That is not the interest charged to us on the creation of "money". You also have to understand that the "money" that the Fed loans our or buys securities (toxic assets, derivatives) with is OUR money. We the people are the lenders but the Fed reaps the profit, along with what they kick back to the treasury/govt. They take it from us, via inflation of the currency and taxes, lend it to their cronies as in the bailout), share the profits with the Federal govt (and become multi billionaries in this process) and add th created "money" to our national debt, which comes out of our hide. It's a very complicated criminal racket, played by financial geniuses who have been doing this for centuries.
So, tell me, if someone is using your wages to buy up the toxic assets of Wall Street, do you like that? If they make money in that process, do you like them adding billions to their personal fortunes (and this is how the Rothschilds came to own half the world) with money taken from you? Even including something as outrageous as buying the toxic assets of criminal financial institutions, and running absurd deficits to kill innocent people all over the world, if we did this ourselves, if the United States created their own debt money, there would be no money being made by the private corporation, the Fed. Why on earth would rather pay a corporation for something that you can do yourself? Would you like to pay the Fed for your water and air, too? I'm sure it could be arranged!
You got this exactly right. Well done!
There is a concerted effort on this board to lie to and mislead those who don't really understand what the Fed is and how it works. Look at the OP writing "The Federal Reserve is your FRIEND!". That's such a monstrous lie that it borders on demonic. The people doing this are trying hard to divert attention away from the very criminal financial cartel that drew people into OWS in the first place. The same thing happened with the tea parties and it is the same force that has hijacked both. It may not seem like it but it's just the left and right hidden hands of the same beast. The same beast who controls international finance (which is another division of that beast).
Neva go full retard
I have NO idea what that means. You just wasted 19 keystrokes (20 with 'Enter')
It means never go full retard... its pretty clear. If they were a public agency of government they would not have private property signs at their locations.
That's better... language an "oldster" like me can understand !
If you read the first 10 paragraphs or so of the encyclopedia entry at the link I provided, you'll learn the Federal Reserve SYSTEM does include private banks. The POLICY of the Federal Reserve is, however, set by the Governing Board. This relation between the regulated and the regulator is pretty common across regulatory agencies such as the FCC and FDA; each accepts inputs and comments from the industry they regulate, but they give those inputs whatever weight they desire in making DECISIONS.
By the way, I happen to do a LOT of business with the US Government, and I assure you that you can't just walk into MOST federal offices anymore even THOUGH they are "public property." This, of course, is due to the Oklahoma bombing, 9/11, and other such events. Even BEFORE terrorism and security became such big concerns, there were MANY "public" offices you couldn't just walk into: the Pentagon, Federal Prisons, the White House, military installations, etc; try to walk into any of THESE facilities, and security will stop you.
Lets get this clear saying the fed is not private is wrong it is a public/private operation but they are run by the share holders (not the government) "The Federal Reserve Banks are not federal instrumentalities..." — Lewis vs. United States 9th Circuit 1992 also they say Private property
First, at least changing the language folks are using from "The Federal Reserve is PRIVATE" to "The Federal Reserve is a Quasi-Governmental Agency" is a start.
I can't speak to the Supreme Court ruling as I haven't read it yet (I will), but how do YOU answer the fact that the POLICY making Governing Board IS in fact appointed by the US Government in a fashion similar to that used to seat Supreme Court justices? This is done SPECIFICALLY so POLITICIANS can't DIRECT the Federal Reserve's day-to-day operations for political benefit, and I think it makes a LOT of sense!
The federal reserve has monopolized so much power they are the masters of nearly every politician and every major news outlet . So regardless of who they appoint they are always supporting the same agenda. We must remember who wrote the federal reserve act. The rothschild, rockefeller, and morgan families along with a few others. They control who becomes elected and therefore controls who is in control of the Federal Reserve
[SIGH]. Yep, it's all because of the Zionists, Tri-Lateral Commission, Council on Foreign Relations, Illuminati, Knights Templar, Masons, Catholic Church, and my neighbor, Mike, who I'm POSITIVE is up to no good !
Yes you are right on all these things RICO! All these groups either exist or did exist in the past and all have wanted to shape the world a certain way....Now you might be reaching a bit on your neighbor "Mike"...
Beware of politicians who want to get rid of the FED, because then the politician becomes directly in charge of printing money, and politicians will print money without sound economic reasons. Without the FED, politicians will be printing money for their Pork projects in their districts (eg. Ron Pawl's district) to buy votes.
One reason we have the Fed is to put checks and balances in this process, just like we have checks and balances in other areas of government.
http://www.monetary.org/
Monetary reform is the critical missing element needed to move humanity back from the brink of economic destruction and nuclear disaster, away from a future dominated by fraud, ugliness and warfare, toward a world of justice and beauty.
The power to create money is an awesome power – at times stronger than the Executive, Legislative and Judicial powers combined. It’s like having a “magic checkbook,” where checks can’t bounce. When controlled privately it can be used to gain riches, but much more importantly it determines the direction of our society by deciding where the money goes – what gets funded and what does not. Will it be used to build and repair vital infrastructure such as the New Orleans levees and Minneapolis bridges to protect major cities? Or will it go into warfare and real estate loans creating the real estate bubble – leading to a crash and depression.
Thus the money issuing power should never be alienated from democratically elected government and placed ambiguously into private hands as it is in America in the Federal Reserve System today. Indeed, most people would be surprised to learn that the bulk of our money supply is not created by our government, but by private banks when they make loans. Through the Fed’s fractional reserve process the system creates “money” when banks make loans into accounts; so most of our money is issued as interest-bearing debt.
What a ridiculout notion. Ron P aul isn't going to put himself in charge of the money... he's going to follow the constitution and put the government in charge of printing the money.
Remember, the FED's DUTY is to limit inflation and prevent economic catastrophe. Where were they before the great depression? They have a VERY poor history of doing their job.
You can't just print money when your on the gold standard. At least get Ron Lawl's policy platform correct before creating a straw man argument against him.
I don't really see the value of gold. Why not use the tulip standard? Gold is only worth something because everyone else says it is worth something. It has artistic value because it is malleable, lustrous, and does not corrode. It's a good electrical conductor and used in electronic parts. But other than that it has about as much value as tulips. And of course we all know what happened to the tulip bubble.
Well now I guess that all depends on whether or not you believe in the ancient astronaught theory. ;)
Redistribute fed money to the American people - who they stole it from!
The people (Congress) created the Fed so that the Treasury (If you don't like Geithner, then think of him. If you don't like Bush, think of the former secretary Paulson) cannot print money at will. The Fed is the way for the people to reign in an unruly Treasury department.
Paul Warburg, a banker wrote the Federal Reserve Act of 1913. The Federal Reserve is Federal in name only.
The President appoints one director to the Board of Governors every 2 years, and the selection must be approved by Congress. However, the President makes the selection from a list given by the banks.
The first appointment is at the end of the first year in office. So, it would take 7 years before a President could appoint a majority of 4, to the 7 member board. If the President were to deviate from tjhe "bankster" plan, well the baks could cause a depression by with holding loans.
97% of what we thinkl of as money is actually a bank loan, including all of our bill aka Federal Reserve Notes.
"Give me control of a nation's money and I care not who makes it's laws" —Mayer Amschel Bauer Rothschild
Quotes on Banking and the Federal Reserve
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Evils%20in%20Government/Federal%20Reserve%20Scam/quotes_on_the_federal_reserve.htm
You are either an idiot or a liar.
The constitution mandates that out currency be under the control of congress because it belongs to we the people. Our currency was PRIVATIZED when it was give to the Fed who has printed us into complete debt slavery.
So, was this stupidity on your part or are you playing with the self appointed "leaders" who have taken over this movement and don't want ANY coming down on banks?
For instance:
Mark, I agree with you completely. In fact just last night I was reading the section in Grieder's book on the Fed where he contrasts the class base and resulting politics of 19th vs. 20th century populists (progressive and reactionary respectively). (See bottom of page 265 for his punchline on this.) That's why I spoke of both left and right wing populists today. The kids today at OWS who are proworker, antiracist, antisexist, anti-imperialist, but who think the solution is ending the Fed, or restoring Glass-Steagall, or breaking up the big banks, or moving our money to credit unions -- isn't left populist a fair term for them? And it's meant not in an elitist or dismissive way, but as a sign of their lack of exposure to basic socialist ideas -- for which we all, of course, share some responsibility.
http://www.marxmail.org/msg96959.html
http://www.marxmail.org/threads.html#96936
Please donate to help the cause:
http://occupywallst.org/donate/
This movement is not about EndTheFedNow (Please go to Ryan Paul's movement for that) This movement is about:
http://www.nycga.net/resources/declaration/
As we gather together in solidarity to express a feeling of mass injustice, we must not lose sight of what brought us together. We write so that all people who feel wronged by the corporate forces of the world can know that we are your allies.
As one people, united, we acknowledge the reality: that the future of the human race requires the cooperation of its members; that our system must protect our rights, and upon corruption of that system, it is up to the individuals to protect their own rights, and those of their neighbors; that a democratic government derives its just power from the people, but corporations do not seek consent to extract wealth from the people and the Earth; and that no true democracy is attainable when the process is determined by economic power. We come to you at a time when corporations, which place profit over people, self-interest over justice, and oppression over equality, run our governments. We have peaceably assembled here, as is our right, to let these facts be known.
They have taken our houses through an illegal foreclosure process, despite not having the original mortgage. They have taken bailouts from taxpayers with impunity, and continue to give Executives exorbitant bonuses. They have perpetuated inequality and discrimination in the workplace based on age, the color of one’s skin, sex, gender identity and sexual orientation. They have poisoned the food supply through negligence, and undermined the farming system through monopolization. They have profited off of the torture, confinement, and cruel treatment of countless animals, and actively hide these practices. They have continuously sought to strip employees of the right to negotiate for better pay and safer working conditions. They have held students hostage with tens of thousands of dollars of debt on education, which is itself a human right. They have consistently outsourced labor and used that outsourcing as leverage to cut workers’ healthcare and pay. They have influenced the courts to achieve the same rights as people, with none of the culpability or responsibility. They have spent millions of dollars on legal teams that look for ways to get them out of contracts in regards to health insurance. They have sold our privacy as a commodity. They have used the military and police force to prevent freedom of the press. They have deliberately declined to recall faulty products endangering lives in pursuit of profit. They determine economic policy, despite the catastrophic failures their policies have produced and continue to produce. They have donated large sums of money to politicians, who are responsible for regulating them. They continue to block alternate forms of energy to keep us dependent on oil. They continue to block generic forms of medicine that could save people’s lives or provide relief in order to protect investments that have already turned a substantial profit. They have purposely covered up oil spills, accidents, faulty bookkeeping, and inactive ingredients in pursuit of profit. They purposefully keep people misinformed and fearful through their control of the media. They have accepted private contracts to murder prisoners even when presented with serious doubts about their guilt. They have perpetuated colonialism at home and abroad. They have participated in the torture and murder of innocent civilians overseas. They continue to create weapons of mass destruction in order to receive government contracts.* To the people of the world,
We, the New York City General Assembly occupying Wall Street in Liberty Square, urge you to assert your power.
Exercise your right to peaceably assemble; occupy public space; create a process to address the problems we face, and generate solutions accessible to everyone.
To all communities that take action and form groups in the spirit of direct democracy, we offer support, documentation, and all of the resources at our disposal.
Join us and make your voices heard!
*These grievances are not all-inclusive.
You're parroting without knowledge. Much of what you parrot your grievances to be are made possible by the Fed. You don't correct any of it without getting rid of the problem and the problem is the privatization of the people's money supply.
its pretty simple make competing currencies LEGAL
SPOT ON ! This is WHY the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve are appointed much like Supreme Court justices... to REMOVE them from POLITICAL control over their day-to-day decisions.
Please click on the up arrow so that my post rises to the top,
Congress makes and approves budgets. Fed merely cashes the checks. So politicians are already "printing money"
Wrong. Fed controls the money supply by controlling short term rates it lends to money center banks. If congress (ie the agent of the American public) does not like what the Fed is doing, they can appoint someone else to the board.
no, rates do not control money supply.