Forum Post: Stay the Course! It's driving them crazy!
Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 18, 2011, 10:26 a.m. EST by lgarz
(287)
from New York, NY
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
In a normal situation I would have no problem agreeing to come up with a list of demands, but this movement is something different, and you have to acknowledge new ideas, and new ways of getting things done.
I have noticed how crazy OWS is driving the Wall Street establishment. Nobody else had been able to do that. So, I'm saying that you have to stay on course because your enemies don't know what to do with you.
You should judge your effectiveness by the response you get. Right now, your enemies are howling and pulling out every dirty trick they can think of. Meanwhile, your friends are coming out in droves to support you, so, if it aint broke don't fix it. Stay the Course!
It seems like a movement with nebulous goals is a movement that anybody can join because they bring their own goals and anger to the movement. This is a new idea.
You make a big mistake if you start to think that your enemies are stupid, or lazy. The people who hate you are very smart. They have destroyed every protest movement that has gone against them in the last 30 years. On the other hand, they are completely flummoxed by the Teflon OWS! I call that Genius! And suggest that you keep it up. Stay the Course!
In addition, consider the following: Who in the Government are you going to deliver your list of demands to?? The President, John Boehner, Eric Cantor? You'd have better luck delivering them to Rush Limbaugh.
Who is going to negotiate your demands? A leader? A spokesperson? A group of Lawyers? Your enemies are people who think that a Million Dollars is pocket change. How soon will it be before your leaders sell you out? How long will it be before your demands are whittled down to nothing? How long before you become just "Sound and fury signifying nothing?
What'll happen if everybody doesn't agree? A list of hard and fast demands almost guarantees an internal fight. All you have to do is look at the comments on this board to understand that.
In addition, if you elect a leader, what you have done is to Elect a Target. Stay the Course!
America is not Egypt. They only had one simple demand which was that, "The Regime had to go!" That simple demand is why they were victorious. Unfortunately, that won't work here. Stay the course.
I think it is a trap to say, we want this or that. It is much harder for your enemies to attack, and much more effective to just say I'M MAD AS HELL, AND I WON'T TAKE IT ANY MORE! Any politician worth his salt knows that they have to respond with something serious to meet that kind of demand. So, stay the Course!
The President had a whole list of demands, he's charismatic leader and effective spokesperson for his party, and do you see how they treat him. What makes you think you wouldn't meet the same effective opposition? The Wall Street Establishment is very good at saying that your demands are impossible because of a whole host of lame excuses that boil down to "We don't want to do that!
No my friends, as a six decade long witness to history, in my humble opinion, listing your demands and electing a spokesperson to have a unified voice is the road to ruin. New times demand new thinking, and new problems demand new solutions. Stay the Course my Brothers it's driving them crazy!
Sun Tzu would indicate this is the correct strategy..Obfuscation, Perplexity..Tools to be used against your opposition.
wow you're right, its all here
http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/s/sun_tzu.html
Great post. I'm not sure if saying the 'the regime/govt. has to go!' is necessarily so wrong of a position, but for the rest of the post i agree wholeheartedly. That part about 'stay the course' especially.
Every time they flex with their little power games it only makes Occupy stronger.
And i think it is a very crucial point you bring up regarding our 'enemies' being very smart. They are cunning, masters of manipulation and know how to play the game and aren't afraid to play dirty.
However, i also agree that they don't know how to handle this, so keep it peaceful, stay true and focused in your resolve and keep the energy up. Ignore the trolls, on the mainstream news, on these forums wherever. Don't feed them, unless to engage in positive dialogue. The only power anyone opposed to this movement has is the power you give them, in my opinion.
This movement is one of the few things that inspires me that we can make positive changes in this world where the greedy have got away with far too much, for far too long.
As James Joyce said, 'History is the nightmare from which i'm trying to awken.'
So let's wake up, and wake people up.
Peace.
We ought to give anarchists props where their due.
Not all of them are out to destroy the establishment. They just want it to be tolerable.
Thank you for this inspiring and right on post. We must win the hearts and minds of all Americans through an example of integrity, sacrifice, and outreach to all those andry, suffering and disenfranchised. That is the only message, the only demand - change! And we WILL achieve it!
Hi Igarz, Excellent. Best Regards, Nevada
Thank you.
Well I have to admit, you do have a valid point, we just have to patient and allow the masses to wake up and come on board.
Great post!
Do we, as in us, as in OWS, have a hiearchy? Is someone in charge? Is someone who speaks for us all, unequivocably, consulting with the establishment? I don't want the Unions speaking for me. I don't want the Flower Power revival, the religious or the lawyers speaking for me. I want one of us. Is there any of that? Are we more than a mob?
Does an idea need a leader?
Exactly!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Z9WVZddH9w
Not crazy. Annoyed. Amused.
You make a big mistake if you start to think that your enemies are stupid, or lazy. The people who hate you are very smart. They have destroyed every protest movement that has gone against them in the last 30 years. On the other hand, they are completely flummoxed by the Teflon OWS! I call that Genius! And suggest that you keep it up. Stay the Course!
It is brilliant, even if accidentally so. In this way
we become like water.
We become unstoppable!
And what is even hilarious is the fact that they will actually end up providing that list of demands for us!!*
They will! Just watch!
They can kill one of us. They can kill one hundred of us. But they cannot kill an idea, and they will not kill this movement!
http://zendogblog.net
http://occupywallst.org/users/ZenDog/
.
I'm watching, I'm watching! Cause I think you're right.
Your analogy is right on the money. Water goes around obstacles, and destroys them by doing so. I love it!
Does the word Tsunami sound familiar??? The more you try to bottle a tidal wave up, the bigger, more irresitable it becomes. So let it be with OWS!
WOOT!!
Haha. Youre funny. Oh and delusional also.
Have you seen my movie?
http://zendogblog.net/videos.htm
I think it's still on You-Tube - but I'm on dial-up and I can't really tell . . .
It's part of Taoism and the philosophy of Sun Tzu..
Now that is interesting. I made a statement regarding my movie, indicating that it might still be on You-Tube but that I'm not certain.
You've implied you've seen it, without answering the question.
I have read The Art of War and I have studied a bit of the works from Lao Tzu, Taoism, and the history of China - but you wouldn't know that.
Yet I fail to understand how you derive Taoist influences from the movie.
Perhaps it isn't available on You-Tube anymore . . . .
No I have not seen your movie..but your idea of flowing like /with water is the same in the Taoist tradition. I'll watch your movie.
Now I have watched your movie and you are right, on the surface there is no connection except for the idea of being humble, in the fact that "No one ever knows"..
Thanks. And sorry - I have a hard time keeping track of who says what. This site isn't really designed with that capability, the text is small, and I need glasses.
But I can tell you've been paying attention.
Thanks, no problem..
Eh, no thanks. Couldn't get past the first bizarre 10 seconds. You expect people are to take you seriously by sharing that video?
I don't know. I know I take that video seriously. Some of my own friends are dead.
There is no proof, of course.
What is interesting - and this was not my intent, I never gave it a thought at the time - I was attempting to gather a bit of sidewalk footage to go with another poem. The sidewalk is usually broken into five foot segments. You can guage a persons pace just with a bit of film. As it happened, the sidewalk was a few hundred yards away from a federal building. The police apparently went to VCAM not long after demanding access to film footage.
No one specifically said they were after my footage.
Oh, and the poem I was attempting to skit?
.
Every Corner
.
Every
chance
encounter
every corner
every staircase
each and every curb
becomes a forcing function
it's an engineering term.
Did you just step in dog shit?
How was your measured pace,
dictated by some function
forcing footsteps to their place?
.
© D. Winter 1999 - 2008
http://zendogblog.net/concrete/corner.htm
.
It's an early piece.
I've been at this awhile.
this movement isn't driving anyone crazy. their only fear is that it will turn against "them" and this movement will start naming the true enemy. so far hardly anyone is doing that.
what scares them we must do and that is to name the enemy within
it is driving them crazy because the OWS movement is set of the destruction of your country now
ows makes demands !!!
1) return of the dead sea scrolls to the american indians 2) mcrib all year 3) laser tag for the poor 4) free gum 5) return of Bill Cosby as rightful spokesman for jello-pops
Sounds like "I'm mad as hell but I don't know why!" I think that's what they use Prozac for isn't it?
Who are you driving crazy, exactly? 99% of the population is unaffected and ignoring you. Come on, who are we kidding, it's way more than 99% that's unaffected and ignoring you.
OWS is nothing if not self-important.
If OWS isn't driving the Wall Street Establishment crazy, then why are they pulling out every dirty trick they can to destroy the movement? Have you seen the negativity on this board??? You don't think that's organized? I can almost feel Turd Blossoms Finger prints all over this operation.
But, It is a simple fact of life that you don't attack peaceful demonstrations with Police unless they threaten you, or drive you up the walls!
Lastly, you can't say with any basis in fact that the 99% aren't affected by Wall Street. You also can't say that 99% are ignoring OWS, but I'll give you that. But you must concede that If it's only 75% that are effected, and paying attention it's significant and you only need 51% to win an election.
If Republicans were that successful in 2 months, Rush would be crowing like a Rooster with 100 chicks!
[Removed]
Driving who crazy? The poor cops maybe as they have to put up with all the shenanigans. Now voting people out of congress will drive the establishment crazy. Motivate voters to make change, not a bunch of campers and squatters.
The Mayor, Wall Street! Fox News! Rush Limbaugh! The Republican Establishment! They are all going mad.
Their Hair is on Fire, because they know that the rise of OWS precedes the fall of their empires. At the very least, OWS has empowered the Liberals in Government to stand up to their Wall Street masters, at worst they have changed the political conversation. Both of those things are no mean feats in the face of the political power of the Wall Street Establishment.
But, their greed will be their Downfall! And, OWS by their mere presence on the Streets highlights their Greed for the world to see.
Lastly, there is so much wrong in America that you cannot focus on single issue politics to effect the change the country needs.
Fox is having a blast with this. They're making the case that you represent the "front line of Obama's army", that ows is the natural result of his ties to Ayers and Jones and Wright, etc.
You better turn this into a political campaign and get out the vote, because I guarantee you the protests will galvanize the Republican base even further.
A joke..and propaganda from FOX "News"
You can call it a joke but you might want to read up on the 1968 Democratic convention and its direct effect on the election that year (hint: they lost badly).
A relevant exerpt from Wiki:
"After the Chicago protests, the demonstrators were confident that the majority of Americans would side with them over what had happened in Chicago, especially because of police behavior. They were shocked to learn that controversy over the war in Vietnam overshadowed their cause.[6] Daley claimed to have received 135,000 letters supporting his actions and only 5000 condemning them. Public opinion polls demonstrated that the majority of Americans supported the Mayor’s tactics.[26]"
It's all a joke and both these parties, no matter who you vote for, are destroying the country...
Both parties bring you to Hell..One party gets you there in a car and the other gets you there on a plane..Destination is still the same.
You have a way higher opinion of your little ows protest than you should. Oh, by the way, the sky isn't falling.....
The sky isn't falling but America's economic system is broken and cannot be repaired unless it is restructured.
Restructured how?
Demand that the voters have a direct say in every decision that is made in our government since they have shown complete incompetence to effectively run this country.
Really. Every decision? You expect anyone to take you seriously with a demand like that? We can barely get 50% of eligible voters to vote in a presidential election. How are you going to motivate people to vote every week? You must have been the lady I saw smoking dope in the park while some other owser was being interviewed last week. This type of demand is why you represent the .00000000000099% not the 99% or whatever it is you claim to represent.
You have to demand the extreme before you can compromise in the middle.
Demand must have merit before there is negotiation for compromise
Yo, if you listen to Fox News It is, and there is an OWS Wolf at the door too!
OWS should have a high opinion of it's self just because they make Rush & O'Reily squeal like unfed Pigs everyday! That is a singular accomplisment in and of it's self.
What does "making Rush & O'reily squeal" have to do with ows accomplishing anything. If that and demanding Americans "get a direct say in every decision that is made in our government" are your objectives, I say, between giggles, good luck!
They wouldn't be squealing if they weren't being hurt. Ows has already accomplished alot because they have Republican apologists like you working overtime to discredit the movement. They wouldn't be paying you top dollar if they weren't scared to death!
How have they been hurt? Actually you've accomplished nothing if you are using me as the measuring stick. I'm just a lowly independent voter who is sickened by most all politicians. I'm just surprised at the lack of real ideas and objectives ows has communicated. I'm also extremely amused at the childish comments I read like barb had above. Equally amused of your lack of real understanding as to who really needs to be uncomfortable in order to make change. Good luck. I hope you don't wear yourself out with the silliness.
An Independent voter is a Republican who is to ashamed to admit he's a Republican. Bill O'Reily calls himself an Independent too, and everyone can see where's he's coming from. So, stop trying to hide your true colors behind an Independent flag. You're a card carrying member of the Vast Right Wing Conspiracy that rules this country, and you wouldn't be on this board 24/7 if you wasn't scared to death of what's happening.
I am equally amused at your attempt to discredit a movement that has changed the conversation in Washington, and enboldened Democrats to Fight against Teabagger Republicans in 3 short months, and no amount of denials will change that. And, it's only the beginning of the Ass whippping your party is about to recieve.
Have a happy Thanksgiving It may be your last.
Actually, this board amuses me more than most any show on television other than reruns of 1 1/2 men. I'm also not a member of the right wing. In fact I support many democratic perspectives and positions. I happen not to believe you have to take a hard line position in either ditch.
What I find intriguing is the lack of responsibility members of ows take for the situation they might be in. All I hear is there are no jobs, the Jews control the banks, the 1% wants us poor, the man keeps me down, whine, whine, whine.
Now to address your last comment. Is that a threat? Are you threatening my demise? Is your real approach to eliminate anyone who might remotely disagree with you? If so, good luck. Eventually the laws of this great land will deal with you and God will judge you. Wow, I have to admit that other than at a little league game, I've never been threatened with my life before.
BTW, it should be, "if you weren't scared", not "wasn't". Funny, I've been told over and over again how educated ows folks are....
Like most Conservatives you didn't answer the question. You chose instead to obfuscate and ignore.
So, let me get this straight, I tell you to "Have a Happy Thanksgiving" and you feel like your life has been threatened. I said it might be your last because our whole economy may be in ditch by next year and you may be one of the casualties of your own "Independence," and you want to call the cops! That is true courage.
I am on the side of those who have nothing, and you are on the side of the Greedy Bastards who have it all. And you want God to judge me??? Are you serious???
Somewhere in the bible it says that "The Greed for Money is at the root of all Evil! You are on the side of those who believe that "Greed is Good!" I didn't go to Harvard or Yale, I'm a poor graduate of UCLA, (The University on the Corner of Lexington Avenue) and NYU (New York Unemployment) but, by my admittely uneducated mind that means that YOU are on the side of Evil!
Shoot, I will gladly stand trial before my God for my Sins, are you ready to be judged for yours? Remember the other one, "Judge not lest ye be judged!" How will you fare before St. Peter???
So, when it comes down to God judging someone, I think He's on my side, and the side of OWS. That other guy is on your side. Shoot, even Jesus threw out the Bankers! Why can't you???
In addition, don't project your shortcomings onto me. I don't really care about people who disagree with me. What bothers me is to leave an outright lie unchallenged. You and your kind lie, I counter with the truth, and you feel like you need to call a cop for protection! Are you scared of a little unwashed Hippe Freak or something??? Put on your Man pants for once!
Also, I would like to point out that If you have never felt threatened before, you don't live in New York City where most feel threatened anytime a cop stops them. it must be nice to live in a gilded cage and look down on regular people, I don't have that luxury.
You cite the lack of responsibility that OWS members take for their own situation, as amusing??? Are you serious! Let me tell you something, when a college grad has to take a job in McDonalds to pay his student loans, there is something wrong in this country! And people have the right to raise their voices in protest! OK!
If you are too blind to see that people are fed up with that reality, and are occupying the streets to protest that fact, you are part of the problem. And, if you don't climb on board the OWS train, don't complain when you're out on the street trying to sell apples to the folks Occupying Wall Street that you hate.
So, like I said, Have a Happy Thanksgiving my Friend, it may be the last time that you have anything to be thankful for.
Thank you so much for the clarification as I could have sworn you made a very poorly veiled threat. Good cover though.
As I said I don't find it necessary to anchor in either ditch as you do. Not sure who's on your side. Maybe God, but not really sure. Though I think he loves well intentioned independents, liberals, and conservatives equally. Now what out lie is unchallenged? Brother, you are a confusing individual, clearly prone to emotional outburst as well. The way you talk in circles you must be a congressman posing as an owser.