Forum Post: Occupiers are terrorists to the communities in which they try to help...
Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 10, 2011, 5:30 a.m. EST by thomasmiller
(163)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
Oakland is a city that has constantly struggled with economy and crime even during the best of times. I do not see how occupying Oakland is going to help with anything. By Occupying Oakland, will the corporate world suddenly, or over time, become less greedy? Why not Occupy a corporate center like Mountain View where companies such as Google are headquartered? There is nothing in Oakland besides street gangs. Oakland was forgotten and written off long long ago.
I see Occupy Oakland as a useless enterprise with no other purpose then to terrorize the citizens of Oakland. There is no point in occupying this struggling city except to prove that you can do it. I see Oakland quickly downtrending into chaos and the local government has already lost control. Its too bad because they did try very hard.
If the Occupiers want to Occupy a place that will move their cause forward then my suggestion is to occupy centers of corporate business and politics. Occupying a struggling city like Oakland amounts to terrorism.
I know some here might not see it my way, but I just do not see the point behind bringing down chaos upon a city that has already been very problematic.
1.) The Port of Oakland is the fifth busiest container port in the United States. 2.) Every city should have an occupy movement because it has what every other city in this country has -PEOPLE.
Excellent and well reasoned post against the movement in Oakland.
Yes, Occupy Silicon Valley ... the software created there has enslaved millions. No joke.
I bet you don't live in Oakland. People pretending they know whats best for other people and places in places they don't live work or visit is lame. Who died and made you spokesman for Oakland? Do the residents of Oakland frighten you? Do you feel threatened by their participation? I'm betting you do. I don't believe for a second that you care about the people of Oakland, you just saw this as an opportunity to further trolldom on the board. Occupation in smaller areas is to show support and provide people with an outlet and a chance to be counted and included.
I have nothing against protests. However, when innocent people's lives and livelihood are threatened for no other purpose then to show that it can be done then thats where I take issue.
Im not Obama neither am I Boehner so why are you taking the protest to my door? I know the issues, I have access to Google and I dont need some 18 year old with a sign breaking my window to reinforce it.
If you want to protest, then go to Washington DC. However, do not take it to my door. Do not force this down upon me and, like I said, you might feel bold because no one has defended themselves yet from your violence and destruction, but you havent run into me yet. If I am attacked or my business attacked, then I will defend it.
You use a lot of big words, but what's the point?
You've said your peace on the forum, no sense repeating it like a parrot. You can either go to the general assemblies, or wait for the protests to move around your house at which time you can shoot some protesters if you wish. You'll have a court case and all will be decided by law. That's fine.
We get you. We've heard you. We've heard another 100 rants like yours. Now it's just uncreative repetition. It's lame and boring.
Stop talking and do something about it.
Myself like other residents in the community will defend themselves from violence brought upon us. These are not peaceful protests. When buildings are burning and windows smashed, thats not peaceful. Im ready for whatever will come next. I will not be one of the business owners to leave his business open for the mob, but will be inside all tucked away with my weaponry. Bring it on. I tell you if my business is going to be taken out, Im going to take quite a few with me.
Then stop talking and start shooting. What's the point of being a parrot in a forum, repeating the same thing over and over again? At least be somewhat creative to keep the reader's interest.
It was a group called Black Bloc that caused the troubles and destruction of property. Occupy protesters tried to stop them.
The truth about occupy protesters supposed "riots" in Oakland and the distortion put upon you by the media.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rqoFR1MPSH0&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL
Occupy is a peaceful protest. Anyone committing an act of violence is not a member of occupy.
Im not talking about Black Bloc. I am questioning why we really need an Occupy settlement in Oakland. What corporate greed is in Oakland? Oakland is a struggling city which is home to many of this country's gang and drug violence.
If you want to establish an Occupy settlement, then why do it there? Why not put it right at Google's front door or in Sacramento at the steps of the capital? Why bring punishment down upon Oakland? Why do we have to shut the port down for a day or have massive demonstrations there and further hurt the economy?
See my post below for an answer. The people caught up in drug and violence are the people that need the most help, so they want to forge a link with them.
You should read up on anarchism and its history. Many of your questions seem off because you lack some knowledge of the background of the movement and its goals.
This isn't anarchy. We just want our government back.
Occupy Wall Street is a people-powered movement that began on September 17, 2011 in Liberty Square in Manhattan’s Financial District, and has spread to over 100 cities in the United States and actions in over 1,500 cities globally. #ows is fighting back against the corrosive power of major banks and multinational corporations over the democratic process, and the role of Wall Street in creating an economic collapse that has caused the greatest recession in generations. The movement is inspired by popular uprisings in Egypt and Tunisia, and aims to expose how the richest 1% of people are writing the rules of an unfair global economy that is foreclosing on our future.
The occupations around the world are being organized using a non-binding consensus based collective decision making tool known as a "people's assembly".
You've just described an anarchy. You just don't know it.
Why don't you take a bit of time to read about how your movement started and how it's organized?
Here is a must read article in Business Week.
http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/david-graeber-the-antileader-of-occupy-wall-street-10262011.html
Here are some essays by David Graeber.
http://theanarchistlibrary.org/topics/David_Graeber.html
How are you going to get your government back? By victimizing the ordinary citizens of a community?
I will warn you Trevor. You bust open my shops window and your brain is going to be on the pavement literally. Keep going like you are going and you will be responsible for someone's untimely demise.
One day the good citizens are going to come out and take their community back from thugs like you.
Lulz I am nonviolent. Obviously you relish the day you get to shoot someone. That is a link to being a sociopath.
I am an ordinary citizen. I actually fight for my constitutional rights while you threaten to shoot people for crimes they don't commit.
Go read the declaration of Independence and then the constitution. Your government is lying to you and infringing on our rights. Yes, yours and mine.
Our money system is not what we have been led to believe. The creation of money has been "privatized," or taken over by private money lenders. Thomas Jefferson called them “bold and bankrupt adventurers just pretending to have money. Except for coins, all of our money is now created as loans advanced by private banking institutions — including the privately-owned Federal Reserve. Banks create the principal but not the interest to service their loans. To find the interest, new loans must continually be taken out, expanding the money supply, inflating prices — and robbing you of the value of your money.
Wake up
Call me a sociopath if you like. If you bring your protest to my door...if you smash my windows or terrorize my business, then I will defend it. If you hurt my family members, then I will defend it. Not everyone is going to sit there and let themselves be victimized. I will not watch this happen as you destroy things.
Then stop talking about shooting others and start acting like a responsible ordinary citizen. You can take part in the general assemblies. What's the point of being a parrot in a forum, repeating the same thing over and over again?
Looks like the OP's rant was buried by consensus.
The people who Occupy Oakland are not Americans. They do not care about America. They are a group of criminals similar to common everyday street gangs. Thugs. If one of those persons were to break into my business then I would do everything within the law to defend my property. The majority of Americans do not support this.
According to what a Fox news poll? Nobody called me and asked my opinion. Of course I don't really believe they've been counting my votes in quite awhile either. Unless you show up to a GA in Oakland, people are just gonna think its not a complaint from an actual person. This board is being attacked by 1% wanna be's non stop. Blame the Tea Party for that. You read enough fiction designed to cause friction and that is what happens.
You should go to the GA's and express your concern there. Doing so in the forum doesn't help. You are just wasting your time, and your trolling actually helps the movement because people can tell your arguments are not solid and well thought out.
Im not going to attend any "GA" and tell people what should be common sense to them. If they dont see it, then my attendance at a meeting isnt going to make them see it. I think its a bunch of kids who dont know any better. Children in adults bodies. I think Cain had it right, go and get a job and make something of yourself. You want to take this protest to the door of Obama and Boehner, but dont take it to my door.
You won't go to a GA because you don't live in Oakland. The Tea Party sent you and they can have you back. Even kids can spot you.
Then stop talking and start shooting. What's the point of being a parrot in a forum, repeating the same thing over and over again? At least be somewhat creative to keep the reader's interest.
I told you where to go if you want to protest. Protest where it counts. Coming into my business...into my residence...is not the place for your protest. If you want to force it down upon me, then it will end badly and I dont care about any courtcase. I will defend what I have and you will have to pry my weapon out of my cold dead hands. You want a fight then you will get one.
Then stop talking and start shooting. What's the point of being a parrot in a forum, repeating the same thing over and over again? At least be somewhat creative to keep the reader's interest.
They are ists, not terrorists.
Why not center the protests around a corporate or government center? Why bring this to a struggling city and punish the very people they are trying to help?
Change starts will the people, not the government nor the corporations. They want to grow the movement by getting more and more citizens to support it, therefore it makes sense they want to be right in the middle of where citizens live, and not at some industrial park.
As for punishing the very people they are trying to help, I agree. I think it has been exaggerated to some degree, but I definitely don't like the ideas of roadblocks, and they have to settle the problem of the black bloc. The idea of strikes have a long history in anarchist-pacifico movements, so you can read about this tactic if you want to understand it better.
Occupy is just beginning and they have a lot to learn, especially on how to interact with the community and make citizens feel like they are helping and not obstructing their lives. I trust that they want to do this, but have done some misplaced steps so far. I believe it will get better.
Once of the beautiful things is how the GA's are organized. You can easily go and table your concerns or ideas. That is much more effective than this forum. If you live in Oakland, and do not want to see such things as roadblocks, you can go down to the meetings and explain your concerns and even propose alternatives. They will all vote on the issues. You can bring some of your friends and all vote together. I have spoken to Occupy Oakland supporters and they are all working to this end. They agree in full with you and want things to change. It's about giving them a chance.
Finally, you have to look at the big picture. There are some Occupy factions that have created a rift between themselves and the community like in Oakland, but there are some who have done the opposite. Occupy Montréal is a good example. They have been wonderful to the citizens and the city and have helped the homeless and the elderly. Some of the occupiers are taking a training course at a homeless shelter. The mayor and the cops are mostly all for the movement and have shown their support. Everything is peaceful as can be, and the citizens show up at the GA's which are outside. It feels like attending the city square in Ancient Greece. Quite nice.
I look at this from a business owner's standpoint...I look at this from a man who has to raise a family. I wouldnt want this in front of my business. I wouldnt want this in front of my family. If one of these occupiers were to get in the way of my family or my business, then I would take every measure under the law to defend them. You want to come into my business and make trouble then you will be staring down the barrel of my M4.
One of the best measures you can take is to go to their general assembly and raise your concern with well thought out arguments. Being uncreative and simply repeating rants you pick from others does not really help.
What will work is me standing outside my business with my M4. Come and try to break into my business. I want to see you try.
Then stop talking and start shooting. What's the point of being a parrot in a forum, repeating the same thing over and over again? At least be somewhat creative to keep the reader's interest.
Ok I will be creative, go fuck yourself.
Then be creative and start using thought provoking arguments. Saying things like "go fuck yourself" is banal and easy. Everyone does it. Pick up a book. Learn some insults. Don't let your mind become an ameba.