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Forum Post: Is capitalism flawed?

Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 11, 2011, 1:02 p.m. EST by ddashred (11)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

You can argue that capitalism is flawed. Or maybe that it's working perfectly.

Though I sympathize with OccupyWallStreet and am in the 99%, I don't understand the protests.

It's like you feed the monster and then ask it not to swallow you whole. How many of the protesters have clothes on with labels? How many go home and immediately turn on the TV to be influence by the commercials to purchase more products from Wall Street Corporations? How many are tweeting from their iPhone (ads, ads, ads)?

We allow these corporate entities to take advantage by not consciously understanding that most everything we see in our daily lives is to get us to push their profits. Ads on the trains, the TV, on FaceBook, the pressure to get the latest phone, etc.

Capital makes capital.

And capitalism is rooted in the exploitation of labor.

Turn off the TV. Read a book. Get off FaceBook. Walk in the park. Support a struggling musician. Support a struggling painter. Instead of going to see a movie at the AMC Theatre, go to see Jonathan Batiste at the Moldy Fig.

33 Comments

33 Comments


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[-] 1 points by Avoice (81) 13 years ago

Capitalism is what motivates our system of business. Capitalism works. What doesn't work is when corporations use means that are not transparent to the American people to influence laws and policies that that give them a huge economical advantage over people who don't have easy access to Washington DC or even Albany NY. Charging 29.99% on a credit card accountl is just a small example of how our banking system can work around our finance laws. If I packaged worthless mortgage securities and sold them back to investors and government agencies I would be bankrupt if I wasn't in jail. Our system is bruised. We saved our wealthy elitist friends from a heavy fall from grace. Gov. Cuomo and the rest of our elected officials have turned their backs as corporations made sure that once the dust settled things would return to normal. Capitalism is alive and well. Democracy was damaged.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 13 years ago

mayhaps it is a bit to much to expect humans to be fair in a system based on greed

[-] 1 points by enigmaticblake (14) 13 years ago

Nothing is wrong with capitalism if everyone is included. 49% of every single company should be forced to sell stock to their employees and the purchases finaced by the Banks who create money through debt. 4.9% per year can be sold to employee's and the transition would take 10 years. This would align the interests of everyone in a company, and it would align the interest of everyone in the nation, and destroy the impulse towards socialism.

[-] 1 points by atki4564 (1259) from Lake Placid, FL 13 years ago

Exactly, but they need a comprehensive strategy that implements all their demands at the same time, and although I'm all in favor of taking down today's ineffective and inefficient Top 10% Management Group of Business & Government, there's only one way to do it – by fighting bankers as bankers ourselves. Consequently, I have posted a 1-page Summary of the Strategic Legal Policies, Organizational Operating Structures, and Tactical Investment Procedures necessary to do this at:

http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategic_legal_policy_organizational_operational_structures_tactical_investment_procedures

Join

http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/

if you want to be 1 of 100,000 people needed to support a Presidential Candidate – myself – at AmericansElect.org in support of the above bank-focused platform.

[-] 1 points by abmebratu (349) from Washington, DC 13 years ago

Of course. No doubt about it. Perhaps more flawed than other economic models. We just don't like to admit it in the good old USA because it is our state religion. Capitalism is beyond sacrosanct in the U.S. I know we like to pride ourselves, falsely, about how we don't have a national cult belief, but the truth is Capitalism is our state religion. Even thinking about Alternative models is unfathomable to many liberals in America. This is how much we have been brainwashed into the cult of sacrosanct capitalism.

[-] 1 points by Dutchess (499) 13 years ago

We do not have Capitalism today...We have Corporatism..

Capitalism is when the markets respond to supply and demand and is backed by sound money and a legal system that protects private property fully.

Corporatism is when corrupt and bought up Govt merges with Big Corp and Banks and provides Corporate Welfare through a fiat money system........like today.

[-] 1 points by kmanpdx (105) 13 years ago

Problem is, Capitalism has no happy medium. It's working perfectly. We need to modify capitalism and find the happy medium. Starting with fair regulations and a level playing field for all is a start

[-] 1 points by kmp11 (8) from Queens, NY 13 years ago

capitalism is the problem. fascism is where the capitalism and the state are married to eachother- super capitalism! yes capitalism is flawed, and i think you knew that before you posted the post. you all need to read marx, then zizek.

[-] 1 points by DanielPawlak (23) 13 years ago

ipad and iphone aren't products of capitalism; computer technology was largely developed by the government, paid for w/ peoples taxes. Once the technology was developed it was handed over to the private sector.

[-] 1 points by ddashred (11) 13 years ago

Every product in America is a product of capitalism.

[-] 1 points by DanielPawlak (23) 13 years ago

Steve Jobs didnt create Ipad and Iphone in his basement, out of 100% ingenuity, the government subsidized the research behind his APPLICATION of the technology. This is State-Captalism, not Laizze faire capitalism

[-] 1 points by chigrl (94) 13 years ago

So you paying over $1000 for a mac book isn't contributing to the expansion of an "evil" corporation and thus perpetuating capitalism? Regardless of where the original technology came from buying from any major corporation is supporting exactly what this protest says it's against.

[-] 1 points by DanielPawlak (23) 13 years ago

that's not true. this protest isn't anti-capitalist. This protest is a call for rule of law; corporate fat cats should be accountable to the laws of the land. The government has no business bailing out the big boys, that's state-capitalism. we want laizze-faire capitalism; you make bad moves the market will discipline you... etc.

[-] 1 points by chigrl (94) 13 years ago

I've seen and read a lot of anti capitalist messages from protesters. If the movement isn't anti capitalist it isn't doing a very good job of showing it.

[-] 1 points by GeoffH (214) from Jacksonville, FL 13 years ago

The message of removing the Capitalist influence from the government is being contorted into an anti-capitalist message. The reality is that the message is that the 1% should not be able to buy laws from our Government. We want a return to our Democratic Republic and cast off the Capitalist Republic we now serve.

[-] 1 points by number2 (914) 13 years ago

capitalism is not the problem. It's fascism

[-] 1 points by Febs (824) from Plymouth Meeting, PA 13 years ago

Capitalism is rooted in the right to property. If you don't like individual rights then you don't like individual rights.

[-] 1 points by ddashred (11) 13 years ago

Capitalism may have many meanings. But let me ask you... What happens with this property that you have rights to?

[-] 1 points by Febs (824) from Plymouth Meeting, PA 13 years ago

What happens to the property is anything I want to happen to it.

[-] 1 points by ddashred (11) 13 years ago

And if you want nothing to happen, is that then capitalism?

[-] 1 points by Febs (824) from Plymouth Meeting, PA 13 years ago

Yes. Very counterproductive for me though. If I can use it to maximize profits I should and if I cannot I should sell it so I can invest in what is maximizing profits.

Rational self interest and all that. Of course it could be part of some risk management strategy or I simply like it (art, comfortable bed) so there are different options.

[-] 0 points by luparb (290) 13 years ago

Yes. It is flawed in it's function.

It does not provide for human needs and interests. It inevitably results in crisis.

The argument against the protesters for wearing labels and using technological is, I'm sorry, rather lacking in poignancy.

We are exposed to advertisements from birth and born into a toxic culture that requires this behavior as part of life.

If people had the time and opportunity to make their own clothes I'm sure they would.

We should make use of what we have, the technology is what facilitated this movement and this very discussion, but we should also recognize the need to reduce materialism and consumption at the same time.

Capitalism implements planned obsolescence, there wouldn't be a need for a new phone every 2 months if their design principles weren't focused on profits. That habit has been installed by capitalism, it's not a factor of human or technological requirement.

[-] 1 points by number2 (914) 13 years ago

let's all fight fascism now. you can fight capitalism later and I'll fight socialism later but i think we can all agree on fascism

[-] 1 points by luparb (290) 13 years ago

Yes I agree.

What's most important is that the democratic process is returned to community, and out of the hands of the corrupted government and corporations.

If fascism was removed, we might end up with lots of little communities that are different but live in peace with each other.

[-] 1 points by ddashred (11) 13 years ago

I'm not saying don't wear the clothes. I'm saying don't spend all you have to get the clothes. Everyone's so arrogant here.

[-] 1 points by luparb (290) 13 years ago

lol.

=(

sorry I didn't mean to offend. you're post is actually quite spot on.

[-] 0 points by boredperson (225) 13 years ago

It might be prudent to point out that OWS is fighting crony capitalism, not capitalism; it's just that quite a few don't seem to know the difference...

[-] 1 points by ddashred (11) 13 years ago

Please tell the difference. Why is everyone so arrogant and educated and holding the information?

Just read the difference between crony capitalism and capitalism. Now the question is why are you NOT protesting the law makers?

[-] 1 points by boredperson (225) 13 years ago

Crony Capitalism involves a close relationship between businesses and the government; Capitalism involves no government intervention whatsoever with such businesses. I think this whole movement is ridiculous. I keep saying it's misguided, and that the blame should be placed on the government.

[-] 1 points by ddashred (11) 13 years ago

Wouldn't we be naive to think that money isn't power? Is there a way to separate?

[-] 1 points by boredperson (225) 13 years ago

Well, the corporations/banks aren't inherently evil in this situation. The real solution would be to ban the government from colluding with whomever. The government is extending the power of the so-called 1% far beyond what it could ever be. How do we return to normalcy? Get rid of the government.