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Forum Post: If you're still shouting "GET A JOB!" at us this far into the movement...

Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 2, 2011, 2:46 a.m. EST by ARod1993 (2420)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

...you need to slow yourself down and realize that that's not as simple as it was before the era of speculation and deregulation. What made a middle-class lifestyle possible for so many people during the 1950s and the 1960s was the wide range of jobs (especially blue-collar manufacturing jobs) that paid a stable middle-class salary. The rush to slash costs via outsourcing meant that said blue-collar manufacturing jobs went straight to China and India. At the same time, the drive by corporations to break unions meant that even those who kept their jobs often did so at greatly reduced salaries, meaning that one income (if you still had it) no longer did the trick. Sending women out into the workforce alleviated the situation to some degree because it doubled the income of a household; however that also effectively doubled the pool of qualified, talented workers that businesses could choose from. This economy would essentially need more jobs in order to keep pace with the expansion of the workforce, but continued outsourcing meant that the opposite was actually happening.

Here's the catch: every time we have one of these recessions our standard of living adjusts downward. During a recession, layoffs mean that you have an incredible surfeit of people who are fully qualified if not overqualified for most positions, but who are so desperate for a job that they'll take 30-40% pay cuts just to hold on. Some businesses will in fact lay off employees they need so that they can get someone else to take the job at half the wage rate or less. This then ratchets up the rat race a notch each time, as the same jobs now require more qualifications, work experience, degrees, etc. and pay less than they did before. Unlike employment rates, however, the new employment standards and pay schedules do not cycle back to pre-recession levels when the economy starts growing again.

That roof-tarring job your father picked up during college to make ends meet? He'd have no chance of getting it today because he's a US citizen and thus a) he has to be paid at least the federal minimum wage and most likely will make more because he's a skilled tradesmen and b) citizens have avenues for seeking redress in cases of worker abuse. Illegals don't. The same goes for most minimum wage jobs out there that he'd have the "qualifications" to get. If you tried to get one of those "zero-education" jobs right now they'd look you in the eye and refuse you for being overqualified; I actually had a friend looking for part-time jobs at clothing stores/fast food joints/etc. in her neighborhood (zero-education jobs all, because she's still only 18) and getting turned down. Why? She went to Bronx Science and only wants to work so she can provide her own spending money and help her parents cover her tuition.

What does this have to do with Wall Street? This last round of utterly asinine speculation and outright securities fraud triggered a really nasty recession, and when it ends employment rates will probably come back up to pre-recession levels, but wages for 90+ percent of the population won't unless we begin changing how large corporations do business. I'd much prefer such change came from an organized, well-funded political movement that demanded re-regulation of Wall Street, campaign finance/lobbying reform, and bona fide attempts to bring jobs back to America than from a protests movement as disorganized as OWS. That said, I've never been one to overlook possible vehicles for opportunity no matter how unlikely they appeared, and just because OWS is scruffy and disorganized doesn't mean they can't be useful.

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5 Comments


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[-] 1 points by armchairecon1 (169) 13 years ago

Re: Globalism..

in the world of globalism/outsourcing, jobs that leave mean that someone else in the world is benefiting. (not saying it doesnt suck to be part of the middle class and see your jobs evaporate and yoru standards of living go down)

from an economic stand point, i for each 1$ that left the US becuse of a job, the decrease in standard of living is much less than the benefit gained by whichever developing country received that 1$. (ie: that 1$ buys alot less in the US than the same 1$ would buy in the new country)..

So the question becomes.. should the world continue to live in poverty and sacrifice their shot at the middle class so that we can have a better standard of living?

[-] 1 points by ARod1993 (2420) 13 years ago

Simply put, Asia, Africa, and Latin America are all capable of developing demand-driven domestic economies should they be provided with the resources to do so, as are we. I have no problem with giving aid to developing nations, funding start-ups through interest-free loans to young entrepreneurs, etc. Quite frankly, I want to see these countries develop industry of their own, but it needs to be focused on providing for its own citizens or started in the true spirit of charity. When multinationals do these things everyone gets exploited; the Chinese factory worker is no farther away from starvation than he was on the farm, and someone else who had a stable middle-class life is now scrambling to survive as part of the working poor.

[-] 1 points by armchairecon1 (169) 13 years ago

The average chinese factory worker is doing VERY well.

i made a post addressing this in another thread: http://occupywallst.org/forum/feeding-homeless-ows-a-test-in-socialism/#comment-255327

Most of those countries do not have the demand or resources to create that economy... outsourcing allows a shortcut for these economies to get there. In the long term, the 'world's milddle class grows' there is increased world wide demand, and for the countries that position themselves correctly (ie: educating their population for creative, high value jobs) will stand to benefit.. ie: see Germany. a country with a high tax burden that is able to maintain its middle class through value added manufacturing of high quality goods

[-] 1 points by ARod1993 (2420) 13 years ago

I want to see us move toward a model of high-quality manufacturing and technology jobs that simply can't be outsourced so that this doesn't have to be a zero-sum game where we can only win at someone else's expense. The problem is that getting there is going to require some temporary protectionism and harsh penalties for outsourcing simply so that we can get real infrastructure back over here. Once we have that we can build a manufacturing sector strong enough that we can drop trade barriers and still hold on. Until then, however, I'm looking out for my American countrymen first.