Forum Post: I Support OWS but.......
Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 14, 2011, 8:15 p.m. EST by JadedGem
(895)
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I have seen some excellent posts for a new way for figuring out a progressive that is affordable. I have learned about pieces of legislation that have directly caused the crisis we find ourselves in. I have seen many intelligent people on the boards coming here to show their support and lend their ideas. I am loosing patience with the camps because no clear agenda has emerged yet. "Were working on it...." makes me feel that they want something that can't garner wide spread public approval. Do we need to tear down the whole government when what we object to is the two party system, laws that make it hard for third parties and Corporate money buying our politicians and the bad legislation that came with it. You show me people willing to represent Republicans, the right to bear arms, and lets states choose whether polygamy or gay marriage is legal based on votes put to the people in each state. If you want to tear down something, you better replace it with something that can cover all the issues Democrats have and Republicans have and bring them together or at least have their say. And on to major problem, the system that leaves small businesses paying and paying while WellsFargo gets money back from our government is something you all have to agree needs changing, am I right???? Stop trolling and start helping to build something better for 99% of us.
http://occupythiswiki.org/wiki/Issues_%2B_Political_Platform_Items
i agree, heres the place to put that and have that conversation and organize it.
(and my happly little shpliel for the day)
Agreed. so. now what. The least useful aspect of the whole thing is that its non violent. this does not help the agenda at all.
Its also orders of magnitude larger and bigger than it was supposed to be and growing at an exponential rate.
What perhaps you may fail to understand at first is that there has been a dam. Holding back. The waters of the light of truth. Crack. Snapple. Pop. 200 years of lies. 200 years of propaganda. 200 years of science creeping on while the elites tried to freeze the knowledge of the proles in 1800. 200 years of sociology knowledge. 200 years of education reform science. 200 years of oil and coal while all the whole while we could have had geothermal.
Crack. snapple. Crack. Crickkettyy pop. snapple Crack.
How long could the lies hold up? how long could they keep the proles ignorant and wholly self destructive?
How long could they prevent a genuine consensus process?
Corporate Oligarchy is a Dead Horse walking. It looks alive, but it actually died in 2000 with the Election of Bush. Assorted fatal systemic errors are killing it, and without a vital solution for a new and dynamic evolutionary revolution, all of humanity, including the elites, would die.
they need this revolution just as much as the rest of us.
And there is nothing they can do now to stop it, their only power is to try to censor it, control it, co-opt it, and fail, until we elect them out of office and then take back our government.
"Beasts of burden"? lol. Yes, the Collosophant. Carrying civilization forward on our shoulders while they the mere parasites lives off and on us.
It was a handy arrangement for them, but we could have crushed them at any time at our whim, and they have failed to realize this. The police in Oakland are realizing this. 50 mounted horses are just riot targets. Beat enough people up in front of a crowd of ten thousand, and it could just get a lot uglier than any fight they want to pick. WE THE PEOPLE are WAKING UP. And we are mad as hell, and we are not going to take it any more.
Snap. crack. krick. pop. 200 years of evil control. 200 years of dumble down. stretching. Creaking. splintering. When it breaks there will be no safe place for any oligarch to hide. their trillions of dollars will not buy them the elections any more and their lies will be known to the public and they will live in shame, and most of them will end up in federal prison.
When the bough breaks, the cradle will rock...
humpty dumpty...
a thousand metaphors and narratives. I'm glib today, actually, and reminded of this song, in 1776.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w1213z9KHNs
Violence is a way to loose the support of the people. Period. Move your money was a success, don't let anyone tell you different. Boycotts are effective. Come up with more things your average ticked off voter can do right from the comfort of their home. Invite people at home to take part in nonviolent actions. Keep the focus on getting the money out of politics, reform, something better than the two party system but still government we can recognize and support. Serve the 99% something they can all move in and get behind.
perhaps i wasn't clear with my initial point of quoting this. somebody said that occupy movement was all "useful idiots " dupes. in that it was astroturfed to start and paid for by one percenters thats true. But its not at all "useful" as what it has become. i agree non violence is the solution. Non violence is what checkmates their game.
For decades now the corporations and special interests have had our "representatives" bought and paid for. We need to get the money out of our politics. Until we end the current system of legalized bribery (campaign donations) and paid lobbying our politicians will continue to be the lap dogs of the corporations and special interests. What we need first and foremost is real, loop-hole free CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM!!!! If the corruption is not dealt with first, the chance of any other meaningful reforms becoming a reality is almost zero - the special interests will just use their money to buy votes and put forward bills that create loop-holes or otherwise twist the law in their favor. If we want our children to live in a country where there vote matters, we need to get the money out of our politics, otherwise they will increasingly become the 21st century version of the "landless peasant." Spread the word - CAMPAIGN FINANCE REFORM needs to be THE main goal of the protests.
Yes! This is the issue, money controlling our government to the point its bad for 99% of us. I just feel like we automatically think in terms of the two party system and get lost in issues that detract from the main points that speak to so many people. We need to get back to the basic message. And we need to assure people OWS wouldn't support a form of government that didn't make room for people to vote their conscious, even republican trolls if they are part of this country would be represented and have a voice.
I find it very interesting that at the office where I work many of my coworkers say disparaging things about the protest (not hard to believe because they all use Fox to get their "News" - something I used to do until I realized there was no real journalism going on, just propaganda and spin). They would say something negative and then with their next breath (literally) they would say how they wished their son or daughter could get a job and move out of their basement. They don't seem to make the connection. When I explain campaign finance reform they all agree that it needs to happen and they all say they don't like having the country run by politicians bribed by corporations. I think the majority of Americans already agree that we need to get the money out of politics - the rest want it to stay the same because they are benefiting from the status-quo. Spread the word - if this became the main talking point of the protests the government would have to act.
That's just it. OWS needs to focus on the money in politics. Riders attached to legislation that stops the whole process and good legislation can't get passed. Bad legislation that needs to be removed. Subsidies for the rich. The vast majority of Republicans are being forced to accept legislation that favors the few in order to get a vote on issues that are nearer and dearer to them. OWS needs to get to the meat of the problem, big money in politics. They need to understand, we don't want a new government, we just want one that serves more than half of us half of the time on a great day.
I agree! I think that a very good place to start is by starting a campaign to get voters in the next election to vote out the incumbents. I don't care what party wins as long as it isn't the people currently in office. The best way to wake up the politicians is to remind them that we have power over them! This is something that I truely believe would work and we have the means to do it!
YES! Actions the people at home can do!!! Would it be so hard for OWS to come up with a short list of things people can do? They are closing the camps and I'm not even sad about it. I am ready for things like Move Your Money that everyone can get behind. If the Occupation couldn't come up with something concrete after all the GAs etc in this amount of time, what would more time do? To appeal to the Masses, you have to understand who they are and accept them. You can't mean portopotties were hauled in, people were fed and nobody has a plan, legislation they want passed, anything? I am supportive of getting the money out of politics, getting rid of tax laws that favor the rich and subsidies for the rich, getting rid of NAFTA and things that have driven jobs out of the country. However, I am forced to ask myself, is OWS on the same page? You can't become everyone's everything by simply not telling people ANYTHING.
Extreme campaign finance reform. Make the government need to rely on the people instead of their financiers. Then they have to work for us.
That is step 1.
Third parties need on the ballot and the crap laws that keep them off need to be taken down too.
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