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Forum Post: I am the CEO of a company thats been in business almost 15 years and here's what I tell my business buddies when they criticize or make fun of the movement

Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 19, 2011, 9:48 a.m. EST by therising (6643)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Most involved in Occupy Wall Street are not advocating getting rid of the profit motive / free enterprise.  What we do realize is that capitalism can't be unfettered.  It needs guardrails.  If you asked the son or daughter of a former slave in America whether their father or mother thought the free market can do no wrong, I'd venture a guess they'd say no.  Being on the auction block has a way of bringing things into focus.  If you asked the average citizen if they thought it was fine that their area has some of the worst air quality in the nation and fine that his or her young son was suffering from breathing disorders as a result, I think he or she would say no.  He or she would most likely want to see some common sense guidelines that regulate air quality.

Here's the problem:  us business assholes (as George Carlin referred to us) can be real single minded pricks.  Some of us would sell our own sisters if it would make us a buck.  And the results of our prickishness don't just hurt us (like a high speed driver on a Montana road only hurts himself).  They also hurts others.  Often these collateral damages hurt them a lot.

That's where regulation comes in.  We need that. Don't let us business assholes run free.

This is not to say we can't do some good and get the country jamming.  We can.  You just need to check our baser instincts.  We like to privatize profits but nationalize the expenses, externalities and the debt. But only if you let us. And trust me, we'll take it if you'll give it to us but the nation doesn't depend on us getting all sorts of breaks the way some of us claim. We can make money in all sorts of ways and the public extras are really just gravy we can do without if need be.  

We business assholes (again, George Carlin's term for the likes of me) like to use public roads, we cry about needing good public education for our future workers and then we help politicians who defund public roads and schools.  We're just wired that way.  We're pricks.  

You know how dogs aren't supposed to soil their own crate when they're puppies.  Well, us business assholes are the one mammal that will soil his own crate.  We'll fondle that $20 bill in our hand as we lay in our own excrement and think with a smile how great and mighty we are.

The head of Interface Carpet (one of the largest carpet manufacturers in the world), Ray Anderson has woken up to this and you'll hear him quoted often saying to business colleagues at conferences: 'They're going to put people like us in jail soon if we continue to behave this way." He's aiming for zero carbon footprint for his firm. Here he is speaking at TED conference http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP9QF_lBOyA&feature=youtube_gdata_player

He's right by the way. They are going to start putting business assholes in jail soon if they harm the environment and other citizens in their pursuit of more profits.  That's not a matter of opinion.  It's just a practical matter that those who are business assholes should factor into the equation when they decide to do things like bet against their own clients (Goldman Sachs) etc.

All that said, I like the profit motive, know it has huge upside (no need to convinxe me of that) and know that 99% of business people won't ever cross these bad lines. I know profits can be made without doing harm.  The problem is that 1% of businessmen can ruin the nation for the rest of us. They can also ruin the environment and really screw up world economies.

The widely acclaimed award winning documentary "Inside Job" (impeccably researched) lays out exactly what happened with this financial crisis.  And it was a bunch of business assholes that did it dude.  You can deny it all you want.  But that's how it went down.  Watch the documentary.  It's a mainstream title available on Netflix or Amazon.  I am being very honest here.  It will completely change your perspective on government regulation.  These guys in the smoke filled rooms are laughing their asses off man.   It was very nearly a heist.  The guys at the top knew they were crashing our system but knew two other things:

A) They could make money on it.

B) They could get the 99% to think it was the fault of consumers.

107 Comments

107 Comments


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[-] 5 points by antipolitics (127) 13 years ago

Greed is Blinding

100% agree with you, the Public needs Business Regulations. If people just can't do whatever we want (rape, steal, murder) then Businesses (they are people too right?) just can't do whatever they freakin want neithers...

I gotta watch that movie...

Nice post.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

You gotta watch that movie!

[-] 1 points by sewen (154) 13 years ago

http://www.just-gov.com about 3/4 way down the page.

[-] 5 points by synonymous (161) from New York, NY 13 years ago

Agreed! But how do we find a balance when the truth is, those with a budget delegate the administration of reality? The average citizen has no budget to influence decisions in their favor...

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

It is not always the case that those with a big big budget administrate reality. King, Gandhi and their supporters administrated reality and we can too. Here's a few links that relate to this:

Power responds to power. Don't get caught up in the demands or the timing of the tactics. Just take a close look at the tactics and take a peak at the introduction OUR TURN. http://occupywallst.org/forum/proposed-list-of-demands-please-help-editadd-so-th/

Please see this post that gives a bit of info on the upcoming NATIONAL CONVENTION and learn about what will happen if demands aren't met. http://readersupportednews.org/news-section2/316-20/7903-occupy-wall-streets-plans-for-a-national-convention

[-] 1 points by synonymous (161) from New York, NY 13 years ago

Good point, for the moments of change...but historically the oppressed rise up , overcome and then become the oppressor...i.e. the french revolution...

opensource transparency has to be built to last!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Oh, I am totally with you on that. This is so important. How do you think we prevent things from going that direction where those that take power end up corrupted?

[-] 1 points by toyotabedzrock (11) from Bordentown, NJ 13 years ago

We need to socialize the loss and hardship they create for the public so that they pay for it as a collective.

Yes I know it sounds mean, but it is a feed back situation that promotes full employment.

We need a welfare tax that auto adjusts to the current need of the program, meaning it is entirely dependent on the actions of businesses. So if they want lower taxes they only need to hire more people.

And since no one is totally cut off from the consumer economy demand never entirely evaporates.

We obviously need to accept that we need to employ the appropriate number of people to ensure there is not rampant abuse of the system.

[-] 3 points by pissedoffconstructionworker (602) 13 years ago

Right on, CEO Guy.

OWS is about saving capitalism for you entrepreneurs and free-enterprise types.

We the 99 appreciate your drive and innovations, but we know that you can be short-sighted and need to be reigned in from time to time.

[-] 2 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Oh that's definitely true. We need guardrails. PS - Don't want anyone to misunderstand what I'm trying to say here. The movement is about way more than saving capitalism. This movement is about pulling the vampire squid off our society, the vampire squid of greed that Matt Taibbi describes so well. That greed leads to suffering. That greed leads to division. My CEO friends think their house in Greenwich and place in the Hamptons and all that Robb Report jazz leads to a fulfilling life. I'm here to tell you pal. I know from experience. It doesn't. What leads to a fulfilling life is living in community with other people, not in some gated community.

[-] 2 points by pissedoffconstructionworker (602) 13 years ago

Our points are in agreement.

Greed leads to suffering and suffering leads to political conditions which are not at all in the interest of business owners and entrepreneurs.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Right on. I love this fixing consensus thing. The 99% are getting in the good habit of finding what's in common. This is how we're going to change this country. By making decisions from a position of unified strength rather than demands from a position of divided weakness.

[-] 2 points by Quark (236) 13 years ago

I like you and agree.

[-] 2 points by michaelbravo (222) 13 years ago

your a good man

[-] 2 points by Socrates469bc (608) from New York, NY 13 years ago

Supreme Court of the USA: Corporations have free speech rights Mitt Romney: Corporations are Human Big Business: Regulations are bad for the economy.

Humans are subject to the death penalty. Death penalty is not a business regulation. (In fact the Death Penalty is good for business, it puts lots of lawyers to work.)

Conclusion: Death penalty for CEO's and Board of Directors who commit crimes against Society.

[-] 1 points by GardenerJroge (3) 13 years ago

Good point, but we should not put the CEOs and Directors to death. The problem is that corporations have been declared "legal persons", but they are not made to follow the same laws as the other legal persons -us- instead they are governed by a whole set of separate laws.

So let's make it fair. If corporations are legal persons then they need to follow exactly the same laws as the rest of us. If not then we have to find a way to take legal personhood away from corporations.

Kind of simplistic I know. Maybe some of you out there with extra grey matter can continue this train of thought.

[-] 1 points by Socrates469bc (608) from New York, NY 13 years ago

Yes, I agree. They have many more tax deductions and ordinary citizens for starters. Don't we all just wish we could expense that new refrigerator or washing machine? These home based assets are used to increase our productivity.

[-] 1 points by zahid (7) 13 years ago

rails to regulate bad business is a nice concept. I really mean that. Holding business men accountable is already a current social responsibility. My question is concerning consequences, granted there are natural consequences that incline the rational human to struggle against their own greed first so as to be effective in regulating others. Without that kind of mentality guidelines, accountability and even "apparent" ethics are little more than rhetoric about one thing you're ready to believe while I go make a lot more money. never the less your comment implies that you and "the good businessmen " are already taking steps to hold yourselves accountable, the truth is this isn't an easy practice. My question is, if we take a step out side of the house of mirrors of the "big" business mind set and see what people are really doing to themselves and others, what kind of consequence do you impose on bad businessmen that speaks to their sensibilities in such a way that they realize bad business isn't worth the risk?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Hit em in the wallet. Big time. Make their shareholders cry out at their CEO for recklessly squandering resources on huge fines. The current fines are a joke.

Also jail time for corporate crooks who break law. Need strong sec for that. Then you'll see some bad behavior change to good. Lock em up. Lots of em. But only if they clearly and willfully broke the law.

[-] 1 points by zahid (7) 13 years ago

Hit them in the wallet indeed. That is where it hurts. Let them see we aren't getting poor so they can see themselves getting rich.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

That vote with the wallet is one of the most powerful weapons we have.

[-] 1 points by hotdoghenry (268) 13 years ago

A reverse troll ! ROFL You don't own shit! You don't run or have a business you fucking liar!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Sorry pal. You're wrong. I founded a successful firm that's been in business almost 15 years. I really enjoy business but I'm bothered by the bad apples that are spoiling it for everyone.

[-] 1 points by hotdoghenry (268) 13 years ago

Really now? So where is this business and what is it called?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Ha! You'd like that wouldn't you :)

[-] 1 points by hotdoghenry (268) 13 years ago

Your full of shit!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

It's your lie. Tell it however you want. :)

[-] 1 points by dicksmack (2) 13 years ago

What the hell is it going to take for people to take responsibility for their own dysfunctional spending habits. Is it the bankers fault that you overpaid for a home? If you have 10 bucks in your wallet, do you go to the grocery and place 20 dollars worth of food in your basket? Shit no. Then why the hell do you earn 50,000 and buy a 500,000 home. Thats the banks fault - no jerks, it your fault. Wake up, take responsibility, learn from your ignorance. Tired of listening to plate lickers make demands on those who are responsible, ethical, honest, hard working and dedicated. Own your shit! own it god dam it

[-] 1 points by dicksmack (2) 13 years ago

What the hell is it going to take for people to take responsibility for their own dysfunctional spending habits. Is it the bankers fault that you overpaid for a home? If you have 10 bucks in your wallet, do you go to the grocery and place 20 dollars worth of food in your basket? Shit no. Then why the hell do you earn 50,000 and buy a 500,000 home. Thats the banks fault - no jerks, it your fault. Wake up, take responsibility, learn from your ignorance. Tired of listening to plate lickers make demands on those who are responsible, ethical, honest, hard working and dedicated. Own your shit! own it god dam it

[-] 1 points by Nicolas (258) from Québec, QC 13 years ago

Glad to have you aboard. I'm not sure when the notion that you could still make a profit by, well, doing a good job, got lost in the public discourse, but we really need it back. Along with a government with a spine and some foresight.

It's really nice to have people from your "side" recognize the problems. Helps the movement remain centered on the issues and not devolve into group vs group.

We shall look with clemency on you once we do start jailing businessmen, citizen.

I kid, I kid. Your buddies better clean their act, though. ;p

[-] 1 points by GeorgeMichaelBluth (402) from Arlington, VA 13 years ago

This is just a corporate ad

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Not sure why you would say that? This is an honest post. Are you capable of an honest post?

[-] 1 points by dingalingy (54) 13 years ago

thanks, dude, send us a pizza

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Pizza and more generators?

[-] 1 points by dingalingy (54) 13 years ago

in SF they have a bicycle generator

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

That's slick!!! Are you in the park right now? If so.....what's the vibe? Last time I was there it was super peaceful and joyful. How's everyone's spirits after all this rain?

[-] 1 points by dingalingy (54) 13 years ago

no i am at home, , sf was great, tour busses full of people waving and cheering us -- beautiful, no rain

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Awesome. It had to be amazing to be there. The comraderie.

[-] 1 points by atki4564 (1259) from Lake Placid, FL 13 years ago

Well said, so perhaps you won't mind if we start the war against Injustice by starting our own banks to double the income of the Bottom 99% of Workers, for many more people will come to your side when you are proactive (for “new” Business & Government solutions), instead of reactive (against “old” Business & Government solutions), which is why what we most immediately need is a comprehensive “new” strategy that implements all our various socioeconomic demands at the same time, regardless of party, and although I'm all in favor of taking down today's ineffective and inefficient Top 1% Management System of Business & Government, there's only one way to do it – by fighting bankers as bankers ourselves, and thus doubling our income from Bank Profits which are 40% of all Corporate Profits; that is, using a Focused Direct Democracy organized according to our current Occupations & Generations. Consequently, I have posted a 1-page Summary of the Strategically Weighted Policies, Organizational Operating Structures, and Tactical Investment Procedures necessary to do this at:

http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategically_weighted_policies_organizational_operating_structures_tactical_investment_procedures-448eo

Join http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/ because we need 100,000 “support clicks” at AmericansElect.org in support of the above bank-focused platform.

Most importantly, remember, as cited in the first link, that as Bank Owner-Voters in your 1 of 48 "new" Business Investment Groups (or "new" Congressional Committees) you become the "new" Online Congress, and related “new” Businesses, REPLACING the "old" Congress, and related “old” Businesses, according to your current Occupations & Generations, called a Focused Direct Democracy.

Therefore, any Candidate (or Leader) therein, regardless of party, is a straw man, a puppet, a political opportunist, just like today; what's important is the STRATEGY – the sequence of steps – that the people organize themselves under in Military Internet Formation of their Individual Purchasing Power & Group Investment Power. In this, sequence is key, and if the correct mathematical sequence is followed then it results in doubling the income of the Bottom 99% of Workers from today's Bank Profits, which are 40% of all Corporate Profits.

Why? Because there are Natural Social Laws – in mathematical sequence – that are just like Natural Physical Laws, such as the Law of Gravity. You must follow those Natural Social Laws or the result will be Injustice, War, etc.

The FIRST step in Natural Social Law is to CONTROL the Banks as Bank Owner-Voters. If you do not, you will inevitably be UNJUSTLY EXPLOITED by the Top 1% Management System of Business & Government who have a Legitimate Profit Motive, just like you, to do so.

Consequently, you have no choice but to become Candidates (or Leaders) yourselves as Bank Owner-Voters according to your current Occupations & Generations.

So JOIN the 2nd link, and spread the word, so we can make 100,000 support clicks at AmericansElect.org when called for, at exactly the right time, by an e-mail from that group, in support of the above the bank-focused platform. If so, then you will see and feel how your goals can be accomplished within the above strategy as a “new” Candidate (or Leader) of your current Occupation & Generation.

[-] 1 points by cloe (34) 13 years ago

I doubt it.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Doubt what?

[-] 1 points by upandatem (16) 13 years ago

Yeah, well, hope you feel better now. Guess what? I don't feel sorry for you or your business buddies.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Hey - Never asked you to feel sorry for any of us. I hope you realize I'm cheering you on man. Hem in the greedy business men. Put up the guardrails. We need it. I'm just being honest.

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 13 years ago

Greed destroys. If there were more people like you, more people with a moral compass, we would not have many of the problems. we have today. Big business needs a healthy dose of responsibility and ethics. That "dose" will need to be forced down the throats of the greedy in the form of STRICT regulations. Because sadly, much of our corporate society lacks the moral compass to eschew greed. Some even embrace it. Their personal failure of morality has come at great expense to the whole of society.

The business assholes, as you call them, seem to have zero fear of retribution. Our corrupted government choose to protect them rather than punish them. Our corrupted government would rather the whole of society suffer and deteriorate, rather than bring justice to the 1%.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Justice is coming. Non-violently. It's coming. The people united can never be defeated is a true statement. These guys are terrified of non-violent direct action. They don't know what to do with it. I think they're also terrified of a national general assembly. They are beginning to realize the jig is up.

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 13 years ago

Where do we go from here? I'm hitting a wall.
There seems to be alot of consensus for fair and equal representation/campaign reform. But, I know this is not PC, how do we move beyond the loons? To take this to the next level.
I'm beginning to think that maybe it is getting to the time to go more public/official with this demand. Your thoughts?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Hi April - I'm with you and feel the same sense of urgency. Here are my thoughts, for what they're worth (at link below). You were reading my mind because I was typing that post as you were probably tying yours. Obviously this feeling is beginning to spread. Please let me know what you think of this....:

http://occupywallst.org/forum/one-scenario-for-how-the-movement-might-successful/#comment-165363

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 13 years ago

This makes sense, but I would switch the order. 1 - go public and official with campaign finance reform, to gain support. We might lose some, but we will gain more. Reserve the right to add more demands later.
2 - Direct Congressional action - demand that Congress enact the legislation 3 - If that does not work, push forward with electing delegates to unseat those in Congress who vote no.

There already is support in Congress for this. I'm not sure if it has all the right details, but its a start.

http://fairelectionsnow.org/about-bill Would this work?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

I think what you're saying makes good sense April. It would have the added benefit of underscoring WHY we're running our own candidates and would give them a popular platform to run on if it comes to that. I would certainly consider a run if we get to that point.

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 13 years ago

I added a link above to my previous post. Not sure if you got it because I think I was editing when I got your reply.

http://fairelectionsnow.org/about-bill

I have to believe that these Congress people would be with us!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

This sounds perfect. And it would be a real joy to see the corrupt ones trying to explain why they're not for it. We should push for this with massive direct action .... 100,000, 400,000 people marching on Capitol Hill, blocking entrances if the bill isn't passed by our deadline.

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 13 years ago

Baby step 1 - going public and official with Campaign Finance Reform. This has the added benefit of reducing the diversions. The Socialists and marijuana folks have had their freedom of expression. They are scareing away the next level of supporters. Every time I refresh the forum screen I see something about Socialism. I think the only way to get beyond this is to go public and official.

How do we get the GA to move in this direction? Innundate the forum? Anything else?

I've also thought about a direct action write in campaign for the Fair Elections legislation. Not sure if this is the right time to push something like this though.

I would rather go the GA route, but pushing for write ins on the legislation might get some attention in Congress at least. I think we have their attention, but they don't quite get it yet.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

I think GA route is the ticket. That's how this gets big and the change is real and lasting. Gotta speak at the GA's.

[-] 1 points by April (3196) 13 years ago

Unfortunately, I'm about a thousand miles away from that. I'll just keep innundating the forum!
Have you been to the GA's? Is there a way to get a motion on the agenda or something?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Unfortunately not from afar. But don't let that make you frustrated. You can make a real difference, a serious difference by a) posting your heartfelt thoughts and ideas to this forum and b) participating in your own general assembly in your own town. NY Gen Assembly is only one general assembly of many. And, if all goes well, there will be 2 representatives to national assembly from each congressional district, one man and one woman.

But that's the process stuff. There's also the fun stuff, the marches, the Yes Men type stunts, the provocative non-violent action that can be done anywhere. You can help inspire these or lead them yourself. There's nothing so satisfying as seeing a well laid plan come to fruition. I'd like to see the movement do one protest / sit in / direct action a week until national general assembly in July to keep the energy level up. Lots of folks like me are going to get very impatient just sitting around. We want action.

We can have our cake and eat it too :)

[-] 1 points by MyHeartSpits (448) 13 years ago

Great reading, thanks! And thank you for speaking out.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Thanks for taking the time to read and spread the word.

[-] 1 points by AmericanRedWhiteBlue (126) 13 years ago

Enlightening Post!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Please spread the word. I'm tired of my fellow CEO's just making shit up to give them excuses to pollute the very world their sons and daughters, our sons and daughters will grow up in. I'm tired of them justifying their bad behavior that has tanked this economy. Some of the bad apples, some really powerful ones, crashed our economy. They knew what they were doing but they went through with it because they were making huge sums of money and knew they could make even more bettin against their own customers as the collapse occurred. The film Inside Job narrated by Matt Damon expertly chronicles how it happened. Watch it. And then rise up and hold these creeps accountable. They give business a bad name. And there are a lot of very very good business people.

[-] 1 points by AmericanRedWhiteBlue (126) 13 years ago

Will Do!!!

[-] 1 points by bethlany88 (134) from Vancouver, WA 13 years ago

honesty....refreshing!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

I'm tired of my CEO friends lying. Frankly, it's not just wrong and destructive. It's also boring.

[-] 1 points by ltjaxson (184) 13 years ago

First move is to re-implement Provision Q of Glass-Steagal that seperates commercial banking (main street banks) form investment banking (wall street banks). The rest is woth nothing until this is the law of the land...again!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

I am very excited about that one too. So important.

[-] 1 points by thenextsteps (21) 13 years ago

cheers!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Cheers to you too. Now I'm going out for beer :)

[-] 1 points by Dost (315) 13 years ago

Toss in the Enron Scandal and the Savings & Loan scandal as well as many others. The Plutocracy rules this country pure and simple. Like your honesty but it is far more than 1% who are ripping and raping the country. As Carlin says so well, the system is rigged. The rich own nearly everything and they want it all. And with Rightwing Talk Radio and the Republicans, they will surely get it. Rioting and rebellion are in the offing if not soon then in the future. Things are really going to deteriorate. It speaks volumes that a person like you can admit to being an asshole. This is becoming more commonplace now as I have seen or heard other capitalists admit to their rapacious practices. Two classic examples of many: Telecommunications companies lying cheating and stealing just like the Credit, Insurance, Pharmaceutical, Banks, etc. It is massively more persuasive then you are presenting it here. The politicians are mostly crooks or just dont' give a shit (they are good at pretending they are or convince themselves that they are doing a little but too involved in raising money, writing books, speaking for cash, and using their dildos.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

OK let's do something about. George Carlin would love it if we did.

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 13 years ago

Bernanke must go!

But ...

We can achieve that from Liberty Park, so we should stay here.

Woo Hoo

[-] 1 points by eidos (285) 13 years ago

Thanks, I think. : )

[-] 1 points by Windsofchange (1044) 13 years ago

Yes, I agree with you. Absolutely, there needs to be regulation. I am glad to hear from someone from your walk in life.

If you have time, could you see my thread posted on discrimination of the unemployed. It was posted less than an hour ago. I would love to hear from someone with your background on this subject matter. Thank you for what you posted here. You are a very honest, open-minded individual. We need more people like you out there in the business world.

[-] 1 points by jobs (26) 13 years ago

Get republicans to vote yes on jobs bill - by any means necessary - POWER TO THE PEOPLE!

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

That's a greeat start. Much more to come.

[-] 1 points by booshington (397) 13 years ago

Excellent post.

Check out http://www.themultitude.org/forum/index.php

You're thoughts would be appreciated there.

[-] 1 points by jimrwashington (9) from Montgomery, NJ 13 years ago

Completely agree with your basic assertions. Why then have things gone so terrible wrong recently. I assert it is because the election process has become so perverse that our government has lost focus on the peoples business while it spends it efforts on getting enough money to be re-elected. When the 1%ers and business provide the relection money, how can they also regulate the greedy assholes (as Brother George put it). We need term limits, campaign finance reform and a way to the people to put issues on the balot such as a national refrendum.

[-] 1 points by jimrwashington (9) from Montgomery, NJ 13 years ago

Completely agree with your basic assertions. Why then have things gone so terrible wrong recently. I assert it is because the election process has become so perverse that our government has lost focus on the peoples business while it spends it efforts on getting enough money to be re-elected. When the 1%ers and business provide the relection money, how can they also regulate the greedy assholes (as Brother George put it). We need term limits, campaign finance reform and a way to the people to put issues on the balot such as a national refrendum.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Agree with you but would just point out that it's not that things are going bad just recently. This building has been falling for a long time. Take a 3 minute break and watch this clip on YouTube for some refreshing perspective that will solidify your resolve to push as hard as you can alongside others to make a real and lasting change this time. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvVAPsn3Fpk&feature=youtube_gdata_player

[-] 1 points by bwturner1951 (34) 13 years ago

Regardless of whether your post is serious or tongue-in-cheek (I pray the former), you bring up some very valid points.

In addition to the movie 'Inside Job', which will leave you more pissed off than you've been in a long time, I suggest watching 'Why we Fight', a documentary that starts with Eisenhower's departure speech and shows how the convergence of business and war over the last 50 years has fulfilled his prophecy.

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

My post was honest. Not tongue in cheek. You don't need to hope. It's just a fact. And I completely agree on "Why We Fight". One of the best documentaries of all time. Eisenhower saw what was coming and was a very brave man for warning the American public in his fairwell address. Indie Job as you indicate is phenomenal. The other great documentary is "the Corporation". This documentary does a fantastic job of showing that, if a corporation is considered a person, many are psychopaths. psych

[-] 1 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 13 years ago

What do you think of the Glass Steagall act being removed? Did that legalize what they did?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

Yes. We need CONGRESS to PASS HR 1489 ("RETURN TO PRUDENT BANKING ACT" http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bill.xpd?bill=h112-1489 ). THIS REINSTATES MANY PROVISIONS OF THE GLASS-STEAGALL ACT. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass–Steagall_Act --- Wiki entry summary: The repeal of provisions of the Glass–Steagall Act of 1933 by the Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act in 1999 effectively removed the separation that previously existed between investment banking which issued securities and commercial banks which accepted deposits. The deregulation also removed conflict of interest prohibitions between investment bankers serving as officers of commercial banks. Most economists believe this repeal directly contributed to the severity of the Financial crisis of 2007–2011 by allowing Wall Street investment banking firms to gamble with their depositors' money that was held in commercial banks owned or created by the investment firms. Here's detail on repeal in 1999 and how it happened: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glass–Steagall_Act#Repeal .

[-] 1 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 13 years ago

nods, thank you for the links. What they did was legal only because a captured-congress paved the way for them in exchange for 'campaign contributions'. wink wink

Here are some bills I've been looking at

H.R. 2768 (Cancelation of Public Debt to Federal Reserve)

H.R. 1496 (Federal Reserve Transparancy Act)

H.R. 1095 (Freedom to Bank Act)

H.R. 1094 (Federal Reserve Board Abolition Act)

H.R. 459 (Federal Reserve Transparancy)

S 202 (Senate Federal Reserve Transpanancy Act)

H.R. 1098 (Free Competition in Currency Act)

I'm just learning!

[-] 1 points by frankchurch1 (839) from Jersey City, NJ 13 years ago

Right, the mindset is a huge point of this. I can compare this to Dick Cheney. I'm sure he may even love his own Grandchildren, but the same guy has no problem killing around a million Iraqi's, mostly in cold blood.

Corporations are the same. The CEOS might be great drinking buddies, but they still support a system where profit comes before basic moral principles. Our foreign policy is the same.

[-] 1 points by toyotabedzrock (11) from Bordentown, NJ 13 years ago

Your no business asshole.

[-] 2 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

What makes you say that? I don't understand why you think a rational business person wouldn't want his or her local and national economy and community to be healthy. Why would we not care about our future customers and our children and grandchildren?

[-] 1 points by derek (302) 13 years ago

On alternatives to material motivation in an information age society: "RSA Animate - Drive: The surprising truth about what motivates us " http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u6XAPnuFjJc "This lively RSAnimate, adapted from Dan Pink's talk at the RSA, illustrates the hidden truths behind what really motivates us at home and in the workplace."

That said, I agree with most of what you say; all markets are social constructions, in part for the reasons you mention and also this one: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Externality

William C. Norris said business exists to serve society's unmet needs.

"Willam Norris sow this coming: In business, greed isn't always good" http://www.minnpost.com/alberteisele/entry_detail_albert_eisele/?blog_post_id=9538

Evidently more people agree with that sentiment now: "Greenspan Destroys Deregulation in 16 Seconds " http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bAH-o7oEiyY

[-] 0 points by kazoo55 (195) from Rijs, FR 13 years ago

Where does this leave someone like Ron Paul with his pleas for deregulation?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 13 years ago

I'd say that it leaves Ron Paul paddling in the wrong direction with an every man for himself philosophy.

[-] 0 points by TedRall (52) from New York, NY 13 years ago

Unfortunately, attempts to regulate gangster capitalism ultimately fail. Wealth and power naturally tend to aggregate. It's like the Monopoly board game: whoever gets an early head start tends to win the game. In life, whoever inherits wealth (i.e., gets an early head start) begins with capital he can use to seed new businesses and try out ideas, and attend college without fear of indebtedness.

If we are serious about addressing the sins of capitalism, we need to recognize that the system itself--based on the assumption that one person is intrinsically worth more than you simply because of accidents of birthright, skin color, etc.--is indecent and should be abolished.

We need to rebuild society and the economy from the ground up, not tinker and tweak and edit.

[-] 0 points by monahan (272) 13 years ago

Listen I live in poverty these people are dangerous

[-] 1 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 13 years ago

Just expose cases of Fraud, Theft, and Insider Trading OWS. Everything else will fall into place. Find The Fraud! Find the offenses and expose them in chants.

Just Find The Criminality, and we will have done very well.

[-] 1 points by monahan (272) 13 years ago

They threatened to mace me today

[-] 1 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 13 years ago

I'm glad that didn't happen

[-] 1 points by monahan (272) 13 years ago

It was for speaking out against the unions in the movement

[-] 1 points by MonetizingDiscontent (1257) 13 years ago

Well you have the right to do so, just be civil and stay away from mace canisters. ;)

[-] 1 points by monahan (272) 13 years ago

Lol tyou