Forum Post: Have you read this?
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 18, 2011, 9:40 p.m. EST by Wafts
(53)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
I think part of the issue with fixing existing and emerging problems in our country is that we the public, and also our politicians, have gotten to a point where we seem to be unable to have an honest discussion about the issues. Someone opens their mouth and expresses a thought or idea, and next thing you know, it's spun this way and that way and we all get sidetracked by what everyone is saying about what that person said, instead of thinking about what that person actually did say, asking why, discussing disagreements, compromising, and finding answers. Instead, both sides retreat to their bunkers and sling insults at the other side without any effort to truly understand how answers based on give a little, get a little, can be achieved.
Everyone should read Juan William's new book "Muzzled" and then go listen again to all of those commentators and politicians and the outlandish things both sides are saying about each other, and even those in their own party. It's disgusting really. If no one ever bothers to truly listen to and understand one another, how can a decision ever be reached that doesn't leave and entire half feeling like a victim?
I watch many networks both left and right leaning, I have been reading this forum as well as the 53's, and I subscribe to magazines and periodicals from both angles... Neither side is immune; both engage in as much spin and polarization as the other.
If we want to make a future for this country, at some point we are going to have to stop the name calling, stop the labeling and actually listen to understand, not just listen to form our rebuttal.
new occupy video HOPE Humans On Planet Earth chilled..http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4QrDLwSgg24
Jacque Fresco: US has never been a democracy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qlgzTlAvOo
There's obviously no leadership or common ground. Elect me, Eggsie, in 2012 and I will be your voice and your forum. I'm on week 79 of 99 of UE as a former VP in the construction industry. I have no agenda but yours.
Agreed, let's "stop the labeling and actually listen to understand." Furthermore, let's start the war against Injustice by starting our own banks to double the income of the Bottom 99% of Workers, for many more people will come to your side when you are proactive (for “new” Business & Government solutions), instead of reactive (against “old” Business & Government solutions), which is why what we most immediately need is a comprehensive “new” strategy that implements all our various socioeconomic demands at the same time, regardless of party, and although I'm all in favor of taking down today's ineffective and inefficient Top 1% Management System of Business & Government, there's only one way to do it – by fighting bankers as bankers ourselves, and thus doubling our income from Bank Profits which are 40% of all Corporate Profits; that is, using a Focused Direct Democracy organized according to our current Occupations & Generations. Consequently, I have posted a 1-page Summary of the Strategically Weighted Policies, Organizational Operating Structures, and Tactical Investment Procedures necessary to do this at:
http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategically_weighted_policies_organizational_operating_structures_tactical_investment_procedures-448eo
Join http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/ because we need 100,000 “support clicks” at AmericansElect.org in support of the above bank-focused platform.
Most importantly, remember, as cited in the first link, that as Bank Owner-Voters in your 1 of 48 "new" Business Investment Groups (or "new" Congressional Committees) you become the "new" Online Congress, and related “new” Businesses, REPLACING the "old" Congress, and related “old” Businesses, according to your current Occupations & Generations, called a Focused Direct Democracy.
Therefore, any Candidate (or Leader) therein, regardless of party, is a straw man, a puppet, a political opportunist, just like today; what's important is the STRATEGY – the sequence of steps – that the people organize themselves under in Military Internet Formation of their Individual Purchasing Power & Group Investment Power. In this, sequence is key, and if the correct mathematical sequence is followed then it results in doubling the income of the Bottom 99% of Workers from today's Bank Profits, which are 40% of all Corporate Profits.
Why? Because there are Natural Social Laws – in mathematical sequence – that are just like Natural Physical Laws, such as the Law of Gravity. You must follow those Natural Social Laws or the result will be Injustice, War, etc.
The FIRST step in Natural Social Law is to CONTROL the Banks as Bank Owner-Voters. If you do not, you will inevitably be UNJUSTLY EXPLOITED by the Top 1% Management System of Business & Government who have a Legitimate Profit Motive, just like you, to do so.
Consequently, you have no choice but to become Candidates (or Leaders) yourselves as Bank Owner-Voters according to your current Occupations & Generations.
So JOIN the 2nd link, and spread the word, so we can make 100,000 support clicks at AmericansElect.org when called for, at exactly the right time, by an e-mail from that group, in support of the above the bank-focused platform. If so, then you will see and feel how your goals can be accomplished within the above strategy as a “new” Candidate (or Leader) of your current Occupation & Generation.
I agree...let's just radically reform campaign finance laws and throw corporate money OUT of the political process once and for all. And we'll all be happy :)
Ideas, comments, concerns? I'm listening...
You are so right. We do need to reform campaign finance laws. If the Supreme Court continues in their corporate protections then we need to pass a constitutional amendment to limit the Justice's terms perhaps 10 years.
You guys have identified the real problem - we need campaign finance reform first and foremost. It should be THE demand of these protests. If the protests adopted this as their mantra we could almost be assured good would come of it because almost all Americans agree that the influence of corporate and special interest money needs to be dealt with.
spread it... :)
I think the real problem is that one side of the aisle really doesn't want an honest debate to begin with. The other side is corrupt and dysfunctional too, but there really is one side that relishes in the dysfunctional state.
Please read:
http://www.truth-out.org/goodbye-all-reflections-gop-operative-who-left-cult/1314907779
This is what I was hoping not to see from this group especially, retreating to the bunker - still choosing sides. We are going to have to get past Left vs Right and come together as Americans or we will never get out of this mess. It's like at work, when something goes wrong and a customer is unhappy. How many times have you been in that meeting where everyone is sitting around talking about who didn't do what? Someone has to step in and say, yes - we will need to loop back around to see where the system broke down. But RIGHT NOW, this customer is unhappy. Let's talk about how to make that right and address how to turn the customer around to a happy customer first; finger pointing later.
Then don't throw around false equivalence with statements like "Neither side is immune; both engage in as much spin and polarization as the other."
Keep to, both sides are entirely dependent on moneyed interest. Both sides are corrupt.
When it comes to particular tactics and strategies there is a big difference between the two sides, so don't stoop to that false equivalence.
Ok, I can understand where you are coming from. I have been there too and I can see that you are not ready yet to open up to something outside the safety of belonging to a "team". You know, sooner or later this has got to stop being about them (the left and the right politicians) and start being about us (the American people). When we unite, we take away their incentive to polarize and manipulate. You don't even know my affiliation, and yet you are ready to lash out because of a perceived (though not intended) threat to yours. This keeps everything safely in the us vs them arena that is so familiar to us all. But, us vs them doesn't win when we are as diverse as this country is.
I actually agree with you, and am no fan boy for either team, both sides suck because of financial influence and cronyism.
That by itself is enough, no need to make both side of the aisle equally guilty of all else, because that does lead to unnecessary false equivalences.
By the way, I think you and I have just set a really good illustration. We had to actually converse to get to the point where were we not making assumptions about each other, listen and see where the other is coming from, and then find where we can agree or "agree to disagree". We could discuss policy now because we are open to hearing each other's ideas. This is what I wish that we had leaders in government able to do!
Sure, the influence is is a big problem. And do you think, like I do, that we are at the point now where it really doesn't matter anymore where MOST of the blame is? What I think is that it's beyond the point of measuring fault. What we need is a focus forward on solutions rather than another year of trying to debrief on who is more wrong than whom. I am no longer thinking left, right, whatever. I am thinking "we the people" and that's going to take people who are willing to set aside their assumptions based on media, and really listen, argue and negotiate. Nobody will get everything they want, nor should they because all or nothing necessarily makes winners and losers. What folks have to do is decide what is non-negotiable and what is a trade I'm willing to be flexible on. That's how we get to happy endings. My opinion only, but based on years of coaching and having to find the compromise that gives everyone something of what they need.
We're in complete agreement.
And now this post is dead too, as all of the insincere spammers have started the deflection campaign. Ah well, been nice talking with you NielsH, while it lasted!
That often happens to the best posts. Following several threads it's apparent that the most interesting ones drop to the bottom fastest while the stupid controversial ones keep being trolled.
My personal take about what is non-negotiable is actually simple: financial influence on political decision making should be rooted out. It's the root cause of the dysfunction. Improper deregulation, unfavorable trade agreements, lax oversight over the financial sector are all the result of financial influence on political decision making.
Agreed, and agreed!