Forum Post: Formally demand that Moveon.org leave. please sign and share
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 10, 2011, 2:05 p.m. EST by moediggity
(646)
from Houston, TX
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I believe it is important that participating groups be allowed to lend support, but that their influence be tempered and managed. No one organization, ideology or institution should be allowed to control this movement. Not simply because it will alienate factions already in play, but because it will spoil the movement in general, turning it into a conventional partisan election effort. A singular central issue will need to be identified which will satisfy all parties involved. It is my opinion that campaign financing should be this issue. If private money can be restricted or eliminated from our electoral system, the lure of corporate collusion and corruption in Washington and in state legislatures will be eliminated. It will break the back of the corporate political machine. After this is done, the libertarians, socialists, marxists, free-market anarcho capitalists, anarchists and the remaining factions may then use the new, open return to democratic elections and campaigning to promote their own specific views with only the validity and strength to their arguments as necessary tools. No more co-option or destruction at the hands of corporate campaign machines. Thoughts?
This needs its own post.
I am aware and understand the feelings here, But, initially, this old hippie was looking for a place to speak out. I never thought of joining Moveon.org' until the Occupymovement started. I live in a rural area and the only place to find anyone who wasn't simply a white republican was at the MOveon.org movement. I don't think they are coopting anything, I could be wrong ,but if they do, then call us out on it! i have also been in the LGBT struggle and have demonstrated in NYC , DC and locally for all my life, so i know what 'struggle' is all about. I won't let our local moveon groups (who have only been assisting the local Occupy POugkeepsie group and NYC) I was down to zuccotti Saturday night and was overwhelmed by the strength and diversity there,Keep that. Our moveon groups have voted to NOT even mention their names while marching or rallying with OccupyPoughkeepsie, and voted to make Poughkeepsie the hub of OccupyHudsonValley (NY).. just having my say.
Creating coalitions is necessary. That is not the same as being co-opted. You are right on.
Why is creating coalitions necessary? I think it is dangerous to Occupy to do so.
If this really is about the 99%, you must consider how the movement will be viewed when groups traditionally aligned with any political party become involved. People should be welcomed, but not organizations.
Maybe the term 'co-opt' means different things to different people. Maybe a more descriptive term would be neutralize. If people want to support or work within the Democratic party, then go do it with them. Don't allow them to be seen as working with you. This is how they will neutralize Occupy by creating a public perception that this is just politics as usual.
Coalitions work side-by-side. Neither is trying to take over the other, but working together on issues both groups care about.
If OWS works with groups from a variety of political persuasions, it can multiply its effectiveness without being taken over.
But why do you think organizational coalitions are necessary? The individual members of any organization can join Occupy.
The fact is, Occupy is NOT working with groups from a variety of political persuasions. It is only working with groups of the Democratic political party persuasion. You can bet that MoveOn and friends know that their involvement prevents people, who would otherwise be allies, from joining in, thereby neutralizing the potential for everyone to join in their common interest to take back our government from the 1$-1Vote system and and two party domination.
SEIU has begun their efforts to co-opt and claim ownership as well. Their communications staff are now scrambling to pull media attention specifically to their support of the movement so that they may begin declaring movement goals and objectives themselves, to fit in line with their plans to shore up support for mainstream Democrats in the coming election. AFSCME and AFL-CIO will be doing the same shortly.
i guess its time for move on to,,,, yep you guessed it, move on
Hell yes! This is our movement and it should stay that way!
Adding this to http://www.teaoccupyunited.com shortly good thinking! :-)
Let them set up camp in another area and send reps over and you do the same. It looks like they do not want to discuss basic issues and want to make it into a Dem vs Rep situation. Neither can represent anyone. Its money that represents, or more like who controls that money and what people are willing to do to get it.
Moveon trying to control this just like the Democrats are trying to control this. Just pwer hungry infuence peddlers. Once the Dems control this they will sell it to the highest bidder.
Anyone that wants to join the movement is encouraged to do so. If you don't like someone's message, simply remind them that the only goals/objectives that will succeed are the ones that everyone, liberal AND conservative rally behind TOGETHER.
These aren't people joining the movement, they are organizations.
Corporations, even non-profit ones, are not people. Treating corporations like they are living, breathing. human beings is one of the big problems.
that said, it would mean that we couldn't allow any reporters, journalists, or social network groups in. There comes a point where you have to realize corporations and organizations can be beneficial in some directions and not in others.
For example, I was very leery when Union Groups joined up and started their talking points. Then i realized, it doesn't matter. If the majority don't agree with what they're saying, those messages won't be enacted down the road. We're looking at the things that reach consensus with all of us. But we still need them because without them, other people might be able to interject their personal agenda without being checked and balanced.
Of course you could let in reporters, those are actual people, not organizations.
I think it does matter because accepting, and publicizing, formal endorsements from organizations, primarily Obama election backers, turns many people away from the movement. Yes, there are times when organizations are helpful, but I don't think this is one of them. Their presence is divisive, which I suspect is exactly what they want.
I would say that if you see one group coming in that has an agenda, encourage members from the opposing ideology to come in to balance them out.
We don't want to discourage anyone from joining. We want to be as all-inclusive as possible.
I don't want to discourage anyone, i.e. any real people, from joining either, but I am against organizational membership.
Moveon.org has supported grass-roots style organizing for many years -- they are not the enemy.
they want to turn this into a pro obama movement when obama has been the biggest corporate sleazebag in that the white house has seen in quite sometime. If moveon.org cannot even comply with the simplest of requests(not even demands) then fuck them! Look at what their "organization" has done. They haven't organized a real message,other than vote for the goddamned democrats and everything will be just fine. Or helped out with finding a spokesman for the movement,nothing. These guys are hurting more than helping.
read some of the comments that are appearing in some of the articles about the protests. People are speaking out against Obama. Yeah, some groups/people want to be get Obama reelected, but that is just a part of the whole. Other parts don't care or want him gone.
CONSENSUS is what is important. Find out the things we all agree with.
Does anyone know how the decision was made to formally accept organizational endorsements and by whom?
When you have a leadership vacuum, and you do, someone will fill the void. You did this to yourselves and many if us warned you this would happen. But what do we know?
There is no leadership vacuum. We're all leaders. We are striving for a hive mind where it is the needs/goals/agenda of the vast majority that helps direct change and reform. Only that way will we be able to gain reforms that the vast majority of Americans support.
We accepted because they voiced support. When we let them in they started to run rampant in our movement with pro-democrat sentiment. When we asked them politely to stop they refused. This is the result of their non-compliance.
so encourage more Tea Partiers to come in and balance them out. We want to be INCLUSIVE, not DIVISIVE.
@ Rob & modiggity,
So did your local occupy organization reach consensus on accepting?
My local group requires 100% consensus on issues so very little happens, except that warm, fuzzy feeling.
grass roots organizing that always ends up in one thing, vote for democrats. Believe me they want nothing more than to make us all vote democrat and re-elect obama. Thats all they want/
How odd in the ABOUT of that URL
About SignOn.org SignOn is a service provided by MoveOn.org Civic Action to allow anyone to set up their own online petition, share it with friends, and stay in touch with the signers of their petition using email.
MoveOn.org Civic Action sponsors SignOn, but we do not endorse the contents of any petition on this site. To find out about MoveOn's campaigns, visit www.moveon.org.
yeah I went for that bit of irony hoping that they got it,hehehehehe
"Divide (ourselves) and conquer!"
Thats what they are doing. Im just trying to help us get back control of this movement.
come on protesters like you think your going to get what you want? you need to start with your local police departments and National Guard Stations to make them come to arms if you want any change. Other wise you are just protesting producers making movies you don't like.