Forum Post: Entitlement mentality: does OWS feel owed a place to camp out?
Posted 13 years ago on Nov. 15, 2011, 11:44 a.m. EST by armchairecon1
(169)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
You were already breaking the rules of Zuccotti..
it almost seems you feel wronged because the owners kicked you out because they had to perform their legal obligation to clean the park and allow the public (which includes you) to enjoy the park
Well, the problem with America is that we don't necessarily have public squares like much of Europe has. All of that has been developed by fast food franchise chains and the like. Wouldn't you like to see more places to actually go and just hang out? Well, unfortunately, there aren't many and our form of hanging out amounts to going shopping. Yeah, we can create jobs, but the negative outcome of this is that fucking everywhere you look, there's just another store. America is just a giant shopping mall or fast food joint. These are the places that employ much of America, but people love it cause it gives jobs. Even though they're shitty, they're still called jobs. Every major city and such should have community centers and public squares, but instead, all we have is more stores, which is probably why this is the only place where the occupiers feel they can go.
If the parks are taken away then what?
I guess it would be a bit like making them stay outside the castle so nobody can hear their voice.
In your mind what would a plan "B" be
i dont disagree with your consumerist rant.. but you are right, it provides jobs.
if you want to hang out, there are still plenty of parks, village greens (which are comparable to europe's public squares), malls, etc to hang out in.... no one cares as long as you arent putting up tents and pissing and shitting all over the place (wait...)
Apparently a New York city judge (Lucy Billings) may disagree. Police currently have an order not to interfere with protesters pending the result of a hearing being held... right now, I believe.
The excuse of cleaning up the park is a farce. While it may in fact be in need of some cleaning, that was not the purpose of the eviction. Protesters were told to clear the park WITHOUT their possessions. They promised the return of their property but it quickly became apparent that they had no intention of returning them since they were just shoveled into a trash compactor. The "health risk" was also ambiguous (the most common health risk for gatherings like these are cold anf flu). It seems to me that the goal was to remove the protesters' ability to continue into the winter.
i dont know how you define a farce
the rules of using the park are clearly posted. protesters were given every opportunity to leave with their possessions (per the flyer that was handed out), those that didnt move it were removed for them.
health risk might be ambiguous if you have no idea what you are talknig about, but it is a public health issue.. and you are correct includes the flu as well as other stuff like tb (which icnreased substantially when you had homeless/drug users join your ranks.. not that there is anything wrong with that.. just makes it more of a public health hazard)
Incidentally, they were at Foley Square as of nine this morning. Something tells me that they're either going to back to Zuccotti or crash in Foley or somewhere else. Something also tells me that kicking everyone out was not the smartest thing to do. There are many technically nonviolent methods of protest (including but not limited to coordinated flashmobs) that can easily be used to intimidate, are difficult if not impossible to crack down on, and can be organized to occur simultaneously in different parts of the city. If they can't actually occupy something then we're far more likely to see things like that happen and that's actually far more disruptive than an occupation.
Does Wall street think they are owed 75,000,000,000,000 dollars of tax payer money?
http://seekingalpha.com/article/301260-bank-of-america-dumps-75-trillion-in-derivatives-on-u-s-taxpayers-with-federal-approval
thats the Feds problem for approving it..
and i dont know if you know what that article actually means. no one owes anyone anything. the trillions in derivatives were moved to another section of the bank where they are backstopped retail bank accounts (which is a retarded thing to do in anycase and violates a whole bunch of rules.. why the fed allowed it, you will have to take that up with the fed)
I don't think you know what you are saying, the derivatives are NOW insured by FDIC. Which means that if the investments (gamble) goes south the American tax payer foots the bill. 250,000 for every man woman and child. Understand?
i didnt explicitly state it, but retail bank accounts are insured by FDIC.. so yes i know exactly what i was saying
Then you should also know that by giving BofA this "Option", drastically increases the chance of them exercising the option, it in the event the derivatives prove unprofitable.
i dont know if you realize, i agree that it was an illegal and stupid move for the Fed to have approved.
if BofA made a risky and stupid bet, they and their share holders should pay for it.. not the government/FDIC or anyone else.
But you seem to be OK with this BofA / Wall Street "Entitlement mentality". A mentality that would in essence make a 250,000 dollar gamble on YOUR PERSONAL taxes, without 1) informing you and 2) allowing you to get in on the profits (you just pay if it loses). Yet you complain about a park that YOU will pay absolutely nothing for AND is filled with people protesting the very people that would rob you blind? Make me understand?
how do you think I am OK with wall street entitlement mentality? (see statement below)
Im a capitalist, where return =risk .. the only fault I saw with how things played out in the past 10-15 years re the housing bubble (driven by greed by homeowners, banks, and the government - who expected 'free growth' by enabling everyone elses greed w/ cheap interest) was the TARP bailout. IMO, the government should have let the banks and homeowners take their licks..
What's going on here is not capitalism. It's more similar to a crime syndicate. Banks need "Law", they pay for it, done deal, do what's necessary, no laws are broken, over and over again, until someone steps in and says ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!
In this scenario everyone is guilty, Banks, Lobbyist and Politicians, but for some reason it's the "lazy" tax payer that gets the blame and the Protestor that gets beat.
i agree that what is going on is not capitalism.. mainly because the government is stepping in and preventing true capitalism..
There are somethings the government is good at, which is to collect taxes to pay for utilities/highway, military (to a limit), safety net services, health care.
There are some things that capitalism is good at.. which is pricing risk. If the government steps in and affects that price, then it is no longer capitalism. Since capitalism only works if there is true greed and fear, there are things that capitalism is NOT good at.. ie: healthcare/insurance.. which is where the gov't needs to step in
A judge has issued a TRO.
So what options do the homeless have in your mind?
In America, are they entitled to "not" have a home, are they breaking the law?
This demographic is growing day by day. Many are victims of what the OWS are protesting
How do you propose we deal with these “lawbreakers”
Maybe we just need to have congress make some rules that benefit free speech.
They made rules that that legalized insider trading for themselves, surely they would have no problem making it easier to expose them with free speech. Oops, never mind.
Hmm I wonder how much it would cost us to have them protect our free speech. If the 99% would all donate $10 each maybe we could get them to work for the people instead of the Multinationals. That way we would be wouldn’t need free speech.
they can do whatever they want, its a free country
there are homeless shelters, there are rehabilitation centers, there are soup kitchens, there are job placement centers, subsidized housing/food stamps. if many of them wanted to better themselves, they just need to swallow their pride (tough, i understand) and accept the handout... pull themselves up by their boot straps and do what they need to do (im sure its easier said than done..)
alot of those homeless are either addicts or mentally ill abandoned by their families and the system.. . in which case i have no good solution
This is America
If people feel like occupying a park to make change in a corrupt system it is their right yes they are entitled to that right
If you want this to remain a free country you best not suppress people who are trying to protect it. You are on the wrong side!
Where else can People be heard? Think about it. If this voice is effectively suppressed we will in fact become a brainwashed fascist society (dressed like democracy) that nobody can change back.
Think about your role. These are serious times for America. Look at the global politics, look at our government corruption. We do it now or live with Corporatism. They just bought Greece. They own it. Spain and Italy are next. Yes corporate owned
This is not a fucking joke. This is the real deal going down. I suggest you do a little homework and then get on the side of America (the constitutional version)
BREAKING NEWS!!!!
THIS IS A MAJOR VICTORY FOR OWS.
Mahmoud Ahmadinejad announced today that All OWS protesters are welcome to come Occupy Tehran. He said he is very pleased to see so many young people have seen the true light and any enemy of the US is a friend of his. accommodations are already being made, make shift tarp tents and buckets to shit in are waiting. (no rape of women please as they are property of another man but you are welcome to engage in as much gay sex as you desire)
what are we waiting for? LET'S GO!!!