Forum Post: Eliminate National Debt and Create Jobs
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 10, 2011, 12:30 a.m. EST by Nanoatzin
(23)
from Santa Paula, CA
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
The War On Drugs is responsible for about $1 trillion of our national debt every year, and this controls less than 10% of illegal cannabis traffic (US Representative Steve Cohen, D-TN).
http://www.rawstory.com/rawreplay/2011/06/rep-steve-cohen-the-war-on-drugs-has-been-a-terrible-mistake/
Total annual US income is about $12 trillion and cannabis prohibition consumes about $1 trillion of that in taxes. Almost $1 in every $3 in taxes is spent on prohibition, and the sum total spent on the War on Drugs is larger than the entire US national debt.
About 10% of all citizens living in the US have a criminal record because of a non-violent drug offense that involved no actual victim, and easy access to electronic criminal records creates chronic unemployment as employers use this information as a weapon for life long punishment after jail time and fines have been completed. http://www.sentencingproject.org/doc/publications/dp_distortedpriorities.pdf
All of this time, effort, and money is devoted to the control of one non-toxic plant where the estimated drug overdose is 1,500 pounds consumption in 15 minutes, and which is non-addictive (United States Drug Enforcement Administration). t Law enforcement activity has no effect on cannabis addiction because there is no such thing as cannabis addition. This was openly admitted by the US Surgeon General during a briefing to the United Nations in 1937. http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/drugs/buyers/socialhistory.html
Research indicates the chemicals in cannabis are human hormones that an impact on a wide range of medical conditions (National Institutes of Health, 1996). http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2241751/
- mood disorders
- anxiety disorders
- movement disorders (Parkinson’s, Huntington’s, spastic colon, ...)
- neuropathic pain
- multiple sclerosis
- spinal cord injury
- cancer
- atherosclerosis
- myocardial infarction
- stroke
- hypertension
- glaucoma
- obesity
- metabolic syndrome
- osteoporosis
- obesity
The #1 risk is abuse by minors. The main effect for pre-teens and adolescents is that it makes it so that you "don't give a dam" because it reduces the kind of depression normally linked with negative experiences, which can reduce motivation. Cannabis produces greater intoxication in children and can produce a stupor in infants. Existing drug laws are ineffective for adolescents. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21283933
Tolerance develops rapidly and intoxication never lasts over 24 hours. Intoxication is impossible for continuous users, so a positive drug test has nothing to do with impairment. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18719045
A new drug policy is needed, perhaps like the following.
- All U.S. states and territories may establish their own legal framework independent of U.S. law after these changes take effect, but prior legislation and common law regarding cannabis prohibition are no longer applicable until reaffirmed by voters and by courts
- States may establish penalties for non-religious possession except when cannabis is inside transport container sealed by state employees (use by members of organized religion with 501(c)(3) or equivalent is permitted)
- Each state government that fails to provide container seal to a licensed transportation agent/organization within 72 hours suitable for movement to an adjacent state or religious organization becomes subject to $10,000 fine for each incident (commerce between adjacent states and religious organizations cannot be impeded)
- Each transportation agent/organization that fails to account for sealed container after 90 days inside prohibited state becomes subject to $10,000 fine (cargo must be transported in a timely manner without breaking seals)
- Require cannabis training for possession, cultivation, transport, purchase, import, export, sale, and testing (same kind of competency requirement as for drivers license, firearms, and armed guard)
- Non-violent offenses limited to the single crime of cannabis possession expunged following training and test completion except in states where personal possession and use remains prohibited (individuals that remain incarcerated become wards of the state)
- Federal authority shifted to Department of Agriculture, Department of Transportation, Department of Commerce, and U.S. Treasury (DEA involvement with cannabis suspended indefinitely)
- Eight different types of license, each with a separate kind of qualification - personal use, commercial cultivation, commercial transportation, commercial processing, commercial retail, export, import, and testing
- License holders become mandated reporters - enforcement suspended for voluntary self-reporting when individual or facility achieves compliance within 30 days - reward of 10% of fines recovered from enforcement action pursuant to reporting offenses individuals or organizations
- Mandatory retail tax - $60/ounce - required to fund rehabilitation programs
I have heard all these arguments before, and they make sense on paper.
There is just one little problem though.
the UK decriminalized weed a few years ago. They saw an uptake in weed consumption, and a lessening in prison population. All is good But that only lasted a few years, recently they have seen a massive rise in people who smoke weed being sent to mental institutions for paranoid schizophrenia.
Oh and by the way, I work for one of those "industrial prison complexes that oppress the minorities", and I have seen first hand the effects of prolonged marajanua exposure has on people, and it is not pretty.
the most startling thing I have observed dealing with these people is simply the sheer number of psych meds they are on. I mean they pop them like smarties.
It would be nice if you could contribute something positive to the discussion instead of suggesting we continue to repeat the same costly failures while expecting different results.
The UK has not decriminalized cannabis since prohibition began in the 1930s. The country you meant to name is Portugal, which is the only European country that actually has decriminalized cannabis.
Also, your "effects on prolonged marijuana exposure" are not scientific observations. Actual scientific research indicates most chronic users have a hormone deficiency/defect, and that they are self-medicating.
National Institutes of Health indicates hereditary cannabinoid deficiencies and metabolic defects contribute to many digestive illnesses, mental diseases, autoimmune disease, and cancer. These problems are not caused by actual consumption. One of those links is included. It is sad that you wish to condemn these people to death and disability in order to satisfy an abstract concept.
NIH research done by scientists is more valid than observations done by prison guards.
I hope that you agree with that assessment.
Why dont we make smoking and drinking alcohol illegal too? Keeping drugs illegal creates a black market and gangs. People should be allowed to screw up. That is their freedom. We cant legislate healthy behavior.
You are right we cannot legislate healthy behavior. But the rise in mental problems due to cannabis use causes it's own problems. The biggest of which is simply who is going to pay for their healthcare? After all they are unable to pay for it as they are unable to work, and we cannot just leave them to die because that would be inhumane. And people will not stand for massive tax raises in order to fund healthcare costs, especially if they see no benefit to themselves.
There are no easy solutions to this problem, just difficult choices and problems.
Actually, most of the problems are fantasies.
Establishing a test and license framework like the kind used for drivers licenses and firearms, would allow license holders to do most of the enforcement actions.
People under 21 and people holding passenger drivers licenses (bus/taxi), pilots license, law enforcement, and similar should be prohibited.
It may be cheaper to educate people. Not everyone smokes pot just because it is available. Just like not everyone smokes. I still believe it should be legal. There is no reason to make it a crime except to support drug lords' profits.
Making cannabis legal would be a mistake because of potential harm to adolescents and children.
It is as dangerous as alcohol and should be treated the same way.
Yes with a minimm age limit. Alcohol is legal but cannabis is not.
There are good regulations and licensing for manufacturing and distributing alcohol intended for human consumption.
A similar framework would work with cannabis. The difference is that modern technology would help.
The existing legal framework is so ineffective that worse than nothing.
Agreed. I wonder if the private prisons have a say in this. They have unions too!
Law enforcement and prison personnel do not want cannabis to be legalized because over half of all arrests and incarceration are for non-violent drug possession.
Decriminalization would reduce law enforcement jobs by half, but many more jobs would be created due to increase health care treatment options and tax reductions.
A new network of rehabilitation centers for cannabis users.
Rehabilitation is a misconception.
Cannabis is not any more addictive than sugar and coffee. Cannabis is also not toxic, so there is no such thing as an overdose. Human beings are specially adapted to resist chemicals found in most sea foods and cannabis. Most other plants that produce significant protein and oil have toxins that can kill humans, but humans are specially adapted to cannabis.
The difficulty occurs when people under 21 use cannabis. Our special adaptations do not develop until our brain matures, which does not occur until about 25 years of age. Adults over 30 do not become incapacitated like teen agers.
Cannabis was used in this way during rituals by the Sumerians that signify the transition from child to adult status. These rituals existed across most of North Africa, Asia, and Arabia. "Pagan" religious rituals were wiped out by christians and hebrews.
Debt = Money. one in the same. as long as money is in use we will forever in a state of perpetual debt. here read this http://www.radiokazoo.net/OPV/
Untrue.
Money, as a concept, is the measure of value for economic trade established by law for each country.
The value of the money for a country is generally linked to the productivity of labor in the country. Economic power is proportional to population size and income.
The existence of money does not require debt to exist, but the concept of money does require a framework for employer-employee obligations (manufacturing or services) and retail-customer obligations (purchase or contract).
Debt, as a concept, is the amount of value that may be borrowed with a suitable repayment schedule. Debt may only be canceled by court order, which involves a bankruptcy ruling that can only be issued by a federal court, because only the federal government can create or destroy money.
One related concept is when financial institutions lend money to one another. Banks are allowed to issue loans for up to 80% of the money held as assets (savings). Credit unions and savings and loans have similar rules. Financial institutions that loan money to one another actually create money in the process, which is why banks and credit unions must be registered with state/federal authorities.
No, its exactly true. your money and debt concepts are nothing more than that, concepts. in actual practice and the model for all banking systems all money is borrowed. ALL! and when they create money for each dollar that is created a large percent of that doller is immediate debt. instantly. so there is no way to get out of debt. even if every country claims bankruptcy then all that happens is the system starts over and just repeats itself thats what has happended for centuries. Every country in the world is in debt. who do you think we are all in Debt to? if we created a money system like an interest free independent currency where a democracy votes on the amount of money that the people produce and regulate the entire structure it could work but the thing is people would still be enslaved and limited forced to spend their lives working pointless jobs then dying. where is the humanity there? money is in-humaine even at its purest level it is still extremely restrictive lifestyle.
If you can explain how gold nuggets found by miners are a form of debt, then I will agree with you.
I do not believe it works that way.
apples and oranges. they abolished the gold standard years ago. although a decent point the fact is that gold is worthless. its just another resource. just because people like shiny things and give it value by hoarding it doesnt mean it has any real value. its value is created by scarcity.
I see that you are unable to disagree with me about the monetary value of commodities, like precious metals.
As are commodities, as is labor, as is money that represents the value of commodities and labor.
money has no real value. its worthless paper that used to have a standard. now its just toliet paper that we keep working for. and if money is truly worthless then commodoities and "precious" metal are just as worthless. value is relative worth. and its not relative so that makes it worthless.
Dead end discussion.
Money has the value established by law, and your points do not alter that fact.
where is this law? there is no laws regulating money. there isnt even laws that require anybody to pay federal income tax. we willing give our money away and it doenst go into the economy. do you know where it goes? right into the pockets of the very people we are protesting against. the owners of the private corporation know as the Fed. we just keep giving it away, here you go.. take my money becaues im too dumb to look it up and go, Hmm. i dont have to pay this. all its doing is making the fed richer and richer.
so all these "taxpayers" are really just charitable donaters to the fed
You forget to mention why we have this war.
The Prison Industrial Complex and oppression of minorities.
The War on Drugs was started by white supremacists.
I did not forget to bring this up because racism is a whole separate drain on the economy that I included in a separate post. Police and prisons do prey on minorities, and the bulk of this happens because most minorities lack a proper education because of funding disparities for schools dominated by minority populations.
Almost nobody that has a bachelors degree is incarcerated.
Thanks for bringing it up.
I hope this finds you well.
And our black president meanwhile mocks those who want to legalize pot.
We should all realize now we voted in a corporate puppet, George Bush with a black face.
Corporate bankers and corrupt officials plead the 5th while minorities are sent to jail for smoking some weed.
A sad situation, one not given just attention in these protests.
I believe Pres. Obama is misinformed about the situation, and in any case, I'm sure congressional pressure from Bohner, McConnell, and Cantor are forcing Pres. Obama to make concessions.
This would change if people in conservative areas manage to vote out Republican members of congress. Obama would be able to pursue the things you are suggesting if he did not have to compromise.
He had the Congress when he came in. He never had to compromise, he did so because he is a corporate puppet. A man with no executive experience was brought up by the corporate media to lead the progressives, they knew he would fail. He is the same right-wing power, hoodwinking the American people through his charisma and physical appearance which personified the change people so desperately wanted.
Don't support Obama because you think the only other choice is the Republicans. We need to take the Democratic Party back from its corporate owners and from Obama who has maligned it and only helped the Republicans.
In case you can't tell, I'm not in favor of legalizing cannabis. Regulation is what I had in mind.
Pres. Obama did no enforcement actions on state-licensed medical cannabis facilities in California until Friday, October 7, 2011.
He did that because of pressure that is coming from Republicans. The following has more.
http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/10/07/us-california-marijuana-idUSTRE7965P620111007