Forum Post: Deliberate Economic Collapse
Posted 13 years ago on Oct. 28, 2011, 5:49 a.m. EST by EndTheFedNow
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This webpage explains the 99 percent phenomenon, and echoes what OWS has been saying - that the problem is corporate lobbyist control of our elected officials and corporate plants in our regulatory bodies.
http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/power/wealth.html
When asked, "Does social science research have anything useful to say about making progressive social change more effective?" "http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/
Professor William Dumhoff of UCSC answers in this link, Yes, it does. http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/change/science.html Here is your Rx America.
It also has some interesting things to say about the electoral college, third party candidates and primary elections historical role in disenfranchising African Americans and factions within parties. http://sociology.ucsc.edu/whorulesamerica/change/science_egalitarians.html
our declaration of independence was written to protect us from what is happening today. the same thing the british were doing to this country, is what the corporations are doing. the solution was to protect the country's economy and put tariffs on foreign goods. this is the governments job. it is in the constitution . once an american company changes to a multinational corporation , there no longer an american corporation and should be subject to tariffs. the government allows them to manufacture their product in mexico, china, and other countries where they are either subsidized or or even communist. this to me is treason. there are two parties in our country, rep. and dem. to be backed by the party you have to follow party line, that line is determined by who is giving them money, corporations (multi-national) have bought and payed for both parties. also our supreme court established a corporations right to bye influence. they are only an entity not a person. what happened to , one person one vote. the only way and the way our four fathers have put in the declaration and the constitution is. first is to get the politicians who have betrayed our four fathers, out of office, that is both dems, and reps. we need people that will protect the constitution. hopefully some will come out of occupy wall street we can take our government back by doing so.
The people who have hijacked OWS and are now controlling it are internationalists and you won't see anyone coming out of that group who are defending the constitution. In fact, they despise it because it's an obstacle to their agenda.
Occupy Illuminati?
I’m not an economist or financial professional but this whole system of creating new money only when loans are made seems not the optimum way for new wealth to enter the economy. Wouldn’t it be better if all new money created equaled the total dollar amount of new food harvested, raw materials mined, oil pumped etc. in our country. If we eliminated the fractional-reserve method of money creation and substituted it with raw-wealth backed money we could use it to fund our government, greatly reducing the need for taxes. It would also be more stable rather than the loan-demand created periods of boom and bust that we go through now. Loans would be made at 100% reserves, which would allow interest rates to raise enough to make it worth it to save your money.
I think your concept of production backed economy is far too conservative for the egalitarian.
I don’t think equality of outcome is best for a society; it removes the incentives to innovate and be industrious. I do believe in equality of opportunity, and that includes access to education. A communist society never works because it robs people of their dreams.
@ TalkingHead - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swkq2E8mswI
(short vid)
Thanks, I've seen it. Great video. Also like Web of Debt by Ellen Brown and The Creature from Jekyll Island.
by the way, our constitution did not say in only certain zones we have freedom of speech everywhere its free to speak your opinion
Quite right. The idea of needing a permit to assemble flies in the face of the constitution.
What's going to replace the system? Just curious, because you collapse the system, we all might starve to death.
We have a framework that we can return to - the constitution. It has never been obeyed in our lifetimes. We are damn fortunate to have it, too, because there is no one around with the brilliance of the people who put that together. We only need to reclaim our heritage and restore the constitution. The only system that needs collapsing is the one that usurped the constitution. There's no need to reduce things to rubble. We have the structure already in place.
I dunno, I'd bet that I could sit in a room for a month with a few people and come up with a better document than the Constitution. It wouldn't be vastly better, but it would be better.
lol
I mean, we've got the Constitution already. We don't have 250 years of knowledge and experience that we could apply?
But none of that solves the real problem. It doesn't matter how good the document is if nobody is willing to actually enforce it.
If you are saying you might be able to come up with an amendment, I can see that. Write something that profound and well thought out from scratch, no way.
You're right about it not being enforced. That was the job of the people and that's why the second amendment was so important to the founders. The second amendment protects all the others, as they say. However, nobody ever bothered to take up arms against the feds, except the south, and they did try secession (peaceful separation), which Thomas Jefferson approved of, but he was long dead. We know how that rebellion turned out. So, what to do? Protesting will get nowhere. The American people aren't too skilled in warfare (or inclined!). Therein lies the dilemma, eh? The "Man" has control of the killing machine and has shown to be willing to use it. I don't know what it will be but something's gonna give and the constitution will be the only viable framework to rebuild and reorganize after TSHTF.
Hey, maybe I could, maybe I couldn't. I'm not guaranteeing anything. But I think, especially being able to use that as a general framework, I could do better. I mean, I already understand a lot of the concepts, even if I didn't have access to it, I've got 250 years of mistakes to draw from, attempt to fix in the revision. I wouldn't guarantee something better, but I wouldn't misunderestimate myself either. I'd bet that I could do it.
Lysander Spooner made the argument that if the Constitution existed, and prohibited big gubmint... and big gubmint existed, then either the Constitution really DIDN'T limit big gubmint, and we've been fooled, or it has been ineffective in prohibiting it, and either way, should just be done away with. That's extreme, but it's something to think about. Like I said, I think I could do better. :)
As for the rest.. yeah. It's a bummer, man!
lol
What Spooner observed was both right and wrong. Right in that the best plan for a government ever conceived, could not keep evil in check. Wrong in that the founders never claimed that it could. In fact, they warned us that it couldn't and that preserving the freedom they fought for was the peoples' job. The genius, determination, personal sacrifice and vision of those men is RARE. That so many of them incarnated, together, at that time, is probably something that happens once in thousands of years. IOW, we're probably screwed.
Stop misunderestimating me, homie! While I agree with you, you don't know what any of us is capable of, including yourself! Me? I'm capable of anything!
How have I misunderstood you?
mis under estimated.
Just start using invisible currency.
Soros, a JEW, held a Bretton Woods 3 summit to build a new economic system to replace the current one. He will collapse our economy and profit from it and we will all starve to death. He is using us; let's get rid of him and then our protest will be real grassroots. We are in bed with the enemy!!!!
I UNDERSTAND how people feel POWERLESS and SCARED in the presence of forces they don't UNDERSTAND, but people simply MUST resist the temptation to BLAME some EXTERNAL FOE for their FEAR. PLEASE try reading a good TEXTBOOK on modern economics INSTEAD lest you become a freakin' NAZI !
Yup. This is also how the environmental movement was killed. In the 70s, there was very high consciousness about pollution (water, air, land). There was also a big anti nuclear power contingent. The movement was demonized and then hijacked by the "global warming/climate change" tards who were the pawns of the very corporations doing the environmental damage! Instead of talking about chemical companies dumping their waste into our waterways, the warming tards are fighting CO2, a natural, non toxix, essential element of LIFE!!! That's how stupid they are and what useful idiots they are. Meanwhile, corporations like British Petroleum are major drivers of the climate change bullshit, rebranding to BP and "Beyond Petroleum" and polluting away like always. The real environmental movement became a hijacked controlled opposition shell of it's former self.
So, that's how it works. The enemy does the hijacking and redirects the opposition away from itself.
Before we act effectively as American citizens to audit or abolish the Federal Reserve Banking System, we must educate ourselves about its unconstutional origins and nefarious history.
How the Federal Reserve Banking System began http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6507136891691870450#
AMERICA: Freedom To Fascism – a film by aaron russo FULL LENGTH http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=orHVNUnRKlI&noredirect=1 who was aaron russo? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Axz6xkWowZk&feature=related
MORE http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IKPw2Te57NQ&feature=related
Aaron Russo's Last Message To Humanity http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8f85mSQKq6w&feature=related
HEAL THE CORRUPT MONEY SYSTEM, HEAL SOCIETY
How a cleverly devised banking system robs the average person of the right to a decent life while providing enormous wealth for its corporate owners and stockholders http://www.federal-reserve.net/
WATCH: SOVEREIGN SOLUTIONS http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=6507136891691870450#docid=-1353648499382948626 This is a must see. G. Edward Griffin, author of "The Creature from Jekyll Island: A Second Look at the Federal Reserve" and other books and materials, www.realityzone.com, interviews Norm Dodd, who shares inside information about the hidden agenda for world goverenment. Intro, theme music added by producer Rich Angell. May 2007 Re-edit. If you are interested in this subject, you might also be interested in Sovereign Solutions: Ben Gradon on Parents United in Responsibility for Education <www.pureducation.com>, and Sovereign Solutions: Charlotte Thomson Iserbyt <www.deliberatedumbingdown.com>.
BE PREPARED: SEE HOW CNN TREATED PROTESTERS OF THE FED RESERVE – PRE OWS CHICAGO 2009 ) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Hx_4mBZBjk&feature=related
WHAT YOU CAN DO PETITION TO Abolish the Unconstitutional Federal Reserve Act of 1913 http://www.petitiononline.com/fedres/petition.html http://sanders.senate.gov/petition/?uid=5d1836fe-d883-42bc-af09-4e593a6cab76 http://www.givemeliberty.org/FreedomDrive/Redress/PetitionFed.htm
[SIGH] The DISINFORMATION never ends !
I quote from the Encyclopedia of Business and Finance, 2nd ed. which you can read at http://www.encyclopedia.com/topic/Federal_Reserve_System.aspx#2-1G2:1552100128-full
'Designed by Congress and subject to congressional authority, the Fed is a politically independent and financially self-sufficient federal agency ... The Fed's primary policy-making group is the seven-member Board of Governors. Appointed by the president and confirmed by the Senate, members serve for one fourteen-year term only. A member who is appointed to fill an unexpired term may be appointed for an additional full term. From among the seven members, the Board's chairman and vice chairman are also appointed and confirmed by the president and the Senate for four-year terms."
If you like, you can also read Title 12 paragraph 3 of the Federal Code that created the Fed at http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/12/usc_sup_01_12_10_3.html . It says the same thing in legalese.
Though the member banks of the Federal Reserve System ARE private, the Governing Board sets POLICY. We The People control the Federal Reserve. This relationship where a regulating agency works closely with the industry being regulated is replicated in the FCC, the FDA, etc. In ALL cases, We the People set policy, and the regulated companies have just as much influence over policy as we decide their input merits.
As for this whole panic over printing money, people need to remember money is just a token we use to facilitate commerce, and it has no intrinsic value. The VALUE in an economy is defined by the goods and services exchanged in commerce, NOT the number of tokens. People who obsess over these tokens, whether the rich who hoard them or the poor who vest them with too much meaning, suffer from a delusion. See my post at http://occupywallst.org/forum/what-is-money/
Note that if we did NOT maintain an elastic supply of tokens, we would be in DEEP trouble right now because the rich and China hold so MANY of our tokens that there wouldn't be enough left to facilitate commerce. Fortunately, we can just print more tokens to ensure there are enough to meet our needs.
EDUCATE YOURSELF RICO We The People DO NOTcontrol the Federal Reserve.
works closely with the industry being regulated BT THE CORRUPT FCC, the FDA,.
WATCH AND LEARN RICO: THE Unbelievable story of FDA corruption - Full Documentary online http://www.vegsource.com/news/2011/06/unbelievable-story-of-fda-corruption---full-documentary-online-thru-monday.html
In ALL cases, We the People DO NOT set policy.
WAKE UP!
Yes, but nevertheless, the FCC and the FDA are the perfect example of how it can go terribly wrong when officials appointed by our elected politicians work a little too closely with the industries the are supposed to be safeguarding us from.
FDA: http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123142562104564381.html (And that's when they're not letting corporations self-regualte) FCC: http://www.dslreports.com/shownews/FCCs-Baker-Heads-for-Job-at-Comcast-114174
The "YES" is all I was after.
The rest argues whether the Federal Reserve is managed effectively. That's a VERY complex topic that we will not be able to resolve here. In FACT, I doubt EITHER of us has sufficient knowledge regarding modern economic theory to even have an INFORMED discussion of the finer details!
@ sunshower - That was fun watching party shill posing as a reporter, Susan Roesgen (sp), revealing what the MSM position is on people really protesting the financial mafia.
@ sunshower - Good information. Most probably are too lazy to learn, but not all. You've done a service to all of those who have asked for the facts.