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Idea: List names of twinklers and stinklers

Posted 3 years ago on Sept. 19, 2014, 9:12 p.m. EST by jart (1186) from New York, NY

How would you guys feel if I modified the forum so that when you hover over a vote, it shows you the names of all the people who twinkled/stinkled a comment?

I think that might make it a bit easier to moderate the forum. It would also help you guys bond better with one another, because you'll know who likes/dislikes you.

Thoughts?

184 Comments

184 Comments


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[-] 7 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

Just remove 'the stinkle option' jart. That will only leave the ability to agree with ; show solidarity to and still express support for good points, people and comments agreed with, whilst removing the possibility for silently expressing negativity without committing to a comment.

Disapproval and disagreement - can still be expressed and agreed with by actively making a comment and that comment being 'twinkled'. To maintain 'BCT' and highlight good comments - 'twinkles' are still needed but the 'negative silent kick' of a 'stinkle' - is not necessary.

Enabling the viewing of who 'twinkled' and who 'stinkled' is a bad idea, imho. It will lead to rancour and resentment and recrimination and people who 'twinkle' - should be allowed their anonymity and not be expected to possibly justify their agreement with comments or solidarity with a poster or their politics.

Also jart, restore 'Builder' to the forum please & allow posters 'BradB' and 'struggleforfreedom80' to start their comments at '+1' rather than the '0' that they seem to now, as that is unfair and both are excellent friends of this forum. Also shooz & ZenDog should have 'troll' removed & be unbanned. That'd be fair too.

Further, please unban 'Odin' and his url / isp address. He is a true and committed occupier who even if possibly 'over passionate' in the past .. is still a real friend of OWS and this forum. Consider being more circumspect with banings and it is a good job that shooz can no longer arbitrate this forum for The DNC and Likud. That partisan factionalism was very bad for the forum but we can handle it from a non-mod !!!

Whatever your personal views and wherever you are politically right now ... you did a very good thing by setting up this site and forum jart. You are not above criticism but this is an important site & goes down in the annals of political activism in The U$A. Never let this place be destroyed jart. This you owe to The 99% and to your own early activism, bravery, commitment and discipline & to continuing 99% concerns.

This forum can regulate itself, with the committed and loyal posters here already and with honest, new people .. with a minimum of fuss, I believe. We'll only need your help for hack attacks. Keep looking in here as time and energy allows. The open and seemingly chaotic format here is a real asset, as is the archive for actual research. Trolls and neigh-sayers and sock-puppets can be dealt with by the regulars.

Be good and do the right thing jart. ''Do No Evil'' comrade. Solidarity to you. Viva The 99% ! Viva OWS !!

pax, amor et lux ; hic, nunc et semper ...

[-] 6 points by turbocharger (1756) 3 years ago

Probably the best solution imo.

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

no point in a -1,0,+1 counting system here

If I paid attention to scoring| I'd have quit long ago

[-] 1 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

Thanx & the sooner we implement it the better - see below as to why !!!

ad iudicium ...

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

I suggested getting rid of the "stinkle" a year ago, I don't remember if Shadz66 was a supporter then or not you can take a look if you like:

https://occupywallst.org/forum/i-suggest-the-mods-remove-the-stinkle-and-its-affe/

Odin is/was and shall forever be a troll.

Perhaps the forum would be made stronger if those that have been banned would just stay away rather than coming back with different name.

[-] 5 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

Remove the 'stinkle' and all comments should start with '0' points perhaps. All the best ideas are clear, simple and with hindsight - somewhat obvious. I looked at your link. Looks like 'shadz66' missed it or saw it but ignored it. He can't quite remember (or so he tells me!). I will try to chastise him later !!!!

Calling 'Odin' a troll is just like calling you a troll for having your lips semi-permanently stuck to Hitlary Clinton's well padded ass. 'Misguided' or 'over-zealous' may be fair subjective judgements - but 'troll' is unfair and unreasonable, imo. The forum is stronger the more people it has - possibly !!!

'Banned' people returning would be less likely IF people weren't banned for political differences or for not subscribing to DNC / Likud diktats and talking points (just like shooz was apt to do). Political, tactical, strategic & other differences are what provide the 'cut & thrust' of debate !!

I agree with your 'remove the stinkle idea' as articulated in your forum-post of 18 months ago & add that starting each comment at '0' points, possibly has value too .. because good comments will be read and 'twinkled' and troll comments don't deserve any points !

ad iudicium ...

[-] -2 points by 99nproud (2697) 3 years ago

Your trolling Partisan Political (secret) thought Police force is the only real problem.

Odin, flip, builder, engineer, turbo, hc, trashy, (& all their various socks) have always been the problem, it's your (& the PPP force)harassment/trolling of certain political thoughts that create the need to ban you & your PPP force.

The points?- irrelevant. ..inkles? childish.

Allowing FREE (from trolling) thought/comments should be the highest priority.

Even if the comments are Democratic/Republican ideas.

Freedom of expression from harassment is the goal of the forum.

If you set aside all these meaningless 'forum rules' discussion & focused on substance the forum would provide meaningful reading.

Peace!!!

[-] 4 points by beautifulworld (22780) 3 years ago

Bully.

[-] 0 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

Looks like any Hitlary or Dem criticism has you loosing your cool to spew drivel like ^that above^ !!! You VQuack and snooz, MadDog, GF, frf, JiffySmith, bensdick & co. seem to think OWS should constantly cuddle Dems as u seem to have no actual political perception - past Duopoly and a sort of conservative, soft-liberalism ... unlike those you mention above and others !! No problem tho' - it's all about the agon !

pax ...

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22780) 3 years ago

Gee, they really wanted to hide this comment. Nice list, Shadz. Dead on.

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

ego driven bullshit designed to keep OWS on the sidelines and powerless.....

[+] -4 points by 99nproud (2697) 3 years ago

I haven't said criticism of any party/pol should be discouraged. That's you applying a false argument to me 'cause you can't honestly argue my stated position. (can you say straw man?)

If you just stick to your great substantive posts, & avoid the irrelevant name calling/personal attacks & Partisan Political, thought Police work the forum would benefit.

Peace

[-] 2 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

It's not so much what you may say ... as what you don't say or do !!! I don't think that I applied ''a false argument'' at all because I have never heard you say a word against Hitlary &The Dems !! It may seem to you that 'Left Liberals' have nobody to vote for bar 'Hitlary Neo-ClintCon' in the next POTUS race but The 99% struggle is bigger and longer than that ''straw man'' !

We can very easily choose to avoid each other if you like but it is your intemperate intervention here -

that totally warranted my reply, imo. This in light as your enthusiastic demand for my being banned from this forum in the last days of July, when TrashyManque' attacked this forum and your pointed fingers.

I do not think that you should be banned tho' ... irrespective of how many monikers and votes you may marshal. Go do your good deeds & stop bickering with me. Only The 99% Struggle has any meaning.

pax ...

[+] -4 points by 99nproud (2697) 3 years ago

"as what you don't say or do". Perhaps if you just avoided the policing/judgment of my (& others) political comments and focused your energy on the substance of the issues the forum would benefit.

I have criticism for all pols/parties/economic systems etc...

But the point is I do NOT have to prove anything to anyone.

We are free to express our opinions even if you & your Partisan Political secret thought Police disagree. Even if it isn't Occupy approved,

No purity test necessary, We reject your McCarthyism.

Insofar as avoiding each other: Don't you wish. As long as our comments have a reply button we can respond.

Peace

[-] 3 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

For The 99% Struggle, none of us here are above or beyond criticism !

The agon applies every which way & there is no 'avoiding' that truth !!

Say and do as you please - but just who is ''owsarmy'' actually ?!!!

ad iudicium ...

[+] -4 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

your friend flip admits that his work helps elect the GOP, why do you also work to elect the GOP? and yes in case you were wondering I think that's a crap idea...

[-] 2 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

It's you who is happy to suck Hitlary's ass !!! I have NOTHING to do with the GOP & - you know that !! But your 'zero-sum-game' ; binary blinded ; Duopoly obsession & time frame of only 1 or 2 '(s)election cycles' - is your problem !! Sadly it's also everyone's else's problem too, as that ... ''Neocon's Neocon'' Hitlary Clinton WILL be your next 'POTUS' & US Empire, Corporatism & Austerity WILL roll on, whilst you and folks like you will think that your job is done ... despite The 99% Democracy that is needed - not being any closer whatsoever !

respice, adspice, prospice ...

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

You work day and night to elect the GOP then pretend you are not responsible for their actions, you are an idiot!

If you have your way the next President will be Jeb brother to your last pick for the office, how did your man W Bush work out?

[-] 7 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

the people are not stupid nor do we accept a false choice

[+] -4 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

so from your point of view the Bush Presidency doesn't count because it was just a "false" Presidency?

What you want people to believe is that it matters not how many Republican Presidents we have if someday there can be a new party, I simply disagree I think we can no longer wait to do something.

[-] 3 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

OMG ! You really believe that ?!! Are you nuts ... or actually just blinded by a binary and deluded by The Duopoly- ?!!!

You know frf - I seriously worry about you & your inter-cranial goings on sometimes. Pls give up the day time drinking.

Jeb Bush may well be the GOP candidate for 2016 ... but Hitlary C WILL be your next POTUS and if so, what then ?!!

More relevantly, consider the following but rest assured that I had naught to do with it & nor do I approve of the GOP !

ad iudicium ...

[-] 4 points by flip (7101) 3 years ago

i think he does really believe that! i at first thought he was just a sophist but i now think he is a religious fundamentalist on the subject. that is why he can criticize one group and say that doesn't mean he supports the opposing group but if you do it -it must mean you support hamas or the gop or whatever his little mind objects to.

[-] 7 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

He's clearly a fukwit on the matter but how does his b-s comment above, get on BCT ?! I'll now hazard a guess shall I ?!! Because the less scrupulous mendacious, manipulative mean-spirits on this forum now have carte blanch to sign up here anew and cast their multi-votes & I predict more DNC lovers on BCT !!!

minima maxima sunt ...

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

ahhh shadz and here I thought you thought votes didn't matter,

but newbies like you may not know that much about the broad.....

[-] 4 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

Perhaps you don't ''matter'' !!! Votes may matter for all of a few hours but no more than that !! I wonder what you believe O.W.S. is really all about ?! To assist you to get a clue, maybe try :

respice, adspice, prospice ...

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

So now there are two of you I wonder how that happened?

Shadz you must be very proud of your efforts looks like your guys are going to win the Senate back and be putting judges which you love like Roberts on the bench.

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

Ahh another newbie is going to teach me about OWS eh?

[-] 0 points by corsali (47) 3 years ago

AH!..... Have you taken a DNC potion or something?? Let's see anyone who is not supportive of the Democratic Party is a Republican, right?

It must be nice to live in the little world that you live in.

YOU... of all people should know that OWS was never about electing more Democrats to solve the plethora of problems that we face....nor will it ever be.

Of course you and all your little friends (monikers) know that....otherwise WHY would you U ALL be so trying?

[-] 0 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

You're a one legged man at an ass kicking contest !!! 'Butt' do see if you can consider the following :

et temet nosce ...

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

EDIT re. below : https://occupywallst.org/forum/search/?q=user%3Ashadz66 & Stop being an idiot frf !!!

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

flip you have admitted that your work is designed to elect the GOP it matters not if I "believe it" it is your stated plan....

[-] 4 points by flip (7101) 3 years ago

you know it is ok that you are a jerk and a little weasel but it is not ok that you lie! grow up or go away you have no business here dnc boy

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

personal attacks change nothing you have already confirmed that just as my work results in electing Dems your work results in electing the GOP and you know that and you are good with that, your work is to elect the GOP whether I'm a 'weasel" or not,

weasel that is just too cute.....are you like 80?

[-] 5 points by flip (7101) 3 years ago

it was not a personal attack it was a statement of FACT - you are a liar. and yes i am 80 which is why i don't have time to put up with stupidity and LYING - now don't make me prove it - i have only a short time left on the planet

[-] -3 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

it's no lie that my work helps the Dems (as you pointed out) and your work helps the GOP (as you pointed out....)

[-] 2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

I know as do you that your efforts help to elect the GOP just as people like you help to elect W Bush, flip admitted his work helps the GOP, you work to elect the next GOP president, it is your only hope to see another Bush in the White House.

yet you work night and day to elect the GOP

[-] 4 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

REally ?! So what's wrong with this picture, both above & below (links et al) ?!! i'm-just-sayin' !!! Also fyi:

sub rosa ?

[-] 4 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

STOP talking out of your ass, ffs frf !! VQuack and his sox & snoozy lurkers .. can 'twinkle' your b-s all they like but readers here know their arse from their elbow - unlike you !! Look what happens when you start making sense factsy & then consider what happens when u don't & got 'mid-term mania' again ?!

e tenebris, lux ...

[+] -4 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

you accept outcomes like W Bush being in the White House if you think it will help your cause just as you will accept Jeb, you never have a bad word for any of your GOP buddies....

[-] 6 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

I should refuse to further fuel the b-s squabble here but in response to the b-s above, please see here ..

Read them & in particular try to digest Gary Younge's fine article and then .. weep - you tedious half-wit.

nosce te ipsum ...

[-] -1 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

So to be more correct I should say you embrace outcomes like W Bush being elected?

[-] 1 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

I'll embrace you, IF you accept that you're wearing your ass as a hat !!! + fyi :

ad iudicium ...

[-] 3 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

'Mid Term Mania' or 'Binary Blindness' or 'Duopoly Delusion' or 'Zero Sum Game Thinking', so which is it factsy ?!! Your distinctly anti-OWS fixations .. suddenly seem to be rather popular around these parts !!!

Being a Democratic Party Supporter in Arizona - may count as 'radical or revolutionary' ... but in the real world ... it doesn't cut the mustard but is nevertheless, a useful barometer of the ongoing DNC co-option attempts here on this forum & in the wider reality of The US Body Politic, with its 'right & righter' reality !!

True 99%ers inside the Dems would leverage OWS et al, to drag Dems 'Left' ... NOT look to co-opt and drag '99% Solidarity Orgs. and dis-Orgs' (like OWS!) towards the over-crowded 'Right' .. for fux sake, frf !

veritas vos liberabit ...

[+] -4 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

maybe the "points" reflect that more people who actually want to do something besides feed some idiots ego, thinking he or she could be President and folks see how folks like you and flip, flip and twitch every time you're asked about the real world.....

oh and yes like your buddy flip you too work to elect the GOP

[-] 2 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

GOP, blah, blah fkn blah !!! Time to look through the looking glass frf !! And welcome to ''the real world'' !

As insightful a piece as you'll ever read by a great commentator - BUT have u got the gonads to read it ?

minima maxima sunt !


EDIT re. below : <https://occupywallst.org/forum/search/?q=user%3Ashadz66>
[-] 1 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

here's one of those "right of center" posts you speak of

https://occupywallst.org/forum/americas-monarchs/

I would look for one of yours but all that you write is to support the GOP so I could find nothing on wealth or wages but why would I? How would that help your buddies the GOP win?

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

As long as a Monster like the GOP lives I don't waste my time on nitpickers. There are dragons to slay and this man attacks those that try, be it as it may...

[-] 0 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

FDR was the man for his .. and these, times - but you're way too right-of-centre to see that, probably :

fiat lux ...

[-] -2 points by engineer4 (352) 3 years ago

Since you named me here, i will reply....Trolling partisan police? why VQ, I am surprised that you agree to allow opposing viewpoints. Yet all of your comments seem to support only your POV and everyone else that disagrees is a partisan or ? Unless of course you discuss with your other monikers such as inclusionman and the like. Why not propose only one ID or would that cause you to be lonely? You want freedom from harassment, then come clean and drop the monikers and be one real person for once in your life. And then let the real debates begin.

As for rules, I only ask for civil discourse and some common courtesy, and no banning unless violent or open threats to someone's else's harm. Should never be banned just for disagreement or ones point of view. As far as multiple IDs, that can be handled through a simple process: shun them. We are all members of this planet so we should at least be able to talk to one another without being at each others throats.

[+] -4 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

I agree with the part about no banning, but why care about multiple IDs. Who cares? In real life, people are allowed to use their real name, pen names to write books or articles, fake names on forums, or even no name and remain anonymous, etc.. If you write to your local paper with real concerns, they might print them even if you don't give your real name. Why should it be different here? What matters is the ideas no?

I mean, great philosophers and thinkers like Kierkegaard and various pen names in their careers. Does that bother you? If so, why?

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

if we all voted using our names|

that vote could be counted by everyone

[+] -4 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

I'm not sure what you mean? And, voting on what? Are you talking about stinkle/twinkle voting which is absolutely useless and a huge waste of time?

[-] -2 points by engineer4 (352) 3 years ago

It can be quite dishonest when a user uses multiple IDs just to promote his/her idea as if a majority like it. I am not aware of authors having multiple pen names at once but it may have occurred. I would agree that it sometimes might be useful to present an idea from a third party (i.e. pen name) in order to prevent pre-opinion formed before even reading the text. We all are guilty of that sometimes of presupposition soley based on seeing a name. There can be work arounds on that. Honest people would not take advantage, and the ones that do can be spotted quite easily. I would ask once the discussion is completed that the ID would be revealed by the author for transparency

[-] -3 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

It can be quite dishonest when a user uses multiple IDs just to promote his/her idea as if a majority like it.

Do you follow what the majority agrees with?

My suggestion is to learn to judge an idea on its own merits. This is an art. Think for yourself. How many people like an idea or who shares an idea should be of no consequence.

If you develop the proper tools to judge ideas, you won't be bothered by things like multiple IDs.

I would ask once the discussion is completed that the ID would be revealed by the author for transparency

The only important transparency is with the clarity of ideas. I don't see why knowing anything about the author is important. Unless you can't judge ideas on their own merit of course. Is that something you find difficult? Do you need to know who the proposer is to judge the worthiness of an idea?

I am not aware of authors having multiple pen names at once but it may have occurred

Most did. I gave an example in my previous comment - Kierkegaard. Finding an example of an author that did not use various names would be the challenge here.

[-] -1 points by engineer4 (352) 3 years ago

No, majority should not influence ones own interpretation/agreement/disagreement, and i try to not have that impact my opinion of a statement, opinion, idea, etc. Though it can subconsciously without one realizing it.

The issue I have with the use of multiple IDs is when one uses these IDs to self promote as if there is a general agreement or consensus with ones opinion etc. Using an ID to present an opinion, idea, etc. is not a problem with me as long as the author does not use a second ID within the same thread or discussion. That I do have a problem with. That I believe violates the trust one try's to have with the original author when debate or discussion is taking place.

And yes, you are correct about authors and pen names, that was my bad...wrote before thinking about that one.

[-] -2 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

I think the only person who was using various names in the same threads and postings was VQkag2 at one point. Not sure if he's still doing it. Most people, like me, Odin, and a bunch of others were only generating new names to circumvent being banned by the Twinkle Team moderators. Now that jart is moderator I don't get banned. But when DKAtoday and shooz were moderators, they banned me on a daily basis.

[-] -1 points by engineer4 (352) 3 years ago

I think we are in general agreement on the points.

One other point: I am not sure how comments are deleted but unless the comment is as described in my text above (threats, etc), then they should remain. Censorship is the enemy of free speech.

[-] -3 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

Censored comments are marked "removed".

"Delete" appears when a user purposefully deletes his comments.

DKAtoday and his Twinkle Team friends are obsessed at using bots to down vote me and others like Odin, so I piss them off by deleting my comments after a bit. That means the comments no longer affect my score. So, they spend their time going around to down vote me, but once I delete those comments those down votes are removed and my score goes up again.

It's just funny. This ain't no Donkey Kong right. Scores shouldn't matter. It's nice to stick it up to those who think it's all about twinkles and stinkles.

I care about one thing. Ideas.

[Deleted]

[-] 4 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

The reasons To ToleraTe you ... are the same reasons to tolerate ZenDog and shooz - namely for the sake of the agon, as I've explained to u many times TrashyManque' [ http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agon ].

Your comment above is redolent with narcissism & manipulation and you can NEVER be trusted here. Your self-serving 'concern trolling' is as clear as ever as are your myriad manipulative mendacities on this forum. Eg., when you say: ''Yes, I am one individual. With one vote. Nothing more, nothing less.'' :

So how many monikers (& ergo 'votes') have you got on the go here right now, you deceitful scumbag ?! No fkn wonder you want to negate all points and lose the twinkles too, you self-serving li'l Troll-boT and removing 'stinkles' really worries you too, doesn't it ?!! All this talking about procedure & process means we don't talk about 99% related matters - about which you knew so very little & care even less, right ?!!!

You really are {& have ever been} one of the worst aspects of this forum - mais c'est la vie n'est ce pas ?

temet nosce

[Deleted]

[-] 5 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Concern_troll & STFU 'cause I gotta watch footy now, Trashy-Troll-BoT !!!

Any of us here can ''ignore'' or react to just about whoever we wish to. You & your points are .. b-s !!

nosce te ipsum ...

[Deleted]

[-] 5 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

You're ''sorry'' are you Trashy ?!!! I don'T believe you for one moment, as YOU are the primary reason behind much of this forum's problems - historically and even now !! You don'T believe in ''democracy'' - you're looking for a self-serving chaotic anarchy - u mendacious, arrogant, narcissistic, 'concern-troll' !

gnothi seauton ...

[Deleted]

[-] 6 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

Alors, encore ... jusT how many monikers (et ergo 'votes') - are u marshalling on this forum right now ?!

Re. ''If everyone was able to ignore the people they want'' .. they can do that already & I wish that 4 U !!

I argue against patently partisan mods - not for no mods at all - YOU want that & for obvious reasons !!!

fiat lux ...

[Deleted]

[-] 5 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

STOP 'occupying' your ass with your head, T !!

verum ex absurdo ...

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

sometimes there's an argument

never is a word like impossible

[-] 5 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

Seeing who likes/dislikes you would be no different than what people have already come to know from their regular interactions. I would support doing away with the point system altogether or just doing away with the stinkle. By just doing away with the stinkle, liked comments receive positive reinforcement while unliked and neutral comments simply remain as they are. It would contribute to a more positive atmosphere on the forum.

For better moderation, I would suggest a triad of moderators such as Renneye, Shadz66, and flip. Also some kind of screening to make sure that any moderators selected aren't partisan advocates. I would also suggest that you (Jart) make the time to visit the forum on some regular basis perhaps once a week or once a month just to check on things and connect with members. I think that would be most important.

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

If both the twinkles and stinkles are kept, an alternative to what exists now would be to have separate enumerations of them like the 'likes' and 'dislikes' featured for the comments on articles posted on MSN and Yahoo.

[Deleted]

[-] 4 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

The problem I see with voting on individuals is the inevitable existence of factions supporting those who would favor them thus resulting in the forum becoming a microcosm of the reality we already face with partisan politics. Reality forbid that a partisan faction gain control of an Occupy forum as the forum has already experienced through a single individual. There should be some assurance that an Occupy forum remains an Occupy forum regardless of how many individuals of a non-Occupy perspective participate on the forum.

[Deleted]

[-] 6 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

fuck off PIG ... or better yet ... go fuck yourself some more... you obviously ain't getting enough on your own

[Deleted]

[-] 5 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

fuck u !!!

[Deleted]

[-] 6 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

fuck u again !!!

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

If most of the people on the forum decide something, that is not what the 99% want, it is only what most of the people on the forum want. If a time should come in which most of the participants want the forum to support the Democratic Party, the forum would no longer be an Occupy forum. Every organization or movement has parameters that define their identity. When people of an organization want to change those parameters to a point that the organization is no longer in keeping with its original identity, the people are free to create their own organization and leave the original to itself. The original identity should attract like minded people who identify with that identity but the popularity of the identity will also attract those who would try to alter it to their own agenda. Every identity requires unchanging parameters that maintain that identity no matter what else is free to be changed. The Occupy forum should be no different in that respect. If Jart would be willing to establish some kind of regular attendance on the forum, she would be regularly available to remove and replace moderators who abuse their job.

[-] 4 points by corsali (47) 3 years ago

If jart wants this forum to become a vital part of our struggle once again, she has to have non-partisan moderators.

[Deleted]

[-] 4 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

The main aspect of OWS is in its very name: Occupy Wall Street i.e. a protest against the abuses of the financial elite. Everything else about OWS is an after thought. If direct democracy beyond general assemblies were a main aspect of OWS, one would expect to see some type of central effort in promoting it e.g. http://occupywallst.org/forum/omni-organizing-municipal-national-initiatives/

The forum was started by Jart for Occupy and everyone who has come to it and remained is obviously accepting enough with that fact as we are all free to create an alternative to it at any time. I quit participating back in July when I was finally fed up enough with how things were because I was free to do so. I'm temporarily back for the moment because again, I'm free to do so due to being accepting enough of the current conditions to be here. Whether or not the forum represents OWS is determined solely by the perspectives and endeavors of its participants. Whether or not the forum represents the NYCGA is of course solely determined by the NYCGA. The forum is indeed a Jartocracy and so long as we don't venture forth to either leave, create, or join up with an alternative, no matter what our complaints, we obviously accept the forum enough as it is to nevertheless continue participating.

[Deleted]

[-] 3 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

If the hundreds of regular users who have left the forum have created and maintained their own forum, this discussion will be pointless. All there is to do is to post the link to the site and we can all just go over to it en masse. If however, such a forum doesn't exist for us to flee to, there's obviously no will to create it and therefore significant acceptance of the Jartocracy that exists.

People have not left the forum because of Jartocracy. People have left the forum because there was never enough Jartocracy. Jart's long absences from the forum is what has allowed all of the ongoing squabbling and moderator abuses. So long as this forum is susceptible to malicious partisan agents who have nothing better to do than to cause disruptions on what should be a non-partisan forum, the forum isn't ready for democracy. No democracy should be constantly vulnerable to outside influences. If the Ron Paul advocates could be prohibited from their promotions, all partisan advocates could have been prohibited as well. It would have prevented a vast majority of the incessant squabbling to have taken place on this forum. In order for this or any other forum to be a democracy, there has to be some detailed definition of purpose and character that prohibits outside influences from infiltrating and undermining that purpose. It is the absence of such a detailed definition being enforced that has resulted in the continuing chaos.


If the forum is indeed engaged in a fraudulent acceptance of donations for OWS, it's a legal matter that should be prosecuted. Is it?

[Deleted]

[-] 3 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

why are you so "destructive" ?

if you are a leader... lead ....

you will not get anywhere ... attacking .... especially attacking members here ... we ~Are The 99% ~ We Want Everyone's Ideas !!! ~ And ~~ We Support Everyone's Ideas ~ Including yours~~~

however you have very few Ideas ~ aside from who is wrong ~ with any specifics omitted ~ and Why YOU are the chosen one ~

can you not join us... in equality ... after All These Years ???

[Deleted]

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

yep ... I'm a hippy... and wayyy happier than you

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

human interaction

2 minute timer

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Stinkle.

You are an individual - not the whole forum community - I don't care how many socks you run at one time - you are still - only - one - single - individual.

[-] 5 points by trashyharry (3082) from Waterville, NY 3 years ago

I would like to take this opportunity to say-Greetings to you,Jart.For many years I lived only a few blocks away from where you are said to reside right now.Often and oftener I wish I lived there still,on 11th & Avenue B.It was not meant to be...This forum has been very helpful to me and others,far flung as we are.The up and downvoting I have never used.Only just now is it dawning on me that this may be damaging to the functioning of the forum.I sometimes don't understand my points-they seem not to make sense.Perhaps it is only fair to give people the whom I cannot respond a way to take a shot at me anyhow.The only way I would stop returning here is if I was sure I was harming the forum in some way,or unable to make a worthwhile contribution.I have difficulty understanding why people who dislike the forum for some reason or reasons don't start their own forum and run it in such a way as pleases them.It isn't against the law...yet.

[Deleted]

[-] 4 points by trashyharry (3082) from Waterville, NY 3 years ago

Yes-you are right.I actually did not think anybody should use the actual Occupy name.It seems to me a name could be come up with that would cause it to appear along with Occupy upon submission to The Google Machine.Or a new organization could be formed and the people could seek from Occupy an associated organization status.That seems to be getting far afield.I don't know what to suggest.I have my area of expertise.Outside of that I start getting confused rather quickly! LOL!

[-] 4 points by turbocharger (1756) 3 years ago

A few thoughts;

Forums are always verbal gutters, its tough to get things to the point of civility, especially when the goal is national political/social change.

My biggest concern was attempting to make sure that when people check out occupy, they can find good, current and deeper than usual information. Which is why I really liked those guest author pieces.

The problem, imo, is that if those articles are promoted, and people come to check them out, then they end up seeing the other nonsense, and hence will be turned off all together.

We all believe in not just change, but our ability to create it, which is why we all support ows.

So with that being said, in the bigger picture, how about this question:

What scheme/platform (not just the forum, but the entire site) would give this site teh biggest "bang per buck"?

[-] 6 points by Renneye (3874) 3 years ago

This is excellent thinking, TC. Looking ahead is a necessity at this point, given that all indications show that OWS is going long-term.

We had better understand that if OWS/this forum doesn't adapt to the changing nature of this revolution, it/we will stagnate. Your questions are not only valid, but very forward thinking.

I feel that including carefully vetted like-minded and shining examples of socially responsible organization banners at the top of this page would be great in showing visitors that Occupy really is instrumental in creating the social change it so strongly advocates. Getting other organizations involved with this site will create a far more interesting tapestry and ground OWS as the hub of current global social progress. These organizations could pay a fee to be involved with OWS, and those funds be used to grow the OWS ethical 'brand'.

I'd also love for this forum/OWS to become a larger co-operative with a global reach...providing ethical, dignified jobs.

OWS should, in my humble opinion, be run like an ethical corporation. A worker owned co-operative.

There's no limit to what could be achieved with products and services, while simultaneously obliterating Modern Day Slavery.

The sky's the limit. Who knows...maybe even larger Occupy cities, humane and sustainable.

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

major problem with ads is design and memory space

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

the appended reply platform is very good

maybe load the page folding in all the appending discussions while featuring the direct response to the subject

[-] 4 points by corsali (47) 3 years ago

I'm probably biased since I have no points, but I would say that we should either do away with the point system altogether, or cancel the points out at the end of each day. Having the point system intimidates new posters, I think.

[-] 3 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

Something else that would be of great value for the forum would be a 'Block Communication' option for members to block the user names of trolling individuals from replying or sending private messages to them. This would prevent a lot of the unnecessary personal attacks and squabbling on the forum while greatly restricting the opportunities of those disingenuous individuals who would seek to infect/disrupt the forum.

[-] 4 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

'PM Block Option' ?! Great idea, Leo !! Nice to see you back posting and my 'twinkle' gets you to -1 but the fact that you were -2 at the time of my reply - says that you hit on a nerve here !!! Solidarity & a wee link for perusal and outrage :

multum in parvo ...

[-] 4 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

I would also add that if the point system is kept, if a 'Block Communication' option is added, the person blocked should no longer be able to up or down vote the person who has blocked them and the person who has blocked them should no longer be able to up or down vote the person they've blocked.

[-] 3 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

This is all getting complex now but I do get what you say. Of course there is the argument for minimum intervention and change and recipients of unwanted or unsolicited PM's just exercising their judgement by 'deleting and not reading or replying' - although that is a bit like ''the jury shall disregard the previous statement'' lol. One of the real issues is how to deal with cretins like the one below so I'll show you my technique & also leave this here, fyi from a more 99% p-o-v :

ad iudicium ...

[Deleted]

[-] 4 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

You are like most people on this site, just replying to the user, never to the actual comments.

most users on this site address posts and issues

[-] 4 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

The jokes on you Trashy-Troll-BoT & wtf gives you the impression that I know, remember or care about what you did or did not once 'brain-fart' ?!!! Even a 'broken clock' gets to be right twice a day but that still doesn't stop making them useless, does it ?!! Everyone can 'moderate' this place by their own words & actions here so how about I 'moderate' your ass with the tip of my boot ?! However, I'm not all 'sTick' so here's a 'carroT' too & maybe you can glean something useful from it, altho' of course you'll look for the worst bits for furTher ways to subvert this forum but The agon rolls on :

temet nosce ...

[Deleted]

[-] 6 points by ShadzSixtySix (1936) 3 years ago

Yep, you're anoTher piece of shit who's out of control on this forum - but hey, what's new huh, lol ?!!! I only have limited time to read anything here - so resT assured your b-s - is waaay down the list of my priorities !! Nobody here likes talking about 9/!! as much as you Trashy ! But now here is something a bit tangential but nevertheless interesting and pertinent to The 99% fyi :

So, re. 9/!! - have you seen the 1994 US Geological Survey aerial photo of the scar on the ground over the old mine workings in Shanksville, PA - where UA93 'crashed' ? Or do you still stick to the 'Official Conspiracy Theory' ?!

e tenebris, lux ?

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (22780) 3 years ago

I don't think points or stinkles/twinkles have been the problem here. I think the problem was moderators who abused their power and who did not have the interests of Occupy at heart.

[-] -2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

I think the problem with the forum is many who have their own ego driven interest like the creation of political parties have abandoned the sprite of OWS to pursue their own self serving interest. Instead of addressing the real evil of the Koch brothers or the GOP voter suppression efforts they spend their time trying to pick off some disgruntled liberal to enlarge their personal ego driven political party. People caring more about themselves than the country, that's what Wall Street does, and when OWS tries to build political parties they are acting just like the people on Wall Street looking out for their own power regardless of what it does to the country, that's what Nader did in 2000 and it is what too many on this forum want to do again.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

so like you have been on the forum for two days, you consider that "long term"?

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

wow now that's a different answer, so you are someone who was banned, I wonder why? or maybe it's not that hard to see given your conflicting answers in just our first two interactions...

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

oh I don't know I see a number of people that have actually been here a long time, given all I've said during my time here I would think one would have to be a major asshole to get banned, were you a major asshole?

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

Ok here's a sample? of yours:

https://occupywallst.org/forum/search/?q=user%3Atimeforabigchange

and here's a sample of mine:

https://occupywallst.org/forum/search/?q=user%3Afactsrfun

I looked at yours but didn't see those "important issues" of which you speak, but here are a few of mine if you don't want to look at the whole list, it is only a partial but still quite long.....

here's one:

https://occupywallst.org/forum/americas-monarchs/

how did you like this one?

https://occupywallst.org/forum/thomas-jeffersons-top-10-quotes-on-money-and-banki/

or given the marches today maybe this one is better:

https://occupywallst.org/forum/wind-tidal-geo-thermal-we-all-know-its-solar-dont-/

anyway I could go on and on....how about you?

[Deleted]

[-] 3 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

So you have been on the site like two days and yet seem to know so much, how do you do it?

[Deleted]

[-] 2 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

Yet I'm pretty sure DK nor shooz has even been a mod in the past two days, are you sure you aren't one of those that have been asked to leave but just refuses to?

(talk about simple minded...)

[Deleted]

[-] 3 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

I think anybody should be allowed to start a forum or throw a party but if one is asked to leave because your input is destructive and yet those people refuse to leave then yes the forum suffers, just as when OWS enters a bank lobby and are asked to leave but don't the reason they don't leave is because disrupting the bank's activity is the desired result, this is also true on the forum, of course people have a right to stay and disrupt the activities of OWS after they have been asked to leave, but it is good for those of us who are supporters to know that those that keep coming back are here to disrupt OWS not to help it.

[Deleted]

[-] 3 points by flip (7101) 3 years ago

that little facts boy is a waste of time - you did a very nice job here - we need more of this

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

oh flip and I thought you didn't care... I am so touch, and here I had completely forgotten about you

[-] 3 points by flip (7101) 3 years ago

you are touched - we agree

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

how did I know you would go there? you are such a fish flip......

[-] 1 points by flip (7101) 3 years ago

Nice try. Did I see you today at the climate march. There was some sad sack with a "never vote republican" sign. Got no traction even from the old hippies. The youngsters were polite but snickered behind his back

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

maybe after you've been here more than a couple of days, more will be reveled, but so far all you have done is complain:

https://occupywallst.org/forum/jart-dkatoday-lets-have-a-serious-adult-debate-not/

[-] -1 points by 99nproud (2697) 3 years ago

Yes sir officer

[-] 3 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

this post is not from Jart... there is no prose here

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

ok... been trying to figure way to limit the trolling, bot use and multiple account use ....

at this point ... aside from using a downloadable plugin ... or forcing user to download a file... I'm sure it is not possible using code with the current protocols ...

however... I think I have pretty good alternative work around ....

using cookies and/or html5 local storage ... we can identify a user (or many users) registered and/or logged in on a per browser basis ...

we also can using the server storage... keep track of how many different browsers an individual user uses...

so lets say we use this info as a way to flag the user .... and display it along side their name if we consider them abusive ... ie

username (uses 9 different browsers ~ and has registered 30 different accounts)

:)

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

probably a good idea

they had to ban me from vampirefreaks when I refused the title they tagged me with

"I write like this because I'm retarded"

[-] 2 points by grapes (5014) 3 years ago

We may benefit from a judiciary process and creating a pop-up area posting a event calendar and a docket of proposed forum feature changes, accusations of sock puppets, etc.

The calendar should show at what time public comment periods expire and the judiciary team meets to review comments, decide on deferrals or actions to be taken, issue meeting minutes and request jart to take actions blessed by the team. The team can perhaps commit to meeting every Saturday night at 9 p.m. or some other time.

[-] 2 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

people who like me respond

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

hey !! hehe :)

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

at second thought.... maybe a good experiment !!! ... to uncover thrashy and all his fake names ...

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

I thought it showed real possibility in that way - I mean jart can see such now if she cares to look or has the time to look - but currently no-one else can look and see the origin of odd voting patterns.

[+] -4 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

Just ask and I will tell you.

[-] 1 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

ok.... what are thrashy's fake names ? :)

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

did the simpson and family guy loss their writers ?

[-] 1 points by grapes (5014) 3 years ago

Do you still remember the one-person-one-voice principle in the foundation of democracy? Do you like how wealth of many dollars owns many voices in our post-Citizens-United political system? The Golden Rule says that you apply the same principle here on this forum and refrain from using sock puppets. If you cannot do that, you have absolutely no right to request the wealthy to refrain from corrupting our governments.

You can have the freedom of expression through one and only one username because freedom only exists within the confine of restraints observed by the community of freedom exercisers. If you do not observe the restraints, you do not belong.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by grapes (5014) 3 years ago

The wealthy person does not participate politically with more than one vote so that means the principle is adhered to?

Using multiple names are permissible in this forum as long as you have requested jart and received approval for the reasons why you need them. If the community comes to the suspicion that your multi-user name privilege is being abused, it can petition jart to review the alleged abuse and take appropriate actions. This IS a jartocracy as Thrasymaque (you) calls it but a supreme power in service to the freedom of the community is in fact a better servant. The "sword of justice" needs to be sharp.

Why do you think OWS encouraged the choice of anonymity? It is not for the creation of sock puppets.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

people are afraid to use their name

[-] 3 points by grapes (5014) 3 years ago

Yes, that is definitely a good reason for a resistance movement. There are other reasons, too. For example, there may be leakers who cannot speak frankly without anonymity if they need to keep their real and online identities separate.

In mindspace, freedom of expression allows mutual exploration of ridiculous or outrageous ideas without real-world consequences. Eliminating that hampers the peoples' abilities to envisage scenarios so as to prevent the bad ones from happening. Any community that prohibits ruminating bad scenarios will likely get them sooner or later and usually too late.

[-] -2 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

If the community comes to the suspicion that your multi-user name privilege is being abused, it can petition jart to review the alleged abuse and take appropriate actions.

Indeed I agree, so why complain to me?

If you find anything particularly wrong with my use of the forum, please send a complaint to jart. She has an email address setup just for that.

Why do you think OWS encouraged the choice of anonymity? It is not for the creation of sock puppets.

What do you even call sock puppets? I only have one user.

[-] 1 points by MattHolck0 (3867) 3 years ago

why write under 3 names ?

is that the only way to get paid ?

[Removed]

[Deleted]

[-] 2 points by grapes (5014) 3 years ago

I am mostly an omnivore of ideas and I ruminate, largely independent of the originator's identity. Usernames help people peg their minds on so productive social interactions can take place. It is unnecessary for bolstering any idea's merits but it helps the characterization of the temperament of the originator. As you have probably experienced already, "fuk"ing with the wrong person can cause flame wars. As a multi-flame-war veteran, you should try to understand why so many other users hate you. I believe that it is your interaction patterns, not your ideas.

By the way, I remember that you really love combating conspiracy theories, I think you can help out A LOT with dispelling conspiracy theories running amok in West Africa's Ebola hot zone.

[-] -2 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

The problem is people here take things personally. It makes it impossible to debate ideas. People only care about proposers. It's a sign of low intellect.

[-] 2 points by corsali (47) 3 years ago

Being more circumspect in your banning is a good idea. We are dealing with subjects that people feel very strongly about, hence a poster should not be banned for a single indiscretion, or even a few over time. Rather he should be forced to take a time out of say 1-5 days with a non-groveling automatic reinstatement. Goading a poster should also be taken under consideration.

When things are heating up between two posters, the moderator should take a proactive approach and tell both to cool it.

Any poster who repeatedly maliciously maligns posters on here should be considered for a permanent ban.

As Leo.. suggested, and I too believe "a triad of moderators such as Renneye, Shadz66 and flip would be a good idea. And there should be a concensus between them when permanent bans are being considered.

Finally, it is my feeling that no one speaks better for our cause than shadz66. He deserves to get his 20,000 pts returned to him if we are going to keep the point system,

[-] 2 points by StillModestCapitalist (343) 3 years ago

I think the site would be more productive without twinkles or stinkles.

[-] 1 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

Shadz has simplest fix regarding points .... get rid of the negative points ,,,

negative points have been problem for many sites ... they are what brought down the OmidyarNetwork in '07 .... the neg points became a weapon ... organized by members to attack others... what a mess !!

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

jart you really ought to respond to crap like the following:

[-] 0 points by timeforabigchange (9) from Winnipeg, MB 4 minutes ago

Jart no longer espouses OWS ideology. She never really did. That's why this forum was always badly moderated, censored, etc... and why the NYCGA stopped considering this an official OWS forum. Jart believes in autocracy, not in democracy. She follows the thinking of Mencius Moldbug.

I have no idea why a purported occupier who says he cares about direct democracy would support someone like jart or Mencius Moldbug. Either you don't see what's going on, you're just dumb, or you are trolling.

http://www.thebaffler.com/blog/mouthbreathing-machiavellis/ ↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Just because you are so full of shit - I will bite - this once.

See what you can do with it.

I believe we should strive for true democracy.

You believe that we should strive for true democracy on this forum.

How does that work? How do you guarantee one individual ( not ten thousand iterations of an individual ) and so only one vote ( not ten thousand votes by the iterations of one individual ) ?

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You can ignore whoever you want to ignore right now!

It is called not making comments to them or responding to comments they make to you.

And- So - again:

You have not come up with a feasible way to guarantee = one user one vote. What you did say - is that you are fine with cheating ( figures as that "is" how you operate ) - SO - currently you do not have a way for a properly functioning direct democracy.

Do try not to get ahead of yourself - Hey?

[Deleted]

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

No banning. No censoring.

& U running a thousand socks 2 push ur agendas.

Like I said - before - over and over and over and over and over and over and . . . . . . .

U burnt ur bridges long long long ago. There is no place 4 u here.

So go start ur utopia and invite all to go there.

But u are not - and - will not - ever - B welcome here.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

U have no credit - no credibility - I have nothing but derision 4 u.

offer up a way 2 ban U that would stick - and maybe then u could earn some credit 4 a trial run with jart. In doing this u might even show the way towards setting up a forum "direct democracy" - but - U would have 2 B willing 2 sacrifice ur access to the site - but HEY - just think of what u would have accomplished.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You said you wanted to discuss issues seriously.

That was u - remember? https://occupywallst.org/forum/jart-dkatoday-lets-have-a-serious-adult-debate-not/

So far u have offered nothing.

So as u r a rock head.

It bears repeating:

U have no credit - no credibility - I have nothing but derision 4 u.

offer up a way 2 ban U that would stick - and maybe then u could earn some credit 4 a trial run with jart. In doing this u might even show the way towards setting up a forum "direct democracy" - but - U would have 2 B willing 2 sacrifice ur access to the site - but HEY - just think of what u would have accomplished.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

I said that you should have a conversation with jart. Debating was your idea. And on that idea I asked you a simple one part of your list question - a question which you have failed to answer = how do you propose to initiate a direct democracy on the forum - one of the basic needs of which would be = guaranteeing that a single user was in fact a single user and not an iteration - or one of thousands of iterations.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

U have offered nothing.

If u had - this conversation ( such as it is ) would not be stuck in the starting blocks.

jart may or may not debate with u.

So far u really haven't shown me why she would.

offer up a detailed direct democracy plan - that means including how one guarantees that individuals are just that "individuals" and are not a bunch of socks.

Show us all that u actually have something 2 offer - other than ur rhetoric.

[Deleted]

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

you do nothing but destroy online communities

at least u got part of ur comment correct - though u didn't mean 4 it 2 b a commentary on urself - did ya.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You have not come up with a feasible way to guarantee = one user one vote. What you did say - is that you are fine with cheating ( figures as that "is" how you operate ) - SO - currently you do not have a way for a properly functioning direct democracy.

Do try not to get ahead of yourself - Hey?

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

We currently have a system of single votes per single user.

What we don't have is a way to guarantee a single user and not some ten thousand iterations of that single user.

So back to square one:

You have not come up with a feasible way to guarantee = one user one vote. What you did say - is that you are fine with cheating ( figures as that "is" how you operate ) - SO - currently you do not have a way for a properly functioning direct democracy.

Do try not to get ahead of yourself - Hey?

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You have not come up with a feasible way to guarantee = one user one vote. What you did say - is that you are fine with cheating ( figures as that "is" how you operate ) - SO - currently you do not have a way for a properly functioning direct democracy.

Do try not to get ahead of yourself - Hey?

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

And so I will repeat:

U have no credit - no credibility - I have nothing but derision 4 u.

offer up a way 2 ban U that would stick - and maybe then u could earn some credit 4 a trial run with jart. In doing this u might even show the way towards setting up a forum "direct democracy" - but - U would have 2 B willing 2 sacrifice ur access to the site - but HEY - just think of what u would have accomplished for the forum and OWS.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

So u r saying that u r a serial spammer that has been spamming the same BS 4 almost 3 years now. Is that it? As ur BS has not changed - u r still the very same disingenuous individual u were from the very beginning.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Jart it's been nine days since you created this post. Do you have any comments or thoughts to share at this point in time?

[-] 0 points by timeforabigchange (-43) from Winnipeg, MB 3 years ago

She doesn't care about you, any of us, or OWS. Are you going to realize that one day?

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

utopian Ignore Button "is" on.

[-] 0 points by LeoYo (5909) 3 years ago

So, to summarize my suggestions:

  1. Some kind of schedule for a regular checking up on the forum.

  2. A triad of non-partisan moderators.

  3. A 'Block Communications' option.

  4. No twinkles/stinkles.

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

Give a tally of total coments each poster has made as well as their "karma" based on up-down votes, and yes the hover would be good as well,

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

[ edit ] That's an interesting thought = total coments each poster has made

As that would go to show a total amount of activity ( comments )

How about including a separate listing for total number of up votes ( likes ) and total number of down votes ( dis-likes )

These could also indicate weird voting ( socks and bots ) activity.

edit -> Total number of posts created per individual?

[-] 1 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

the best answer ..., is to make points a currency... (ie ... something of value )....

if the point giving is a way for us to bookmark a post... then... after a while ..we will only give points to that we really want to bookmark .... else our bookmarks become cluttered w/ garbage....

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

I am thinking - that - a participant would like to have longevity - and I figured that that was what jart had in mind ( sort of ) when she made a karma score. In that the longer you are here and the more comments and post you make the larger your total is.

Now taking it a bit differently and showing just activity total rather than a like or dis-like total - would remove a voting bias.

Longevity coupled with activity - I think could go towards currency - or value - as it relates to the individuals time here and how that time has been used = passive ( reading ) or active ( comments and posts ). Would give the curious something to look at to see somewhat of any individuals time or activity here.

Another breakdown could be - a link to the users name that shows every post ever created by that user - something to be added to the archive. Perhaps like the comments page - that lists all of the comments as they are made - a link that would pull by user every comment ever made and the post it was made in - see -> Comments.

[-] 1 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

well... I agree ... member totals could be better served with # of posts and/or # of threads started... or both... ie ..user name(200 threads/500 comments) ...

to me... what I am really interested in ... is the BEST posts... ie... what posts most members like... and what posts should new members visit to get Best of the site

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

what I am really interested in ... is the BEST posts

Following this thought. What if posts were separated into categories?

Political

Environmental

Financial

Etc

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

to me... what I am really interested in ... is the BEST posts... ie... what posts most members like... and what posts should new members visit to get Best of the site

OK - but that gets into the popularity thing again - and who is being honest with their votes and who is manipulating the system with em.

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

not ..if spending points... costs... ie clutters our bookmarks.... but that also means we need mechanism to search what we have given points to

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Voting histories - should/could (?) dovetail into the archiving of posts and comments.

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

hmmm... archiving .. or bookmarking ??? ...archiving is all posts... bkmarking is what we want to later find or share ... make sense ?

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

One can always bookmark a post - don't even need a function placed on the forum. But I suppose that the forum could keep itself a public accessible listing of the most popular posts ever submitted on the site. Is that what you were looking for? Or am I missing the point ( quite possible ).

[-] 1 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

I have thousands of bkmrks in my browser/s... ,,,, it's easier for me to google search for old content than it is to find the old bkmark.... so if sites allowed us to bkmark the site,,, then giving points would become valuable,,, further it allows us to share what we think is valuable

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

I am not at all sure how you want to do this - so maybe you might just wanna shoot it to jart for a confab? It would be through her that it would happen anyway. I love anything that would make the site more user friendly and accessible.

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

:) ... I'm just voicing my ideas... I think it might be difficult for OWS to implement now... considering we (the site) is 3 yrs into the game...

[Deleted]

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

when you become a true member and part of Occupy ... I'll converse with you ... until then I don't feed the trolls

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Well making suggestions for improvements is never a bad thing - and - an improvement can have a starting date that isn't retro-active - couldn't it ? - once established perhaps it could be worked out to include prior site history.

[-] 2 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

agree :)

[Deleted]

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

We ALL already know your ( continually ) stated opinion of me. That still does not speak to what others may or may not think/feel. As you are the eternal troll who has gotten booted from this site - literally thousands of times - and only a portion of those bootings came by way of me - and those were after you had established yourself as a forum and user attacker - and - as a user of bots and socks to do so.

[Deleted]

[Deleted]

[Deleted]

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Didn't think you cared about what was or was not acceptable to do on a forum - almost three years of your BS attacks on users and on the forum itself not to mention your continuous use of multitudes of socks - would seem to support that notion - besides I thought you might enjoy a change of pace from your usual self flagellation - besides - I wasn't suggesting that you post yourself in the act - believe me when I say - that - no-one would want to see you.

[Deleted]

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

There ya go - bring up your dark side - this like everything else - is different for you - Right? You are the moral ethical and all things OWS judge - RIGHT ? As it seems that according to you - you are the only one who should be allowed to say or do whatever you want = Here.

I will remind you ( as you seem to have no short term - let alone a long term - memory ) that you started this crap 1st - and every time you have - you have come out the major loser in each encounter.

[Deleted]

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

unlike you I never banned anyone here.

BS - it was you who hacked the system a few weeks ago and disabled my account along with other accounts - and BTW - you have never had a serious conversation.

When did I draw 1st blood? Today? I don't think so - no I let you run off at the mouth for quite awhile with all of your jartocracy BS - before I even began to spank you.

[Deleted]

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Points are for suckers!

Says the perpetual hole digger - who's average longevity can be measured in minutes.

Do you really need the approbation or disproval of others to make up your own mind?

Nope - never have - never will.

[Deleted]

[-] -2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You are a fiction as are all of the things you say you contribute. Your only contribution is to the oposition - in that your efforts here have always been to distract and sow dissension/discord.

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (8783) from Phoenix, AZ 3 years ago

Posts and comments would be good so people would know who is active I think showing the up/down voters would do this as well sort of, I think comments should be "rated" according to how many "votes" they generate to indicate the interest in the comment, make it harder for trolls to suppress good ideals.

But then I think people in the park should actually care what people say on the forum, I suspect they don't.....

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

jart?

since he seems incapable of addressing his comments/query's to you - but would rather spend his time in speculation and forwarding his speculations as to being your reasoning.

I will forward yet another comment that should have been addressed to you in the 1st place:

[-] 0 points by timeforabigchange (9) from Winnipeg, MB 0 minutes ago

The problem is that this forum uses the OWS name and accepts donations under that name. As such, the forum should follow OWS principles like direct democracy, etc... It's only fair to those who donate money. They donate to OWS because they want to support OWS as a whole. I think this gives the right to other occupiers to complain about certain aspects of this forum.

I'm sure if one of them started their own forum and accepted OWS donations the founders of OWS would not be happy. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink

[Deleted]

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Have a conversation with jart and try not to be so disingenuous - by actually sticking to the statements you make about her all of the time - rather than say comments - like - it's all good jart it's your forum do whatever you want.

You smarmy bastard.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

jart? since he seems unable to ask you straight out himself:

[-] 0 points by timeforabigchange (9) from Winnipeg, MB 0 minutes ago

It's a way for jart to show she is doing something for the forum. However, we all know there are much more important things that could be done for the forum. She just doesn't want it to be a democratic place. She wants to keep control. So she makes people happy by offering them choice over stuff that does not matter at all like the point system. Ask her about voting rights for the news items, or for how moderation works, well, you can forget about that. ↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply permalink

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You would be the child here and a petulant one at that.

You can't address starting and having a discussion with jart to jart. No. Instead you talk about her and place your thoughts/words in her mouth.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Actually it is u who can not discuss - as - when you get your stupid mug shoved into the shit you spew ( with calm reasoning and not like this current comment ) - you then go on a rampage - this has been your method for well over two years now - you get spanked and then you go on a tear.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You and I have had a go round for almost three years now.

Lets see if you can have a discussion with jart.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You could have tried having a conversation with jart a long time ago. And even today - I - had to be the one to try to force the issue. So save your phony thank-yous as I am not buying.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

OH - one thing - if we can see who made an up or a down vote without their having left a comment in support for either vote. Can there be a tag link to send a comment back to that individual that would show up on the post's comment thread?

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

People? People. You are being asked for your input/thoughts. It is what many have been asking for the ability to do.

SO.

Why are you all silent?

Speak up!

[-] 7 points by Renneye (3874) 3 years ago

They will, DKA. It's Friday night. People are out. It's always slow on Friday nights. They'll weigh in when they get a chance.

As for me, I'm not really crazy about the idea, but I'm still mulling it over.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

They will

I know they will - I posed the question mainly because it would bug a certain UN-named individual who is always harping on about how it should open it's own forum - and never does.

[-] 3 points by BradB (2693) from Washington, DC 3 years ago

that's not Jart....it's ass hole dick head ... wanna be something dumbass ... plain to see

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

I don't think so. But I could be wrong.

1st - is the sign-up page working? As jart said she re-enabled it tonight.

Send her an e-mail and ask if she re-enabled the sign-up page - or if it was hacked open - that is - if it is open again.

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Daymn . . . . . that . . . that . . . that's just so obvious - huh - now why didn't I see that?

Perhaps people should acknowledge that - just - ya know - so that we aren't seen as being presumptuous - Hey?

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

You sound so very familiar.

R U the one who keeps saying that U should start Ur own forum - a forum of freedom and equality for all?

The one who wants to have as many socks as you like so that you can present and discuss and forward your ideas all by yourself?

I think U R

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Nope not me ( twinkle teamer ) - that would be the bots and socks user (s).

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

I find it funny that Ur 1st comment to jart was that she should do whatever it is that she wants as it is her forum. Where did all of your outraged arguments against jart - and as you call it her jartocracy disappear to?

U R just a bit disingenuous Rn't U.

[-] -1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

[ edit ] Sounds cool to me - could be useful in spotting socks/bots/trolls/etc

Here is another thought -> Since many (socks/bots/trolls/etc) complain about a karma point hierarchy. How about if a karma score "point total" was only able to be seen by the user themselves?

edit -> Still in all a karma point score total gives a sense to others of how long a person has been around. If you make point totals invisible except to each user being able to see their own - maybe the users sign-up date could be displayed instead?

[Deleted]

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

ooooooo U R just chock full of helpful insights.

[Deleted]

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33199) from Coon Rapids, MN 3 years ago

Why do you care so much about them?

Do I ?

It would seem that U R pretty wrapped up in the idea of them.

Why do you care what I think?

I am only one individual.

Can others express their own thoughts on the subject of this post?

Or are you gonna try to do the thinking and talking for everyone.

[-] -3 points by SerfingUSA (451) 3 years ago

OP: How would you guys feel if I modified the forum so that when you hover over a vote, it shows you the names of all the people who twinkled/stinkled a comment?

Yes, good idea. Or as Gus Fring would say, DO IT!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXJ-jaCrNcY