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Forum Post: DNC 2016 should be held somewhere else - not NYC

Posted 7 years ago on June 26, 2014, 12:32 p.m. EST by ThomasKent (131)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

There are reasons why New York should be disqualified from hosting the Democratic National Convention in 2016. New York has rested on its laurels as a center of egalitarian democratic ideals. Laurels earned when Franklin Roosevelt was in office. A review of New York political ideology for the last 2 decades shows a political landscape moving away from the order Roosevelt established.

A perpetual avalanche of Wall Street scandals have thwarted tighter regulation for securities and commodities trading. Wall St has opposed restoration of Glass-Steagall. Wall St seems to operate as an independent sovereign district, or at least has been allowed to despite Elliot Spitzer’s notable efforts to prosecute white-collar crime.

New York City has more millionaires living there than any other US city, yet New York City is not among the Forbes Top 10 Livable US Cities. New York City is ranked 7th in Business Week’s America’s 50 Best Cities. New York City is not in Areavibe.com’s Best Places to Live 2012. In 2011 over 700,000 millionaires lived in New York City, according to Business Insider. The population of New York City is 8 million. With one out of twelve New York City residents being a millionaire why isn’t the quality of life in New York City among the highest in the United States? People in New York City think it is. The math suggests that trickle down economics doesn’t materialize the way Reaganomics theorized. The millionaire’s money is not being used to raise the standard of living in New York City.

New York City hosted the Republican National Convention in 2004. How was it possible for the bluest of blue cities in a blue state to host the convention for the Republican Party after 9/11 terrorist attacks killed nearly 3,000 victims in 1 day? New York City is not the seat of democratic liberalism it claims to be. The record of incompetence of the Bush Administration should have been sufficient ground for impeachment. New York City, then still in ruins, supported Bush’s election to a second term. New York City also enabled Michael Bloomberg to sidestep two-term term limits to run for a third term as Mayor of New York City. So much for the rule of law in New York City during the past decade.

Any New York political leader could initiate a new investigation on the 9-11 attacks in light of new evidence that contradicts the 9-11 Commission Report. None of the Mayors, members of the Congressional delegation, or governors have taken action. How democratic is that?

Reports on school segregation in United States ranks New York as having the most segregated public schools in the nation. How democratic is that?

New York City occupies a special place in the American consciousness as the tumultuous seat of our financial markets and the buzzing capital of our culture. Most importantly, it’s the city that exemplifies American pluralism, the “melting pot” that attracts new immigrants looking for work and college graduates drawn from their hometowns by the promise of excitement and diversity. So, when it turns out that the melting pot has the most segregated schools in the country, as a new study reports, it suggests that something has gone very wrong in our approach to education.

New York’s appeal hangs on its diversity and its image as a city where everyone can try, get, and be anything. But the new UCLA’s Civil Rights Project report shows that the city’s vaunted cosmopolitanism masks sharp divisions within its schools.

Public housing in New York City is a disaster. New York City Housing Authority (NYCHA) has been a blight on public housing instead of being competent administrators. The average completion time for building repairs was 398 days. The backlog had 400,000 repair requests to complete. A worse public housing situation cannot be imagined. This is what a Republican ideologically leaning city government would be expected to do. The Mayor for the past 3 terms was Michael Bloomberg.

Michael Bloomberg had been a lifelong Democrat until the opportunity to run for the Mayor of New York on the Republican Party ticket. Multi-billionaire Michael Bloomberg, without any public administrative or political credentials, spent $70 million of his own money on his campaign and beat Democratic rival, the Public Advocate, Mark Green. How Democratic is that? Bloomberg transformed into a tyrant in successive elections. New Yorkers kept electing him over qualified Democratic contenders while Bloomberg out spent his Democratic rivals by using $70 - $100 million of his own money. Did New Yorkers believe Bloomberg was a Democrat in Republican clothing? Bloomberg could have run on the Democratic ticket at any time after his first election if he was still a Democrat at heart. New Yorkers can’t tell a Democrat from an oligarch flashing millions of dollars during the political campaign, even when running for reelection. New York City doesn’t have Democratic credibility after12 years of Bloomberg.

New York City estimates there are 500,000 undocumented immigrants in the city. This would raise a state of alarm in 45 of the United States. Apparently, New Yorkers do not recognize their own peril from having a large undocumented immigrant population.

New legislation is proposed where undocumented immigrants could become NY State citizens without being US Citizens. Undocumented immigrants in New York could become “state citizens” with a slew of benefits from driver’s licenses to voting rights under a bill that was introduced recently. Advocates are set to announce the measure that would allow immigrants who aren’t U.S. citizens to become New York State citizens if they can prove they’ve lived and paid taxes in the state for three years and pledge to uphold New York laws — regardless of whether they’re in the country legally. How democratic is that? Anyone who grew up in the United States would be astonished that such an idea would be even considered by any legislative forum in the United States. It would seem some politicians could be elected in New York State without understanding the oath sworn to support the Constitution of the United States, and the constitution of the State of New York. How would it be possible to be a citizen of New York and not a citizen of the United States?

“Obviously this is not something that’s going to pass immediately, but nothing as broad as this or as bold as this passes immediately,” said Sen. Gustavo Rivera (D-Bronx), the sponsor in the state Senate. This is a Democratic State Senator that doesn’t understand the US Constitution. Article Six, Clause 2 of the U.S. Constitution establishes the U.S. Constitution, federal statutes, and U.S. treaties as "the supreme law of the land". It provides that these are the highest form of law in the U.S. legal system, and mandates that all state judges must follow federal law when a conflict arises between federal law and either the state constitution or state law of any state.

The State Senator would work to pass legislation that provides a sanctuary within New York State for undocumented immigrants who have entered the United States illegally. Consume hours of debate among peers to rewrite New York State laws, possibly cause a future Constitutional crisis without considering the legal alternative and benefits of legal deportation. The undocumented immigrant status in New York exists because New York authorities allowed it to happen, did not enforce laws on hiring undocumented workers until it had become an unmanageable embarrassment. How democratic is that?

The Mayor and City Council are bound by the same obligation to support the US Constitution and Federal laws. The City Council move toward providing New York City IDs for undocumented immigrants seems unconstitutional since the undocumented immigrants are here illegally. This is something immigration authorities should enforce: legal deportation.

New York City’s civil rights record is tarnished by NYPD stop and frisk controversy. The nation's largest police department illegally and systematically singled out large numbers of blacks and Hispanics under its controversial stop-and-frisk policy, a federal judge ruled in 2013 while appointing an independent monitor to oversee major changes, including body cameras on some officers.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg said he would appeal the ruling, which was a stinging rebuke to a policy he and the New York Police Department have defended as a life-saving, crime-fighting tool that helped lead the city to historic crime lows. The legal outcome could affect how and whether other cities employ the tactic.

"The city's highest officials have turned a blind eye to the evidence that officers are conducting stops in a racially discriminatory manner," U.S. District Judge Shira Scheindlin wrote in her ruling. "In their zeal to defend a policy that they believe to be effective, they have willfully ignored overwhelming proof that the policy of targeting `the right people' is racially discriminatory."

Stop-and-frisk has been around for decades in some form, but recorded stops increased dramatically under the Bloomberg administration to an all-time high in 2011 of 684,330, mostly of black and Hispanic men. The lawsuit was filed in 2004 by four men, all minorities, and became a class-action case. How democratic is that?

What might be harder to measure is the impact NYPD and the Mayor’s leadership advocating preemption of civil rights for minority men in favor of stop-and-frisk has infected the general public perception of minority men and general respect for civil rights. The infection has spread beyond stop-and-frisk to antagonism against exercise of First Amendment Rights resulting in more class action law suits against New York City. A climate was created where individual civil rights are under attack.

Is there any city that has done more to support equality, affordable housing, full employment, quality public education, uphold Democratic and Constitutional principles?



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[-] 5 points by trashyharry (3084) from Waterville, NY 7 years ago

The Elites are afraid of the People.That's why their choices of where to convene are limited.Security consultants have advised them on which American cities can produce large numbers of police-armies,really-and deploy them in such a way that no wealthy,corrupt,pampered person attending the convention need be concerned that increasingly impoverished and bitter civilians will in some way interfere with their serenity.Also,local taxpayers are required to subsidize these Elite Conclaves to the tune of tens of millions.Not all localities are able to squeeze that kind of money out of their citizens.So the choices are limited to just a few large cities.

[-] 2 points by Crackpot (53) 7 years ago

The Elites should be afraid of the NYPD. Eric Garner’s death places the reputation of NYPD on the table and on the world’s stage and in the national spotlight.

The Rev. Al Sharpton arrived at Eric Garner’s funeral shortly after it began and announced both outside and in a fiery address from the pulpit that on Friday he, Mr. Garner’s family and their lawyers would meet with representatives from the United States attorney’s office for the Eastern District of New York to ask for a federal civil rights investigation into his death.

Mayor Bill de Blasio, whose campaign was built around his pledge to end the police tactic known as stop and frisk, delayed a vacation by a day and said there would be a thorough investigation. On Tuesday, Police Commissioner William J. Bratton announced that he was ordering a sweeping review of the department’s training and tactics. Letitia James, the city’s public advocate, was among the city officials at the funeral.

In the video of the arrest, Officer Daniel Pantaleo was shown wrapping his arm around the neck of Mr. Garner, who was on a Staten Island street corner, arguing with the police and objecting to being arrested.

The department has banned the use of chokeholds since 1993. In 1994, a Bronx man was killed by an officer using the grip.

Despite the ban, complaints of officers’ using chokeholds have steadily come before the Civilian Complaint Review Board. From 2009 to 2013, the board received 1,022 such complaints.

The police said Wednesday that Internal Affairs detectives were investigating an arrest on July 14, captured on cellphone video, in which an officer appears to use a chokehold to restrain a 22-year-old man seen skipping the fare in the 125th Street and Lexington Avenue subway station.

Last Thursday, after Officer Pantaleo grabbed hold of Mr. Garner, the two men tumbled to the ground as several other officers swarmed on top of them. Mr. Garner was heard on the video saying that he could not breathe.

The two emergency medical technicians and the two paramedics who responded to Mr. Garner, and appeared to be moving without urgency, have been suspended without pay.

Mourners Demand Justice for Eric Garner


The initial police report on the fatal arrest of Eric Garner in Staten Island last week makes no mention of a chokehold and downplayed the seriousness of Garner's condition, raising questions about how the investigation would have been conducted had graphic video of Garner's death not surfaced. Sgt. Dhanan Saminath also told interviewers that once Garner was in handcuffs "he did not appear to be in great distress," according to a copy of the report obtained by the Daily News.

Another officer at the scene, Sgt. Kizzy Adonis, told investigators that while she “believed she heard the perpetrator state that he was having difficulty breathing,” she believed "the perpetrator’s condition did not seem serious and that he did not appear to get worse." Garner went into cardiac arrest while lying face down on the sidewalk in handcuffs and was pronounced DOA at Richmond University Medical Center.

Chokehold Downplayed


Calling it "a modern-day lynching," the president of the Staten Island branch of the NAACP said the death of Eric Garner has outraged people nationwide and has been a topic of speeches and discussions at the organization's convention in Las Vegas. "It's a big issue at the NAACP convention," said Ed Josey, president of the Staten Island branch of the National Association for the Advancement of Colored People (NAACP) in a phone interview with the Advance from the convention. "You might say the repercussions of this incident have gone nationwide."

"I'm calling it a modern-day lynching because the man did nothing wrong," Josey said of Garner.

Josey called for a thorough investigation by the city Police Department and the Richmond County District Attorney's Office with disciplinary action and charges as appropriate.

In light of Garner's death following an altercation with police, Commissioner William Bratton announced that all officers in the NYPD will undergo retraining.

Reaction to Eric Garner's Death


[-] 1 points by trashyharry (3084) from Waterville, NY 7 years ago

The NYPD officers are not behaving in a rational manner.How in the world could they possibly even contemplate taking actual police action against a person selling loosies on the street? When I lived in NY during the 80's such an infraction would be beneath the notice of the cops-other than possibly yelling at the person to go away.There is nothing else to the story than that-the dude had no gun,the cops had no knowledge of any past violent behavior-the whole thing is baffling and scary,especially for people who can expect to be in contact with street patrol cops.



[-] 2 points by Nevada1 (5843) 7 years ago

"The Elites are afraid of the People"--------It did not have to be this way, it was their choice. Also, the richer people are, the more they enjoy a Free Lunch.

[-] 7 points by shadz66 (19985) 7 years ago

"The Elites are afraid of the People" !!! Bingo Nevada1 !! Solidarity, m8 !

I do love the idea of The DNC being in NYC & time for OWS to wakeTF up !!

No doubt paramilitary policing will occur & NYPD = Not Your Police Dept. !!!

respice, adspice, prospice ...

[-] 1 points by sharonkeys (9) from Queens, NY 7 years ago

I wish you would whisper the names of the Elites in my hear.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (19985) 7 years ago

Weirdo !!! + From Staten Island & re. NYPD :

mul-T-um in parvo ...

[-] -2 points by sharonkeys (9) from Queens, NY 7 years ago

You don't need much to call someone a weirdo. Strangely, your conservative and normative attitude turns me on. Like a strict 50s teacher offended by the smallest deviations from the norm. Keep me after class.

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Let me help a little here but names are taboo - remember the Venetian masquerade parties with masks - decorum matters. Manhattan is the borough with the most Elites. They love nice views and conveniences, preferably provided by Nature or on the Public Dime.

Umm, how low can you go and how high can you get them? In Manhattan, the lower (multiple meanings here) the better and the higher (again, understanding Cubism helps) the better. Berlusconi and Strauss-Kahn both had actions and inklings that could guide you. They certainly qualify to swim with the Eelites in our midst.

I have started to wonder if a first gentleman's club will open up for business at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue eventually.



[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

It may very well be possible to be a citizen of New York and NOT a citizen of the U.S. because the federal government failed to secure the borders. On the immigration front, the U.S. IS a FAILED STATE so as such the various individual states have the rights and in fact the duty to deal with the immigration issue as best they can or see fit.

The history of the U.S. had precedents having state laws binding on people within the state WITHOUT them being citizens of the U.S. As long as the illegal immigrants use New York State driving licenses, library cards, etc. only within New York City, the federal government has NO business sticking its nose in there unless federal dollars are involved.

NYC has such wealth disparity precisely because the hundreds of thousands of millionaires help out with funding the city and far beyond its borders (especially the poor Republican States of America), somewhat grudgingly but tolerated nonetheless as just a cost of doing business. There are legacy rent control laws, affordable housing ordinances, and subsidies that provide poorer folks with affordable housing. It is this kind of symbiosis that allows NYC's diversity as well as wealth disparity to persist and widen. Anyone who dislikes NYC can move away because there is NO fence around it and no one needs "papers" to do so. Some folks can tolerate cheek-by-jowl brushing-by's of all the rich and poor people. Others do not. Yes, NYC is indeed noisy, crowded, disparate, etc. but one can also interpret the noise to be the "energy," the crowd to be the "opportunity," and the disparate to be the "freedom to be all one wants to be." To each according to their needs.

Okay, I admit that the rich do have their "decompression chambers" elsewhere that the poorer folks may not have access to but that is just a consequence of "money affords freedom" in our economic system.

National Conventions of both parties are mostly just really big parties funded with federal election money you taxpayers checked off on your 1040s. I like parties, don't you?

[-] 1 points by Crackpot (53) 7 years ago

It’s not too late to save the situation. If the United States is a failed state then the Western Hemisphere is a failed hemisphere. What the USA must do is tell the member states of OAS to stand up and act like sovereign States instead of lost colonies. The colonial period ended in the19th century.

The average taxpayer, you or I cannot be held responsible for runaway mobs that enter our country illegally. If they were born in the Western Hemisphere they came from member states of OAS and their diplomatic missions should prefer to repatriate them rather than have them go to an American jail and clog our judicial system, presuming members nations of OAS are our friends.

Israel receives more US Foreign Aid then any other country. What does Israel do? Israel fails to negotiate a peace treaty with Palestinians. If none of Israeli leaders can broker a lasting peace with the Palestinians then Israel will join the ranks of failed statehood.

The US gives away billions of dollars in foreign aid to Latin America. The OAS should solve this mass migration crisis without asking the USA to pay for it first.

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Isn't it ironic that there are so many countries and institutions whose citizens and members detest U.S. involvement still dare pointing to the U.S. as not having done enough?

All the matter with the U.S. is just an involvenent fatigue and staring at our navel lint. Yep, we are paralyzed and our navel is dirty but the U.S. is now only a strong sibling, not the authoritarian parent anymore. Have at it till the U.S. can bear no more. There are at least one hundred fifty countries which can and should do more for their corner of the globe so have a go at it like what the Dutch learnt with EU sanctions against Russia and flight MH17.

[-] 1 points by ThomasKent (131) 7 years ago

National Conventions just being big parties is probably the fault of network television attempts to make boring political procedure interesting for the viewers. The history of political convention is a record of surprising developments needed by a growing nation.

From 1796 to 1824, candidates for presidential elections were chosen by congressional caucuses -- that is, the members of Congress for a given party gathered together and decided whom to nominate for the presidential election. The electoral college system was then used to choose the president from among the candidates.

The caucus system began to break down because the American people felt that it took too much power out of their hands. In 1816 and 1820, they were right. The Federalist Party had collapsed, leaving only one political party -- the Democratic-Republican Party (this party is not related in any way to the Democrats and Republicans of today). As a result, whoever was nominated by the Democratic-Republican caucus would be guaranteed to win the presidency. James Monroe won in 1816, and was similarly unopposed in 1820. Americans protested the caucus system around the nation.

That period of single-party rule not only led to political conventions, but also created the feeling that a two-party system was crucial to American politics. During the transition period, after the death of caucuses but before conventions were instituted, state legislatures nominated presidential candidates.

The first political convention was held by a third party, the Anti-Mason Party, in 1831. Soon after, the National Republicans and the Democrats also began holding conventions. In these early days, the conventions were often held as much as a year prior to the election because transportation was so difficult. For this same reason, they were usually held in centrally located cities. Baltimore held most of the early conventions, while Chicago became the most popular host after the Civil War.

Today, presidential primaries have made the conventions unnecessary for practical purposes. They exist primarily as a marketing tool and a political pep rally, where each party puts on a well-choreographed show. For more information on political conventions and related topics, check out the link below.

How Political Conventions Work


Probably the choice for the next convention site for DNC should hint at the direction many American cities could follow.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

I vote for New Madrid (Seismic Zone) because it is an apt choice for the next national convention.


[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

I do not want to get in trouble with the strict gun control in NYC so the best that I can do is to shoot the breeze. Damn, damn Bloomberg.

[-] 1 points by ThomasKent (131) 7 years ago

Mayor Bloomberg was elected 3 times despite a dismal record. This can be attributed to a high level apathy among voters who didn’t care enough to go to the polls to vote him out of office.

Mayor Bloomberg was elected 3 times


[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Bloomberg's strict gun control in NYC keeps me from shooting my "self in the fuking head" as ZenDog wanted me to, as stated in his comment above. Instead "shooting the breeze" lets me share the innards of my "fuking head" with the world. As far as keeping my head intact is concerned, Bloomberg has an outstanding record up to now.

In some cases, voter apathy simply means that the voters are complacent and comfortable enough about the outcome of an election that they don't bother to vote.

[-] 1 points by turbocharger (1756) 7 years ago

Great crowd here these days, eh? lol

The above message is brought to you by a self described Obama 2012 phone banker. A good insight into why campaigning is so tough. I mean, what do you do with loons like that? Put em on a phone and forget about em I guess, hope they can control themselves haha.

Can you imagine getting a phone call from that freak! You tell him you would never vote for Obama and that is the answer you get! lololol.

(campaign manager) Um, I'm sorry sir we are going to have to move you to envelope licking duty for the rest of the season, ok? Thaaaaaanks.

Shortly after that, all you see in the corner is a bunch of slobber and fur flying around mixed with growls and grunts resembling something about repelling things or something hahhahaha.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Here is my integrated interpretation of the first two amendments of the Bill of Rights of the Constitution. Be it freedom of religion, speech, press, association, or bearing arms in service of a state, it comes out of the barrel of a gun. There goes the linchpin of all freedoms, the ultimate antidote to all tyrannies. Does the shot that was heard around the world still reverberate after centuries?

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

Does the shot that was heard around the world still reverberate after centuries?

Yep - with a lingering metallic aftertaste in the mouths of the tyrants - as they discover - once again - that it is not a good idea to oppress the population.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

That's right, "shoot the breeze" followed by "bite the bullet." It satisfies Geneva Conventions and makes perfect sense to me.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

AHhhhh but you see - the Geneva conventions were not meant to protect you and I - they were meant to protect TPTB "from" you and I - least ways that is how it seems to have gone "after" the Nuremberg trials. More so as time has passed.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

In my people, I believe. Nuremberg is a bit far but its spirit lives on. Let us have a New York trial by the people instead.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

Let us have a New York trial by the people instead.

The sooner the better - the people must prevail if we are to see any change for the better in this country and around the world.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Write up the charges and crash them to the DNC party if it comes to NY.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

moi ?

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

There was a riot (by the police) outside of the DNC in Chicago under Daley. New York cannot be satisfied for being a no-namer, can it? Yes, "moi" helps.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

[-] 1 points by grapes (2763) 9 hours ago

I see - l'll look up ACLU but what do you propose as the charges? Just mull over it.

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

There is an obvious starting point:


Crimes against humanity ( those to be charged could be many )

Democide Example = https://occupywallst.org/forum/the-both-sides-are-awful-dismissal-of-gaza-ignores/#comment-1039151

then there is also:




Aiding & Abetting

Take your pick - mix and match - from wars ( of terror ) to economic meltdown to misappropriation of public funds to to to to to to to

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Where have all the flowers gone?

These are legitimate questions for the powers that be: Where is the cheapest vegetable I can buy? Where is the job for junior freshly graduated from college? Is Verizon messing with my bill again? When will the government clerk not be grumpy serving their master, me?

Do people realize that the federal-reserve-corporate-government applies pressure to tighten the vice?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

[-] 0 points by grapes (2770) 1 hour ago

Where have all the flowers gone?

These are legitimate questions for the powers that be: Where is the cheapest vegetable I can buy? Where is the job for junior freshly graduated from college? Is Verizon messing with my bill again? When will the government clerk not be grumpy serving their master, me?

Do people realize that the federal-reserve-corporate-government applies pressure to tighten the vice?

↥twinkle ↧stinkle permalink

" Do people realize that the federal-reserve-corporate-government applies pressure to tighten the vice? "

Short answer = YES

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

I'm in Minnesota - I don't think I will be in New York for the DNC. One would think that the ACLU could be a productive help.

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

I see - l'll look up ACLU but what do you propose as the charges? Just mull over it.

[+] -5 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

My guess is that you would be more at home in Vassar.

Home of Timothy McViegh.


So pack up your guns and hit the road.

Unless you're already there.

[-] 3 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Nah, let ZenDog join them instead. I cannot dispense cranberries like he can.

I support a path to U.S. citizenship for the illegal juveniles under the jurisdiction of New York City. It takes federal action as well as local action but it can be done. Just to remind you, NYC is my backyard so I do NOT count myself as a part of the not-in-my-own-backyard crowd. Once we have figured out how to arrange for things, welcome to my backyard, children! Someday perhaps you too will join the big party in town, the DNC. How about the one for Chelsea, 2020?

[+] -7 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago


No, not really. It's you who wants to "seal the border", just like those gun runners that met in Vassar to protest 120 kids that aren't even there yet.

I think you would be very comfortable there, judging by your comments on the subject.

Those guys even want to mine the border.

Cheaper than a fence I guess.

[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Have you assessed the scope of the "refugee" problem yet? Some people claim 14th Amendment rights to citizenship for these children although they were NOT born or naturalized under U.S. jurisdiction, not satisfying the premise of the 14th Amendment. How many people around the world will quote our Constitution without bothering to understand what it says?

I have the sense to know that we got ourselves into a very deep crevasse that is potentially Billions of people deep so the first thing to do is to slow the flow of the glacial melt. Attempts to seal the border will cool people's heads down to think more rationally about climbing out of the crevasse so it makes sense as a rearguard action. Dealing with the children ALREADY here is another step that must be taken. If many tens of thousands of children or their parents every year can believe the erroneous rumors of the smugglers, it is possible that there could be far more coming in an avalanche.

Simply put, if a water pipe bursts, shut off a valve to stop the gushing water first. Then mop up the water already here.

[-] -3 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

Children as water.

Interesting concept.

You would be right at home in Vassar.

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Not just children, we are ALL bags of water if you truly understand physiology. In addition, metaphors are the foundation of abstract thoughts, automorphisms of our reality, so get on with it for insights and enlightenment.

[-] -1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

Abstract away.

I'm still working on how your concept of children as water will stem global warming and stop the melting of the glaciers.

Will it work for hurricanes and typhoons too?

[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Children are snowflakes that fall on my car window. Each one is crystalline, hexagonally symmetric, and uniquely beautiful. Enough of them in pristine condition will reflect sunlight away to stem global warming and stop the melting of the glaciers.

It will work for hurricanes and typhoons, too. Cooling takes away their power.

The Bible had Eve becoming pregnant with child after having eaten the Forbidden Fruit. The child was a seed from the Tree of Life next to the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil from which the Forbidden Fruit came. The punishment was the very big brain that made childbirth difficult but required for knowledge. BOTH trees were planted FOR Adam and Eve.


[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Where did you get the idea that I want to mine the border or shoot them? No, there is NO job-creation program, sorry, people.

Come to think of it again, perhaps the U.S. can set up a military intelligence training academy near the border and have the gun-savvy folks help the children with guns so they can grow up to take back their countries. They will probably work out better than native-born U.S. citizens because they know the languages, culture, and can blend in easier.

The Bible had the story of Joseph who was sold into slavery to Egypt. Sometimes, all one needs is the aegis for a time and a time and a half.


[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Think about the most unlikely scenarios because breakthroughs come from them. For example, hold the DNC-2016 in Detroit to stimulate its economy. People who have their water cut off can have a venue to show their discontent. The militia movement can have their show of force, too.


[-] 2 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Do you realize by now that it is no longer the so-called white trash, black trash, brown trash, yellow trash, Latino trash, African trash, or Asian trash at issue any more? It is that almost ALL of us are considered as trash and treated as such by the Eelites.

Vassar and Detroit, what is the difference? Both are in the Great Lake State of Michigan, which the Eelites think of as a gigantic douche bag anyway, disposable before and after being used.

At least Detroit is easier for the Vassar folks to get to - much more environmentally correct.


[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

Oil pipelines run through Michigan and they leak. Ask about how the spill(s) are being "cleaned" up. Douching helps, right?

Why did Detroit have such population decline? It was due to the demise of the auto industry. Why did it die? The eelites won in globalization without compensation. They stopped gas mileage improvements to maximize profits. They cranked out shoddy cars.

Ask why foreign companies can produce highly reliable cars with high gas mileages with U.S. workers but U.S. companies could not. It is the company Culture imposed by stupid management and the disgusting Eelites! Did I make myself clear or should I bring in Confucius to help?


[-] 1 points by grapes (5232) 7 years ago

New York City does not have the population decline problem of Detroit because we have many new immigrants. Many left to join mainstream America but they were replenished. The same can be said of the U.S. Controlled growth of the population supports the infrastructures. The number-one largest economy in the world belongs to the U.S. The number-one largest economy city in the U.S. is New York City. Both achieved their status on the backs of immigrants. Immigrants are new blood for the economy as long as they are properly integrated.

Children crossing our southern border can become new blood for New York City and the U.S. Wherever there is the new generation, there is maintenance, renewal, or new growth of the economy, infrastructures, ideas, wealth, knowledge, etc. Some effects are not so positive so "controlled" becomes a key word.

As for why Confucius was important, the reliable cars produced by U.S. workers were produced under foreign-styled management principally influenced by Confucian philosophy. The number-one modern city that had risen to modernity from poverty in Asia is Singapore. Confucian philosophy guided its government's strict and non-corrupt practices.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

So sad - all of the wall-off the borders fanatics - one wonders how much less expensive OVERALL = lives and jobs ( un-needed = jobs - not lives ) wasted - were not wasted if peace and prosperity were exports rather than hypocritical ideals and weapons to support such.

[+] -7 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

Peace and prosperity?

Isn't that what the Koch's claim they are promoting with ALEC, AFP the SPN and others?

Why, yes, as a matter of fact, it is.

Wasn't someone just the other day, calling for the naming of names?

In fact it was one of the many claimed iterations of Trashy.

Yet he never on ANY of his iterations, ever called out the brothers Koch.

In fact he has always been one the driving forces attacking ME for doing so.

[-] 0 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

Trashy has always been a voice of misinformation a voice of delusion.

[+] -7 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

His bot's already voted me down for saying so.............:)

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

not to worry - it's not like anyone takes "it" seriously.

[+] -6 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

I'll find some more Koch news soon........:)

Need more ALEC though, not much reporting on them lately.

If you could use a laugh, here's some Bible stories for young corporations.


[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

Thanks - but - some of that humor - just makes me wanna tear out my hair and howl. Though - in turn about is fair play - you should check out this one: https://occupywallst.org/forum/impeach-obama-is-there-a-good-case-for-it-hell-yes/

[-] -3 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

I read it earlier, but wasn't home most of the day.

Since we couldn't get rid of Bush, and Cheney is still shooting his mouth off all over the place ( I wish he would do so, literally), what are the chances?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

Maybe his banker buddy will have an unexpected moment of turn about karma?

Check out the vids - they were pretty good.


[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

It isn't really fair to say American consumer demand - as it is to say - American Corp(se)oRATion Greedy basis of operation.


[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (33802) from Coon Rapids, MN 7 years ago

Think how much more serene and pastoral a life would be available to all with a legal marijuana stance.

[+] -7 points by shoozTroll (17632) 7 years ago

Theses aren't sane people, we're talking about. It's the town that produced Timothy McViegh.


[-] 1 points by ThomasKent (131) 7 years ago

The Best Place to Raise a Family – Des Moines, IA


America's Greenest City – Portland, OR


America's Healthiest City - Richmond, VA


America's Most Livable City - Pittsburgh, PA


American City with Highest Educational Attainment - Washington DC Metro Area


The American City with Highest Quality of Life Index - Denver, CO


TheAmerican City with Highest Mercer Ranking -Honolulu, HI


The Mercer Quality of Living Survey ranks 221 cities from Vienna to Baghdad on quality of life.

In 2010, Vienna won the title as the highest ranked city, followed by Zurich (2), Geneva (3), jointly Vancouver (4) and Auckland (4), and Düsseldorf (5). Vienna was again the highest ranked city in 2011, followed by Zurich (2), Auckland (3), Munich (4) and jointly Düsseldorf (5) and Vancouver (5). The quality of living survey is conducted to help governments and major companies place employees on international assignments.

The survey also identifies those cities with the highest personal safety ranking based upon internal stability, crime, effectiveness of law enforcement and relationships with other countries. In this case, Luxembourg is top, followed by Bern, Helsinki and Zurich, all equally placed at number 2.

The survey traditionally shows a strong dominance of German speaking cities in its top ranks.


The cities — 221 in total — were evaluated on 39 factors including political, economic, environmental, personal safety, health, education, transportation and other public service factors. Cities were compared to New York City which was given a base score of 100.


[-] 1 points by JackHall (413) 7 years ago

John Kucsera and Gary Orfield, the UCLA’s Civil Rights Project report’s authors, found that New York State has the nation’s most segregated public schools—dubiously led by the demographic patterns in New York City’s schools. They found that “over 90 percent of black students in the New York metro attended majority-minority schools—those with 50% or greater minority students.” Perhaps even more telling, around three-quarters of these students attended schools with student bodies that were at or above 90 percent minority students.

Skirting the question of whether academic performance can be improved without increasing integration, Kucsera and Orfield frame much of the report’s analysis in terms of school choice. As a result, many news outlets have focused on its findings on charter schools. They found that “100% of the Bronx charters, 90% of those in Brooklyn, and 97% of the Manhattan charters were intensely segregated.”

But that seems like a distraction. After all, critics never tire of noting that charters only serve a miniscule portion of NYC’s students—just 6 percent (and only 3 percent statewide). New York charters simply aren’t big enough to be the primary sources of segregation in state or city schools.

Kucsera and Orfield’s report puts choice on center stage in part because mandatory efforts to force integration—such as busing—are unlikely to gain political traction today. As a result, they suggest new desegregation efforts that link “choice” with “key civil rights standards, such as strong public information and outreach, free transportation, serious planning and training for successful diversity, authentic educational options worth choosing, and no admissions screening.”

Even if racially homogeneous charters are providing African-American and Latino students in many of these neighborhoods with a better educational option than their alternative, the fact of their racial segregation can’t be ignored. The value of desegregation doesn’t solely lie in its connections to academic equity; it’s a civic value worth promoting and protecting under any circumstances.

Why NY Public Schools are segregated